Dr. Birx now says it was likely a lab leak

[basketcase]

No animals were found to have Covid-19 in the Wuhan wet markets, Lab workers were hospitalized as early as September 2020 in Wuhan with Covid-19 like symptoms.

Numerous animals species that were at the market have been found to be carrying the original covid strain. Sure makes the zoonotic hypothesis far more likely that some mysterious lab leak that happened only at the market. And sorry. The Chinese government's secrecy is absolutely noting new and therefore is hardly even a hint of evidence.

And again, you have claimed that China was manipulating the covid strain even though every study of the virus around the world has shown no evidence of manipulation.


The question I've seen asked of conspiracy theorists is what evidence would you need to change your belief. Is there anything that could happen here on out that would have you accept that zoonotic transfer is more likely.

 

[basketcase]

... Lab workers were hospitalized as early as September 2020 in Wuhan with Covid-19 like symptoms.

Should I ask for a source or is this just another thing China covered up so no one has any evidence but you somehow know about?

 

[basketcase]

When the ladies say, let's see it, let's see the evidence I tell them "I would but I can't because it is a secret weapon under contract to the Liberal government to use as a club on PeePee in the future election. You're just going to have to believe whatever I make up, errr, I mean say"

I tell them I'm only allowed to use 3 inches of it for national security reasons.

 

[jcpro]

This is where you are wrong but that's ok, I forgive you. I reserve judgment and will listen to the experts in their field unless and until there is real contradicting evidence as opposed to a laymen's/Fox Host/crooked politician's opinion.

no you don't. like all lefties, you first stick a wet finger in the air to see which way the wind's blowing. I opted out of "vaccines " when EVERYONE was, including the righties, going orgasmic about the great vaccine "breakthrough "- including Fox and even Trump. I use my judgment and experience, always. And now my judgment and experience tell me that China fucked up and unintentionally released it. Their reaction to covid, the cover up and lack of cooperation and our toadying media's refusal to ask questions only confirms it.

 

[squeezer]

no you don't. like all lefties, you first stick a wet finger in the air to see which way the wind's blowing. I opted out of "vaccines " when EVERYONE was, including the righties, going orgasmic about the great vaccine "breakthrough "- including Fox and even Trump. I use my judgment and experience, always. And now my judgment and experience tell me that China fucked up and unintentionally released it. Their reaction to covid, the cover up and lack of cooperation and our toadying media's refusal to ask questions only confirms it.

I opted into vaccines and I am glad I did because I traveled and was free to go anywhere I pleased. Furthermore, as soon as version 2.0 is available I will happily go in for my second booster. Your ilk just wants a boogyman to pin the virus on. If it were an accident, a lab leak which was completely accidental, what would it change? If it did happen, do you not believe China at this point would have measures in place to avoid it from happening again because it did seriously hurt their own bottom line no???

 

[jcpro]

I opted into vaccines and I am glad I did because I traveled and was free to go anywhere I pleased. Furthermore, as soon as version 2.0 is available I will happily go in for my second booster. Your ilk just wants a boogyman to pin the virus on. If it were an accident, a lab leak which was completely accidental, what would it change? If it did happen, do you not believe China at this point would have measures in place to avoid it from happening again because it did seriously hurt their own bottom line no???

What boogeyman??? Did I insist that you take it or not the treatment? It's your body, your choice, your life.

 

[lomotil]

Numerous animals species that were at the market have been found to be carrying the original covid strain. Sure makes the zoonotic hypothesis far more likely that some mysterious lab leak that happened only at the market. And sorry. The Chinese government's secrecy is absolutely noting new and therefore is hardly even a hint of evidence.

And again, you have claimed that China was manipulating the covid strain even though every study of the virus around the world has shown no evidence of manipulation.


The question I've seen asked of conspiracy theorists is what evidence would you need to change your belief. Is there anything that could happen here on out that would have you accept that zoonotic transfer is more likely.

Really, numerous animals were found to be carrying the “ original strain”??? China says that Covid-19 didn’t come from the Wuhan wet market. If numerous animals had the “original strain”, then why the hell would totalitarian China permit the re-opening of the Wuhan wet market during a raging pandemic where Covid-19 continues to mutate? The answer is because the PRC knows that Covid19 escaped from the Coronavirus studying, renowned Wuhan lab.

The evidence based science regarding the forensic origins of Covid-19 is wonderful but is not 100% and should be interpreted with the caveat that a large scale cover-up by the PRC and possibly other foreign actors occurred with deliberate destruction of data and the lack of cooperation with the international community. To this day, physicians in China know what their fate would be if they speak to the international community.

 

[basketcase]

Really, numerous animals were found to be carrying the “ original strain”???...

Yes. The studies have been posted several times. And If you read what I posted, I said the same species were found at that specific wet market. I did not say that covid was discovered in the ones at the market. And no one says it is 100% proof because that's not how science works but when all the tests of the genome show to be inconsistent with manipulation, it makes it the most probable conclusion.

You keep saying that China isn't trustworthy. Nothing new there but it doesn't form any kind of evidence.

Again, what evidence could we come up with that would get you to change your mind? If there is nothing that could change your mind then you put yourself clearly in the conspiracy kook crowd instead of the cynical science minded group.

p.s. You kept mentioning hospitalized lab workers. Workers in the covid section who were admitted to the hospital for a respiratory infection would form some sort of evidence so why don't you actually provide some sources?

 

[lomotil]

Yes. The studies have been posted several times. And If you read what I posted, I said the same species were found at that specific wet market. I did not say that covid was discovered in the ones at the market. And no one says it is 100% proof because that's not how science works but when all the tests of the genome show to be inconsistent with manipulation, it makes it the most probable conclusion.

You keep saying that China isn't trustworthy. Nothing new there but it doesn't form any kind of evidence.

Again, what evidence could we come up with that would get you to change your mind? If there is nothing that could change your mind then you put yourself clearly in the conspiracy kook crowd instead of the cynical science minded group.

p.s. You kept mentioning hospitalized lab workers. Workers in the covid section who were admitted to the hospital for a respiratory infection would form some sort of evidence so why don't you actually provide some sources?

https://www.wsj.com/articles/intell...b-fuels-debate-on-covid-19-origin-11621796228

Yes. The studies have been posted several times. And If you read what I posted, I said the same species were found at that specific wet market. I did not say that covid was discovered in the ones at the market. And no one says it is 100% proof because that's not how science works but when all the tests of the genome show to be inconsistent with manipulation, it makes it the most probable conclusion.

You keep saying that China isn't trustworthy. Nothing new there but it doesn't form any kind of evidence.

Again, what evidence could we come up with that would get you to change your mind? If there is nothing that could change your mind then you put yourself clearly in the conspiracy kook crowd instead of the cynical science minded group.

p.s. You kept mentioning hospitalized lab workers. Workers in the covid section who were admitted to the hospital for a respiratory infection would form some sort of evidence so why don't you actually provide some sources?

Bloom was probably correct….

https://www.science.org/content/art...v-2-sequences-stymie-origin-hunt-sparks-furor

 

[basketcase]

Nice try.

First off, China doesn't have a health care system like ours as their hospitals overlap with what we would consider as walk-in. If there was any evidence they were on a ventilator or other serious respiratory interventions, we'd have seen that explicitly. The report says they had symptoms which could have been consistent with covid but also completely consistent with regular seasonal illness. To me, the possibility that during flu season, a place with several hundred workers had a few people with flu-like symptoms is hardly shocking (not to mention that a lab with hundreds of workers, most of whom would never be in contact with any bat coronavirus samples.

Of course funnier is that you are happy to quote unnamed governmental intelligence sources while also acting if the government is lying about this all.


The other story is incomprehensible as that code has been easily accessible online this whole time.



And I notice you haven't said what evidence could possible change your opinion.

 

[lomotil]

Nice try.

First off, China doesn't have a health care system like ours as their hospitals overlap with what we would consider as walk-in. If there was any evidence they were on a ventilator or other serious respiratory interventions, we'd have seen that explicitly. The report says they had symptoms which could have been consistent with covid but also completely consistent with regular seasonal illness. To me, the possibility that during flu season, a place with several hundred workers had a few people with flu-like symptoms is hardly shocking (not to mention that a lab with hundreds of workers, most of whom would never be in contac

Nice try.

First off, China doesn't have a health care system like ours as their hospitals overlap with what we would consider as walk-in. If there was any evidence they were on a ventilator or other serious respiratory interventions, we'd have seen that explicitly. The report says they had symptoms which could have been consistent with covid but also completely consistent with regular seasonal illness. To me, the possibility that during flu season, a place with several hundred workers had a few people with flu-like symptoms is hardly shocking (not to mention that a lab with hundreds of workers, most of whom would never be in contact with any bat coronavirus samples.

Of course funnier is that you are happy to quote unnamed governmental intelligence sources while also acting if the government is lying about this all.


The other story is incomprehensible as that code has been easily accessible online this whole time.



And I notice you haven't said what evidence could possible change your opinion.

The reproduction of the evidence destroyed by the PRC regarding research at Wuhan might change



And I notice you haven't said what evidence could possible change your opinion

Nice try.

First off, China doesn't have a health care system like ours as their hospitals overlap with what we would consider as walk-in. If there was any evidence they were on a ventilator or other serious respiratory interventions, we'd have seen that explicitly. The report says they had symptoms which could have been consistent with covid but also completely consistent with regular seasonal illness. To me, the possibility that during flu season, a place with several hundred workers had a few people with flu-like symptoms is hardly shocking (not to mention that a lab with hundreds of workers, most of whom would never be in contact with any bat coronavirus samples.

Of course funnier is that you are happy to quote unnamed governmental intelligence sources while also acting if the government is lying about this all.


The other story is incomprehensible as that code has been easily accessible online this whole time.



And I notice you haven't said what evidence could possible change your opinion.

The reproduction of the evidence destroyed by the PRC at the Wuhan lab regarding Covid-19 might change my opinion.

Friends and colleagues originally from the PRC , now residing in the GTA who have travelled back and forth to China since the pandemic and who can speak relatively freely seem to agree with me and in some cases are much more critical of the PRC‘s culpability in this pandemic than I am.

The PRC will not provide any restitution or admission at this point, so the probable lab leak scenario is moot at this point as the pandemic rolls on.

And you continuing to be an apologist for the machinations of the PRC with respect to the Covid-19 lab leak in Wuhan will not change my opinion

 

[basketcase]

The reproduction of the evidence destroyed by the PRC at the Wuhan lab regarding Covid-19 might change my opinion.
...

So nothing then. Thanks for admitting your views are based on irrational beliefs instead of on evidence.


You also have this dumb idea that asking for evidence before making a scientific claim is somehow being a Chinese puppet. No rational person denies that a lab leak is a possibility but based on our evidence, it is a far less likely possibility.

But yes, it is completely unscientific to claim that China created/manipulated this covid strain as the evidence suggests the contrary.

 

[Valcazar]

The question I've seen asked of conspiracy theorists is what evidence would you need to change your belief. Is there anything that could happen here on out that would have you accept that zoonotic transfer is more likely.

Always a good question to ask.

 

[lomotil]

So nothing then. Thanks for admitting your views are based on irrational beliefs instead of on evidence.


You also have this dumb idea that asking for evidence before making a scientific claim is somehow being a Chinese puppet. No rational person denies that a lab leak is a possibility but based on our evidence, it is a far less likely possibility.

But yes, it is completely unscientific to claim that China created/manipulated this covid strain as the evidence suggests the contrary.

The previous and present actions of the PRC regarding Covid-19 and ample circumstantial enforce that a Wuhan lab leak occurred. The current flavour of the month “ zoonotic transfer” is part of a politically backed cover up which uses selected researchers as useful idiots and their findings are far too anemic when weighed against the sum of the evidence supporting the lab leak. The PRC through the Wuhan lab fucked up and continues to coverup their creation of Covid-19 and this devastating pandemic. Here is more evidence and it was Taiwan that had to initially press the WHO and not China.
You continue to conveniently ignore several uncanny coincidences in a comedy of obtuseness.
https://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwiOyMj2jvH5AhXaMEQIHUbCDe8QFnoECBEQAQ&url=https://www.rationaloptimist.com/blog/covid-lab-leak-in-taiwan/&usg=AOvVaw10y68RJc6RuikW-npYIkX5

https://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwiOyMj2jvH5AhXaMEQIHUbCDe8QFnoECAIQAQ&url=https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/4374287&usg=AOvVaw2gcYd48MXJ6bWN8TUW1me5

https://www.taipeitimes.com/News/editorials/archives/2022/02/11/2003772916

 

[Valcazar]

The current flavour of the month “ zoonotic transfer” is part of a politically backed cover up which uses selected researchers as useful idiots and their findings are far too anemic when weighed against the sum of the evidence supporting the lab leak.

"Lab leaks have occurred, therefore this was a lab leak" is not actually an overwhelming amount of evidence.

 

[lomotil]

"Lab leaks have occurred, therefore this was a lab leak" is not actually an overwhelming amount of evidence.

Certainly if the international community including the PRC actually bought the zoonotic transfer theory as the cause of Covid-19, then it follows that the wet markets would be closed permanently to mitigate the risk of another Coronavirus fueled pandemic don‘t you think ?
This pandemic has been extremely costly due to morbidity, mortality and economic carnage global.
What we see is a silly and deliberate obfuscation of what actually happened which is moot at this point and not really worth pursuing the cruxification of essential world supply chain of a nation full of mendacity, totalitarianism which has permanently destroyed their self incriminating evidence. The PRC doesn’t even believe their own bullshit so neither should you.

 

[HungSowel]

Mad cow came out of Alberta and Canada's biggest biolab, a world class facility, is also in Alberta. You would think that Alberta would stop raising cows but since they did not then Alberta must have ...... deliberate.... evil..... totalitarianism.

 

[lomotil]

Mad cow came out of Alberta and Canada's biggest biolab, a world class facility, is also in Alberta. You would think that Alberta would stop raising cows but since they did not then Alberta must have ...... deliberate.... evil..... totalitarianism.

Mad Cow Disease had the first case in North America, yes in Alberta but this prion infection did not originate from nor escape from Canadian cattle, a Canadian lab, nor cause a global pandemic . No Alberta lab workers become suspiciously ill, no physicians were murdered or silenced that I know of, but who knows lol. Mad Cow Disease can only be spread human to human by eating another person’s brain as Creutzfeld-Jacobs disease so it is not really a problem for most of mankind as cannibalism is rare currently, so this contagion is not a threat to go viral as the aerosol Covid-19 has done.
Canada does not permit wet markets which is a restriction that some might find…somewhat evil …deliberate and totalitarian.
Maybe in your mind Mad Cow Disease and Covid-19 might be comparable for a sarcastic analogy lol.

And by the way, do you know why two Wuhan Virological Centre scientists, a husband and wife team who were temporarily working in a Winnipeg lab were had to be escorted out of the lab and out of Canada in August 2019 ?

 

[HungSowel]

After mad cow was found and the farmers were told to destroy their cattle, they instead had the cattle ground up and fed to other animals giving those animals CJD which were then sold for human consumption infecting more humans with CJD.

 

[lomotil]

After mad cow was found and the farmers were told to destroy their cattle, they instead had the cattle ground up and fed to other animals giving those animals CJD which were then sold for human consumption infecting more humans with CJD.

Robert Pickton, a BC pig farmer was convicted of luring women to his farm, killing them and feeding their remains to pigs which he made into sausages and then sold them in grocery stores in the lower mainland. The sausages where abruptly pulled from the shelves and not found to contain any prions but evidence of human DNA. No cases of Creutzfeld-Jacobs disease were detected.
No pandemic and no cover up resulted as with Covid-19 which most likely accidentally escaped from the lab in Wuhan which has severely damaged the world in infinite ways.