Grooming children with clothing - Your thoughts?

[John_Jacob]

@mandrill
What's bad and unhealthy about a room full of gay men laughing at a gay man dressed as a lady?... Sounds pretty cheery to me.
Agreed, the comment was more about why the push back against Drag Shows. Personally (surprise!), I think it's the extremist (for, say 90% of TiMs just want to live their life) Trans-identified-Men causing all the shit and absolutely ruining it for the gay men....

You've got to be looking pretty hard for things to get angry about to pick on that one.
These days of the internet and everything being posted? Nah..don't have to look hard...two second search...looks a little inappropriate and he should have moved her hand aside but didn't.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1594421492736876544

Little girls dressed in tight, short dresses dancing provocatively is creepy in our culture where young people are not supposed to be sexualized for the amusement of adults.
ya, not my culture. I figure that's deep south US - but not to stereotype groups of people merely to score SM points, that would be rude right?

 

[Not getting younger]

Yes, but What I'm saying is evolution and change can kill you. It's not always a good thing.

Evolution does not always mean positive.

Maybe.

I’ve lived a long life. Have experienced a lot of stuff. That’s changed me. Personally think I’m better for it. Regardless I’ve learned a thing or 3 over those years.

1) the only constant in life…..is change
2) the vast majority of people are afraid of change.

take that for what it’s worth. But you can actually take that to the bank.

 

[Knuckle Ball]

How did evolution work out for the dinosaurs?

But everyone can have a different view. IT's OK.

Transgendered people have existed since ancient times. Evolution has not led to their extinction.

It is the view of transgendered people as mentally ill, criminal, pedophiles that is being naturally selected out in human evolution.

 

[John_Jacob]

Jeez, so you get it! But I don't think there are 1000's of shows.

Absolutely no idea, tried to search to see if this is being tracked but couldn't find anything. In GTA alone, I'm totally guessing with no data, say, 10 a week. Multiply that across North America and 1,000s comes pretty quick.

 

[PHS C1000]

Maybe.

I’ve lived a long life. Have experienced a lot of stuff. That’s changed me. Personally think I’m better for it. Regardless I’ve learned a thing or 3 over those years.

1) the only constant in life…..is change
2) the vast majority of people are afraid of change.

take that for what it’s worth. But you can actually take that to the bank.

No one is doubting change can happen.

But what change? All change isn't good change.

 

[mandrill]

If that's how you feel then, feel free.
Well we can disagree.

Pride back in the 80's was originally not about gender. It was about being gay.

Last time I checked, it was still about being gay. Explain how it's not at present?

 

[PHS C1000]

Transgendered people have existed since ancient times. Evolution has not led to their extinction.

It is the view of transgendered people as mentally ill, criminal, pedophiles that is being naturally selected out in human evolution.

How ironic the one thing they wish they could change the most can't happen.

They can exist.

 

[PHS C1000]

Last time I checked, it was still about being gay. Explain how it's not at present?

That's your opinion.

 

[John_Jacob]

@Knuckle Ball
Probably true…but that’s because this whole issue is being driven by people who want to stir up hate against the trans community. The bizarre, off the wall stories are the only ones that serve their political interest so they barrage social media platforms with this stuff.

Drag has been traditionally a gay man thing and has been that way forever. You bring up a good point by stating, "who want to stir up hate against the trans community" because you think Drag is a trans-thing. Drag has not been and should not be a trans thing and it's typical that you rightly believe that this hatred is being driven by the actions of a few extremist trans-identified men.



Here on terb, it’s the same people who used to post obsessively about Muslims doing bad things- every time a Muslim got a speeding ticket or jay walked there were breathless, pearl-clutching threads about how Muslims could not be assimilated into Western culture, No Go neighbourhoods that were ruled by Sharia Law, etc, etc,…. The mods here on terb, and most other mainstream social media platforms don’t allow islamophobic posting anymore so now they attack the trans community.

90% of any population is perfectly normal and ok. For any group of people, there will 5% to 10% of extremists causing shit for the rest. There are neighborhoods in Europe ruled by Sharia law but hey, there were (are?) neighborhoods ruled by other ethnic groups (Mafia, Vietnamese, Chinese etc..) and these should be called out on occasion. I personally have no issue with calling out extreme behavior and it drives me batty when extreme behaviours are ignored or brushed aside because, long term, it only hurts the groups that these very 'kind' people are trying to help. Suppressing discussion and information one doesn't like is never a good long term strategy.


Obviously, it's unfortunate there ARE (many) morons who believe extreme behaviors represents the whole of the population and that of course is never true - face of the race and all that. They need to be called out as well. For really, you only need ~3.5% of a population to effect positive/negative change. It's two sides of the same coin, let that negative 3.5% get out of control and you're fucked.

It may only take 3.5% of the population to topple a dictator – with civil resistance | Erica Chenoweth

The United States has a rich history with effective uses of nonviolent resistance. It’s time to become familiar with it

www.theguardian.com

Carr Center for Human Rights Policy

The Carr Center for Human Rights Policy serves as the hub of the Harvard Kennedy School’s research, teaching, and training in the human rights domain.

carrcenter.hks.harvard.edu

 

[Not getting younger]

No one is doubting change can happen.

But what change? All change isn't good change.

That I agree with. Not all is. We usually only know that with the benefit of hindsight. What we do almost always experience whether in our personal lives…I’ll use getting laid off as an example. Most people are scared shitless ( fearing change is why many won’t leave), they experience some growing pains…and in the end usually end up thinking they are better off for it.

Very present very real example.
Most of the world is scared shitless over climate change. Is it real. Yep. Are we accelerating it? Yep.

doesn’t matter. Whatever Armageddon you fear. It’s going to happen. It’s inevitable. Many will argue “but nature won’t adapt in time”.

BS, nature always adapts. Always has, always will. True, what lives and grows here today, may not in the future. But something else will.

I do actually chuckle at just how afraid of change people are. Sure there will be growing pains. But what the F are we so afraid of….

that’s a different topic, so let’s not. Just to illustrate it.

 

[PHS C1000]

A few points on the girl clothing part.

1. 99% of girl clothing is bought by the mother. So maybe we should ask why they are buying the clothing.
2. Certain clothes can be feminine, but it doesn't mean it is sexual.
3. The situation posed undermines the sexualization of little boys. It was dismissed when a boy wears a tank top it's not as bad as , but young boys can be targets too.
4. I think most men will agree that female clothing today is too provocative. I would overall agree toning it down.

 

[Jenesis]

Yes, but What I'm saying is evolution and change can kill you. It's not always a good thing.

Evolution does not always mean positive.

The dinosaurs were killed by a fucking asteroid dude. That is not the definition of evolution.

Compares apples to apples. Not apples to beef.

 

[rhuarc29]

Have you ever noticed that a tank top for a 3 year old boy as a wide band at the shoulders but a 3 year old girls tank top has a spaghetti straps. Spaghetti straps that will get her in trouble in high school for wearing the exact same thing. Just saying.

Boys shorts go down to their knees, girls shorts go to the bottom of their little butt cheeks.

So we’re is child grooming happening? We are teaching little girls to wear sexualizing clothing from a toddlers age. Why do girls clothing need to made in such way???? Are we not setting women up for disaster?

When I was a child, I never saw girls wearing tank tops with spaghetti straps and shorts high on the thigh. So yeah, that's not something we should be comfortable with. However, I think young girl fashion has always emulated older girl fashion, because that's what sells. And as adult women became more liberated in their manner of dress, that filtered down.

 

[Knuckle Ball]

How ironic the one thing they wish they could change the most can't happen.

They can exist.

So…if you believe in human evolution, the fact that trans people have existed in cultures around the world for thousands of years would suggest that there is in fact tangible benefit and survival value to societies in having trans members.

In fact, historians and anthropologists have described numerous cultures in which trans members have played revered and important roles such as priests, healers, etc.

Transgenderism in Ancient Cultures

A look at the evidence for transgenderism and gender non-conforming identities in ancient cultures by community member and weekly contributor Siobhan Donegan.

www.lgbthealth.org.uk

 

[John_Jacob]

Yes I did.

So vote. There is the don’t care option if you just want to see the results but it would be nice if you just actually voted.

Just to be that weenie, I think the definition of grooming you're using is incorrect. It should be, "without knowledge or consent of parents" and of course it doesn't need to be sexual. I'm forced to vote Pride since that's the closest to 'ideology or lifestyle;.



IF the parents are doing it, then it's just imparting parental wisdom & experience so it's all good. After all, Parental Rights are paramount....

 

[Knuckle Ball]

@Knuckle Ball
…

There are neighborhoods in Europe ruled by Sharia law…

Not true. This is an islamophobic conspiracy theory that has been debunked countless times.

Factsheet: No-Go Zone Conspiracy Theory - Bridge Initiative

The “no-go zone” is an ant-Muslim conspiracy theory claiming there are areas in Europe and the U.S. with dense Muslim populations that are governed by Sharia law and where police and non-residents are barred from entry. Although it has been debunked by European police officials and news...

bridge.georgetown.edu

 

[Jenesis]

Just to be that weenie, I think the definition of grooming you're using is incorrect. It should be, "without knowledge or consent of parents" and of course it doesn't need to be sexual. I'm forced to vote Pride since that's the closest to 'ideology or lifestyle;.

View attachment 245647

IF the parents are doing it, then it's just imparting parental wisdom & experience so it's all good. After all, Parental Rights are paramount....

No. I think I am using it right. People say drag reading hour is grooming children and parents still bring them. If anything, your definition shows that drag reading hour is NOT grooming.

I think the girls clothing can fit under that definition because when you limit the options of a parent, you limit their “consent”. Variety, availability, cost, etc all play. And society has become so accepting of it that the argument can be made that parents are actually brain washed into believe it is ok.

Remember - I just posted on the amount of available long shorts for girls. There are none. That is not giving a parent a real choice.

 

[squeezer]

Remember - I just posted on the amount of available long shorts for girls. There are none. That is not giving a parent a real choice.

Verify Your Identity

www.walmart.ca

Verify Your Identity

www.walmart.ca

George Girls' Denim Short | Walmart Canada
George Girls' Wide Leg Bermuda Short | Walmart Canada

Just a few samples! It is up to the parents to decide and if they want to choose longer shorts, the options are there in my opinion.

 

[Jenesis]

Verify Your Identity

www.walmart.ca

Verify Your Identity

www.walmart.ca

George Girls' Denim Short | Walmart Canada
George Girls' Wide Leg Bermuda Short | Walmart Canada

Just a few samples! It is up to the parents to decide and if they want to choose longer shorts, the options are there in my opinion.

Availability????? There were none of those there. Maybe only sold online???? Maybe parents can’t afford delivery fees??? Plenty of reasons that parents can be limited in purchasing control.

I’m not excusing parents. I didn’t buy my daughter a two piece. Her first two piece was when she was mid 20s. So I get it. But at the same time …. Options, from what I personally saw in the Ottawa Walmart were short shorts only. And I looked. I really did. I compared boys and girls, counted tank tops, etc. Like I really tried to find good clothing options.

 

[squeezer]

Availability????? There were none of those there. Maybe only sold online???? Maybe parents can’t afford delivery fees??? Plenty of reasons that parents can be limited in purchasing control.

I’m excusing parents. I didn’t buy my daughter a two piece. Her first two piece was when she was mid 20s. So I get it. But at the same time …. Options, from what I personally saw in the Ottawa Walmart were short shorts only. And I looked. I really did. I compared boys and girls, counted tank tops, etc. Like I really tried to find good clothing options.

Ok, let's eliminate delivery fees although I believe Walmart if you sign up as a member and spend over $30 the fee is peanuts but let's go where most are free delivery with Amazon and most folks now have Amazon

Simple Joys by Carter's Baby and Toddler Girls' 3-Pack Bike Shorts : Amazon.ca: Clothing, Shoes & Accessories

IBAKOM Girls Long Sleeve Swimsuits UPF 50+ Sun Protection Two Piece Rash Guard Sets Toddler Floral Print Bathing Suit : Amazon.ca: Clothing, Shoes & Accessories

storeofbaby Girls Kids Summer T-Shirt and Shorts Set Casual Matching Outfits 4-13 Years : Amazon.ca: Clothing, Shoes & Accessories

this within a one minute search. If a parent can't find clothing that isn't too revealing for a child, it's the parent at fault.

In the meantime, the older young ladies, over 18 I encourage to dress as sexy as possible, please and thank you.