"Israel, Similar to Apartheid": Ekos Canada Poll

[southpaw]

There should be no artificial effort to preserve ethnic majorities of any kind, in any country through any sort of preferential immigration policy that is either restrictive or permissive for that matter. Race, religion etc in short, should not and do not have any bearing on citizenship.

Tell that to Israel. And while you're at it, to Japan, Korea, China, India, Pakistan, Turkey, Saudi, Kuwait, UAE ...

 

[southpaw]

Some of those countries are developing, so they are not countries you are immigrating to. But no one is stopping anyone. Anyone can always move to any of those countries. Israel excluded.

You can't get citizenship in those Arab countries. Japan and South Korea take few to no refugees. Pakistan was founded as a state for muslims. China locks up it's ethnic Uighers. India is run by Hindu Nationalists.

I could go on ...

 

[toguy5252]

It should be doable if Israel wasn't an ethnostate.

NEVER.

 

[toguy5252]

A one-state solution is certainly doable if the power players want it. The Israeli government doesn't want it and that's the only reason it hasn't happened.

NEVER. Isreal does not want it and it will never happen.

 

[toguy5252]

So you admit it's Israel's fault? They are to blame.

No I repeat that unreal is a sovereign state which like every other state has a right to define itself. Just the the Palestinians would have had they accepted that reality 60 years ago. That will not change in the next 60 years so they can chase a dream which is veing fed to them by their leaders or open their eyes and deal with reality. The Palestinians have suffered because people like you keep feeding that dream.

 

[Butler1000]

You mean Israel should be an ethnostate?

Um. It was created as such after the Holocaust. That's its purpose. And considering it's contributions to science and medicine. Its greening of the desert, It can stay that way imo.

The Palestinians are becoming less relevant as time passes. Once Saudi Arabia signs new trade treaties the other Muslim states will start to follow. And it will be over. The aid will dry up. And the residents will splinter off into various nations.

 

[Frankfooter]

You and others keep making this point but I really have no idea why. There will NEVER be a one state solution. Diplomacy is the art of the doable and a one state solution Is not doable. When Palestinians accept this reality ther will be a chance for some resolution. Until then it will be status quo. Palestinian leaders have e been giving their people false hope for way too long. Sad.

The one state apartheid solution is already here.
There is no state of Palestine and zero chance of one happening.

So there is only apartheid Israel.

Apartheid

The Israeli regime enacts in all the territory it controls (Israeli sovereign territory, East Jerusalem, the West Bank, and the Gaza Strip) an apartheid regime. One organizing principle lies at the base of a wide array of Israeli policies: advancing and perpetuating the supremacy of one group –...

www.btselem.org

 

[Frankfooter]

The Palestinians are becoming less relevant as time passes. Once Saudi Arabia signs new trade treaties the other Muslim states will start to follow. And it will be over. The aid will dry up. And the residents will splinter off into various nations.

There are 5 million Palestinian refugees already living in the countries bordering Israel.

 

[toguy5252]

Palestinian sovereignty has never been respected and Israel has never honored land agreements and always made illegal settlements. No State has a right to be an ethnostate and oppress others. That makes Israel an illegitimate State. Palestinians suffer because people like yourself keep defending Israeli atrocities.

Maybe we should kick you out of your house and tell you to deal with that reality.

We will likely never agree on the historical record so continued debate is really pointless.

Having said that 2 points.

There are many legitimate issues involving Isreal including borders, the settlements etc. But there is a difference between taking issuevwith certain policies of Isreal and the right of Isreal to exist. When the starting point of any discussion is the right if Isreal to exist or it legitimacy there is really not a lot to discuss.

Whether or not you accept the right of Isreal to exist and/or its legitimacy the fact is that it does exist and will continue to and there will never be a one state solution.

 

[Klatuu]

No I repeat that unreal is a sovereign state which like every other state has a right to define itself. Just the the Palestinians would have had they accepted that reality 60 years ago. That will not change in the next 60 years so they can chase a dream which is veing fed to them by their leaders or open their eyes and deal with reality. The Palestinians have suffered because people like you keep feeding that dream.

The pathetic bleating of a frustrated but dyed in wool anti Palestinian racist

 

[Butler1000]

This guy is unironically defending the idea of an ethnostate and referring to the majority native population as "less relevant." People like this cannot be reasoned with. Hitler would be proud.

Nazi's also made some nice scientific and medical advancements. You can do a lot when you don't give a fuck about ethics.

Not to mention this analysis makes no sense whatsoever. Saudi Arabia signing trade treaties has diddly squat to do with them sending aid to Palestine, all aid to Palestine gets sent in only through Israeli approval anyway. Also, other Muslim State's positions on Palestine or Palestine's fate itself has nothing to do with Saudi trade agreements. And the idea that Palestinians would simply fracture into multiple nations within Israel's borders, as if that's something Israel would even allow. Everything you've said is nonsensical and non sequitur; betraying a childlike level of geopolitical comprehension.

Its not difficult. Nazis did Holocaust. Israel created to prevent it from happening again. Muslims tried to kill the Jews, got there asses handed to them repeatedly. Palestinians became pawns to appease street Muslims in Dictatorships as a distraction. USA continued to gain influence in the region. Both for oil and to appease the evangelicals in the USA, as well as the Jews there. Israel is a client state of the USA. So is Saudi Arabia to a degree.

Now we have a situation where the House of Saud wants to move the nation off oil gradually. And to do this, they need to slowly become more peaceful and secular. For better acceptance to the World economy. With them other nations in the region will follow suit.

And the Palestinians are now being left behind as a liability and not an asset. By the other Muslims in the region.

Given time Israel will continue to expand, the Palestinians will disporia to other nations, and any opposition will be weak and ineffective.

Seriously after 70+ years playing the victim card people really don't care. Numerous chances at peace and prosperity squandered in the name of a medieval religious cult created by an illiterate warlord. Do you really think they will win this?

 

[Butler1000]

Palestinian sovereignty has never been respected and Israel has never honored land agreements and always made illegal settlements. No State has a right to be an ethnostate and oppress others. That makes Israel an illegitimate State. Palestinians suffer because people like yourself keep defending Israeli atrocities.

Maybe we should kick you out of your house and tell you to deal with that reality.

Palestinians suffer because of a terrorist leadership that kills any peaceful opposition within its own ranks. They take aid to make missiles as opposed to creating prosperity. Why hegotiate eith soneone who vows to kill you?

 

[Klatuu]

Its not difficult. Nazis did Holocaust. Israel created to prevent it from happening again. Muslims tried to kill the Jews, got there asses handed to them repeatedly. Palestinians became pawns to appease street Muslims in Dictatorships as a distraction. USA continued to gain influence in the region. Both for oil and to appease the evangelicals in the USA, as well as the Jews there. Israel is a client state of the USA. So is Saudi Arabia to a degree.

Now we have a situation where the House of Saud wants to move the nation off oil gradually. And to do this, they need to slowly become more peaceful and secular. For better acceptance to the World economy. With them other nations in the region will follow suit.

And the Palestinians are now being left behind as a liability and not an asset. By the other Muslims in the region.

Given time Israel will continue to expand, the Palestinians will disporia to other nations, and any opposition will be weak and ineffective.

Seriously after 70+ years playing the victim card people really don't care. Numerous chances at peace and prosperity squandered in the name of a medieval religious cult created by an illiterate warlord. Do you really think they will win this?

Bigots. They just love to double down on stupid.

 

[Butler1000]

Who says people don't care? You? Lol. And yeah sure bro. Israelis will wake up one day to suddenly find that a 75 year old raging conflict has abruptly ended.

But thanks for atleast admitting that Israel aims to expand and ethnically cleanse Palestinians.

They don't care. No western govt cares. China Russia, India, no African Nation, no South or Central American nation, so Asian nation. They pretty much have Syria, Iran, and a few factions within a few other non players. Thats it. And mostly lip service coupled with enough humanitarian aid to feed them.

Next peace deal with Saudis is already being brokered. And realistically there is no raging conflict, is their? Just occasional flare ups from a frustrated population of indoctrinated souls who haven't figured out they already lost.

The Palestinians had the chance numerous times at peace and prosperity. And turned it down. So the world and Irael is moving on now. We have better things to do.

 

[Butler1000]

Nazi's wanted an ethnostate, so to show the world how different they are, Zionists did the same. Everything else you said in this paragraph is irrelevant and has no connection to anything. You just tried to fill space.

Saudi Arabia weaning itself off oil has literally zero connection to being more peaceful. If anything, Saudi Arabia is LESS peaceful under MBS. They bombed the shit out of Yemen when Saudi Arabia hadn't been involved in a war for decades prior to that. MBS government was also involved in the escalation of the Qatar diplomatic crisis, the 2017 detention of Lebanese prime minister Saad Hariri, a 2018 diplomatic spat with Canada, the arrest of Saudi princes and billionaires in 2017, the 2018–2019 Saudi crackdown on feminists, an alleged phone hack against Amazon chairman Jeff Bezos in 2019. By what logic is Saudi Arabia moving towards being more peaceful? You just spout off nonsense without any knowledge of political affairs.

Also even if that were the case, BY WHAT LOGIC would the other Arab State's follow Saudi's lead? You think other Arab countries get along with Saudi? LOL! You don't know anything.

Other Muslim States haven't done shit to help Palestine since the war of 1948 so nothing has changed there. And there has never been a chance for peace and prosperity. Israel has never offered the Palestinians a fair deal, and even when they accepted bad deals, Israel never honored them and has been continually, illegally, encroaching on Palestinian land for the last 50+ years.

What I think is that nothing will change until Israel embraces a one-state solution. Until then the fighting and killing and oppressing will continue until maybe someday a foreign power invades Israel for whatever reason.

The only thing that will happen what I said. The world moving on. No ones cares enough with enough power to do anything about it.

 

[Butler1000]

Bigots. They just love to double down on stupid.

On this case I tell the truth. You just can't accept the cause is lost.

 

[Butler1000]

Lmao! Terrorist leadership? Is that what it's called when you fight off an invader? Israel are the terrorists. They literally attack and kill innocent civilians for no reason like they did just recently at the mosque's. Palestine doesn't get any aid to make missiles, they only get food. You think Israel would let in any aid that can be used to make weapons? You clearly know nothing about the situation.

Trying to kill them? Israel has killed a far higher percentage of Palestinians than Palestinians have killed Jews. Israel attacks unprovoked more often than Palestine. Israel response to provocation is always disproportionate. Israel is one of the worst Human RIght's offenders on the planet.

You are only stating the obvious that Israel is far more competent then the Palestinians leadership. And yes that includes now cutting off their weapon making and smuggling operations. So sad. Oh well.

I've picked my side. Israel has proven to be a net positive contributer to the world. The Palestinians a net drain and continueing negative to it. I'm sure the little people want to be but ao long as the terrorists run the show that's what the world sees.

 

[Butler1000]

And you'd be proven sorely wrong. Whatever makes you think the world will just move on and the war will just fizzle out. Its the dumbest take I have heard regarding a very serious conflict.

What conflict? Rock throwing? A few attempted homemade missile strikes? This is nothing more than a gradual mirror of what happened to the Tamil Tigers. You think some college students ranting will change USA policy and funding? EU support?

Keep living in that delusion.....

 

[Butler1000]

Competent? LOL! Israel couldn't do shit without billions of dollars in funding and weapons from USA and Europe.

Yeah I know what side you picked, the same one as the Brown Shirts in 1939

Yup. But that have it. And are winning. Or you wouldn't be bitching.

 

[Butler1000]

The western world or infact much of the world not doing anything about Palestine is nothing new. So I don't even think the world caring has anything to do with it.

But Israel, wont be able to just move on. I dont even know what that means. Stop dealing with Palestine? Stop talking about them? Stop caring about missiles being launched by Hamas?

A major part of their everyday existence is dealing with the Palestine issue, so there is no way that they are going to be able to just move on. And if they aren't able to move on, you bet your ass the world isn't moving on what with their influence in the US govt.

Maybe not in my lifetime. But its happening. Israel will continue its gradual expansion to support its growing population and the world wll let it happen. The Palestinians will gradually end up in other nations, with a few assimilated who are peaceful.