Lockdowns will cause 10 times more harm to human health than COVID-19 itself, says infectious disease expert

[sp free]

31 cases in two weeks vs. almost 3000 cases per day?

31 FLIGHTS with confirmed cases that came into the country and interacted with other passengers, flight crew, airport staff, ground transportation staff, possibly hotel staff, restaurant staff, grocery store employees, car rental agents, gas station attendants, plus all the people that every one of them interacted with.

That’s how you get to 3000 a day. That’s how the virus got here in the first place.

Can’t go to the gym, can’t visit grandma, can’t work, can’t have thanksgiving dinner, can’t go to a bar, but the above is fine?

 

[shack]

31 FLIGHTS with confirmed cases that came into the country and interacted with other passengers, flight crew, airport staff, ground transportation staff, possibly hotel staff, restaurant staff, grocery store employees, car rental agents, gas station attendants, plus all the people that every one of them interacted with.

That’s how you get to 3000 a day. That’s how the virus got here in the first place.

Can’t go to the gym, can’t visit grandma, can’t work, can’t have thanksgiving dinner, can’t go to a bar, but the above is fine?

That is exactly what trump and Hope Hicks did after they were confirmed positive and went to a debate and rallies. They intentionally exposed all those people that you mentioned above.

 

[squeezer]

Says you.

but he's right and you're delusional.

 

[sp free]

but he's right and you're delusional.

No.

 

[kherg007]

Excess deaths is the stat to initially determine whether the lockdown is worse than the virus (that is, how many deaths this year compared to last year at same time, corrected for population If deaths over excess is, for example, 100k, and there are 100k covid dearhs, then the lockdown is not worse than the virus. If, however, there are 100k over excess and you have only 50k covid, that's telling you 50k other people w/out covid are dying at a higher rate. This certainly would have you worried about the lockdown. Pretty straightforward stuff, not much to debate.

 

[Phil C. McNasty]

Excess deaths is the stat to initially determine whether the lockdown is worse than the virus (that is, how many deaths this year compared to last year at same time, corrected for population If deaths over excess is, for example, 100k, and there are 100k covid dearhs, then the lockdown is not worse than the virus. If, however, there are 100k over excess and you have only 50k covid, that's telling you 50k other people w/out covid are dying at a higher rate. This certainly would have you worried about the lockdown. Pretty straightforward stuff, not much to debate

This is exactly right. So long as all the other causes of deaths stay constant of course.

This is why I keep saying wait till the end of the year to see if Sweden's annual deaths are out of the ordinary

 

[shack]

This is exactly right. So long as all the other causes of deaths stay constant of course.

This is why I keep saying wait till the end of the year to see if Sweden's annual deaths are out of the ordinary

From March to the end of the year is 10 months, and we are 80% of the way there. How much difference could one reasonably expect the last 2 months to make to the rate already established.

 

[Phil C. McNasty]

From March to the end of the year is 10 months, and we are 80% of the way there. How much difference could one reasonably expect the last 2 months to make to the rate already established.

Quite a bit, because the death rate overall in Sweden has slowed down considerably over last 4 months.
They will still be over their usual annual death rate, but the question is by how much, and also how they compare to other EU countries

 

[doggystyle99]

This is exactly right. So long as all the other causes of deaths stay constant of course.

This is why I keep saying wait till the end of the year to see if Sweden's annual deaths are out of the ordinary

People like you have been wrong about Sweden all along, you just don't want to admit it.
At the current rate Sweden’s deaths are on pace to end at about 95,500 for the year, that is 5,000 deaths over their 10 year average and almost 7,000 higher than last year 2019.
What you’ve kept saying is Sweden had already reached herd immunity, then you changed that statement to Sweden is reaching herd immunity and all were based on false information, reality is Sweden is nowhere near herd immunity. This can be seen in the rate of transmission in the country.

Sweden's number of cases over the last 10 days
Oct 20--------1,291
Oct 21--------1,571
Oct 22--------1,667
Oct 23--------1,869
Oct 24--------1,478
Oct 25--------516
Oct 26--------1,071
Oct 27--------2,416--------Previous highest daily total
Oct 28--------3,396--------Highest daily total
Oct 29--------2.616--------2nd highest daily total

The 7 day average in Sweden for the last week is the highest it's ever been by more than 2X as much as they had ever seen in the first wave during it's highest peaks in June.
The 7 day average has increased by over 1,700 cases/day since Sept 1

Sept 1--------162
Oct 29--------1,909

Sweden was a failure in April is a failure now and will be a failure in the future as the measues they have taken so far does not reduce the rate of transmission in the community, some just don't want to admit that because it would show they were uninformed and wrong about it.

Quite a bit, because the death rate overall in Sweden has slowed down considerably over last 4 months.
They will still be over their usual annual death rate, but the question is by how much, and also how they compare to other EU countries

It absolutely makes no difference how Sweden compares to other EU countries, it's more important how Sweden compares to other Nordic countries Denmark, Finland, Norway who saw the spread of the virus in almost the exact same timeline, but took different actions with whom they share many more similarities with than other EU countries.

 

[sp free]

Sweden is not a failure. Having a “second wave” after mandating masks and destroying your economy....that is failure.

 

[Phil C. McNasty]

People like you have been wrong about Sweden all along, you just don't want to admit it.
At the current rate Sweden’s deaths are on pace to end at about 95,500 for the year, that is 5,000 deaths over their 10 year average and almost 7,000 higher than last year 2019.
What you’ve kept saying is Sweden had already reached herd immunity, then you changed that statement to Sweden is reaching herd immunity and all were based on false information, reality is Sweden is nowhere near herd immunity. This can be seen in the rate of transmission in the country.

Sweden's number of cases over the last 10 days
Oct 20--------1,291
Oct 21--------1,571
Oct 22--------1,667
Oct 23--------1,869
Oct 24--------1,478
Oct 25--------516
Oct 26--------1,071
Oct 27--------2,416--------Previous highest daily total
Oct 28--------3,396--------Highest daily total
Oct 29--------2.616--------2nd highest daily total

The 7 day average in Sweden for the last week is the highest it's ever been by more than 2X as much as they had ever seen in the first wave during it's highest peaks in June.
The 7 day average has increased by over 1,700 cases/day since Sept 1

Sept 1--------162
Oct 29--------1,909

Sweden was a failure in April is a failure now and will be a failure in the future as the measues they have taken so far does not reduce the rate of transmission in the community, some just don't want to admit that because it would show they were uninformed and wrong about it.



It absolutely makes no difference how Sweden compares to other EU countries, it's more important how Sweden compares to other Nordic countries Denmark, Finland, Norway who saw the spread of the virus in almost the exact same timeline, but took different actions with whom they share many more similarities with than other EU countries.

Wrong!!

BTW you still havent answered my question.

You said something along the lines of Swedes tend to listen to their government better.
Do you have any stats or other evidence to back this up??

 

[lenny2]

People like you have been wrong about Sweden all along, you just don't want to admit it.
At the current rate Sweden’s deaths are on pace to end at about 95,500 for the year, that is 5,000 deaths over their 10 year average and almost 7,000 higher than last year 2019.
What you’ve kept saying is Sweden had already reached herd immunity, then you changed that statement to Sweden is reaching herd immunity and all were based on false information, reality is Sweden is nowhere near herd immunity. This can be seen in the rate of transmission in the country.

Sweden's number of cases over the last 10 days
Oct 20--------1,291
Oct 21--------1,571
Oct 22--------1,667
Oct 23--------1,869
Oct 24--------1,478
Oct 25--------516
Oct 26--------1,071
Oct 27--------2,416--------Previous highest daily total
Oct 28--------3,396--------Highest daily total
Oct 29--------2.616--------2nd highest daily total

The 7 day average in Sweden for the last week is the highest it's ever been by more than 2X as much as they had ever seen in the first wave during it's highest peaks in June.
The 7 day average has increased by over 1,700 cases/day since Sept 1

Sept 1--------162
Oct 29--------1,909

Sweden was a failure in April is a failure now and will be a failure in the future as the measues they have taken so far does not reduce the rate of transmission in the community, some just don't want to admit that because it would show they were uninformed and wrong about it.



It absolutely makes no difference how Sweden compares to other EU countries, it's more important how Sweden compares to other Nordic countries Denmark, Finland, Norway who saw the spread of the virus in almost the exact same timeline, but took different actions with whom they share many more similarities with than other EU countries.

Spot on!

In another post he clearly demonstrated he didn't even understand the meaning of "herd immunity".

 

[doggystyle99]

Wrong!!

LOL your posts are so thought provoking and full of enlightenment, I really don't know how to process so much wisdom

 

[lenny2]

Sweden is not a failure. Having a “second wave” after mandating masks and destroying your economy....that is failure.

Sweden's strategy has not gone well. Sweden has way more total deaths than their 3 Nordic neighbours combined who mandated shutdowns. While Sweden has a 50% larger population than the 3 of them combined. And Sweden is no better off economically. It seems lockdowns were the superior choice.

Economies have not been destroyed, but have been on holiday, & will recover once the vacation is over. OTOH how will the dead recover. Which would be 10X more without extreme safety measures.

Second waves are coming everywhere, except in places like New Zealand, Australia, etc, that destroyed the second waves with lockdowns.

 

[MissCroft]

Economies have not been destroyed, but have been on holiday, & will recover once the vacation is over.

I wish that I had such optimism.

 

[sp free]

Yeah ok.

 

[Cheeta]

Many of my friends are so scared of coming lockdown.. They are running out of necessary goods in market and it appears to get worse as lockdown looms. So many just trying to get back on their feet and now this. While they are scared , most of them wanted the lockdown much sooner.. NHS is one of the best in the world and have been able to deal with first wave much better than other countries,. I wish my friends and people of England the best.