Toronto council votes in favour of Scarborough subway in major victory for Rob Ford

[Moviefan-2]

They don't have to lie in the least.
They can just say 'we committed $1.8 billion to transit in Toronto, we are happy to put that into subways if Ford can make the financing work'.
Its Ford's foolishness that made his vote dependent on the Ontario and Federal government putting in more money while Ford would not commit more then a pittance from Toronto.
You can't get the feds and Ontario to commit more just by a vote at city council.
Ford is an idiot.

The Liberals are promising voters they will deliver a subway to Scarborough.

http://www.votehunter.ca/News/1451?l=EN

I'll repeat the question I asked Fuji: Do you believe the Liberals will keep their promise?

And if you don't believe them, doesn't that mean you think they're lying?

 

[fuji]

The Liberals are promising voters they will deliver a subway to Scarborough.

http://www.votehunter.ca/News/1451?l=EN

I'll repeat the question I asked Fuji: Do you believe the Liberals will keep their promise?

And if you don't believe them, doesn't that mean you think they're lying?

That is just ridiculous. Only someone dumb enough to think the Sun is news would think that the Province is on the hook for a subway no matter what the city does.

The city has to do its part too, and so far the city is falling 400m short.

The Province had been very straight and transparent about how much money it has available. It is up to the city to figure our how to find the rest.

 

[boodog]

The Crosstown is still being built, still supported by both council and the province, and money for it is included in the 1.8b.

I think you are confusing the crosstown, which is still on, with the Scarborough lrt, which had been cancelled in favour of this proposed subway.

I see you support subways. Why don't you personally chip in the required 400mil? Saying that you support it is not the same as saying you have the dollars.

The province has made certain funds available it is up to the city to work with that.

Obviously you either didn't read my reply or worse you didn't understand Mitzie Hunter was referring only Scarborough Subway extension for her 100% unconditional support.

Let me refresh your memory first:

On July 17 the City of Toronto council passed the subway proposal, 28 to 16, spelling out clearly the proposal needs $1.8b (minus the $85m) from the Province transfer the LRT to Subway Project.

For that on July 18 Mitzie Hunter gave her 100% unconditional support on............the said SUBWAY.


http://www.votehunter.ca/News/1451?l=EN

"Statement from Mitzie Hunter the Ontario Liberal Candidate for Scarborough- Guildwood on Scarborough Subway Expansion

Today residents in Scarborough-Guildwood received the clarity they deserve on subway expansion to Scarborough.

As a person who has experienced the delays and issues faced by residents everyday with regards to transit in Scarborough, it was important for me to be present to hear about the future of transit in Scarborough.

I am supporting the expansion of subway to Scarborough because residents in Scarborough deserve high quality transit to get them moving easily and seamlessly. This subway expansion will also deliver economic development and create jobs.

From my conversations at the doors, residents have been clear that this is a priority issue for them, and they deserve a strong voice to bring that clarity to Queen’s Park. They need a strong representative that will be speaking on their behalf and can be effective in achieving results."

Of course "The Crosstown is still being built" and so is the Vaughan Subway to nowhere. The province can't morally deduct the money spent on these "Crosstown" or Vaughan Subway to claw back from $1.8b budgeted for Scarborough Transit.

As I said before lets call in an independent forensic accounting to see what was already spent on the previous LRT project and deduct that from $1.8b. The net amount is what the City of Toronto rightfully owed for Scarborough transit improvement.

To you "Saying that you support it is not the same as saying you have the dollars." maybe a new Liberal Government motto but to me its an exercise of vote buying with absolutely no intention to honour after the election.

 

[fuji]

You still don't seem to understand that the 400m for Kennedy station is being spent in Scarborough and is part of the 1.8b budget for Scarborough. Look on a map and check out where Kennedy is!!!

The province has been clear about their intention to complete the crosstown since forever, and the funding available.

They are happy to support subways WITHIN THAT BUDGET.

 

[boodog]

You still don't seem to understand that the 400m for Kennedy station is being spent in Scarborough and is part of the 1.8b budget for Scarborough. Look on a map and check out where Kennedy is!!!

The province has been clear about their intention to complete the crosstown since forever, and the funding available.

They are happy to support subways WITHIN THAT BUDGET.

Do you honestly believe I am the only one who doesn't understand this $400m being spent for Kennedy Station?

The city manager of Toronto doesn't understand it.

The Chair of TTC doesn't understand it.

The General Manager of TTC disputed it.

The Liberal Candidate Mitzie Hunter, the flip flop artist from the previous LRT project which includes the same Kennedy Station and it update cost, doesn't understand it either. She gave the 100% unconditional support to this Scarborough Subway knowing full well it will require the Province transfer $1.8b from LRT to Subway Project. She did NOT mention $400 m. And as a matter of fact she didn't mention the $85m either. She didn't know any amount will be deducted from the $1.8b (unless she lies in order to buy vote for the by-election)

Lets call in an independent forensic accounting to double check all e-mail correspondences between the province, the city, the Metrolink and TTC and determine the amount.

 

[fuji]

I am quite sure that the city manager knows Kennedy station is in Scarborough.

This is some slimy spin from Ford's film flam man to pressure the province to cough up more money so that Ford won't have to reinstate the vehicle registration fee or other sensible measures to raise the required cash.

Ford doesn't really want subways. He only wants free subways.

 

[Moviefan-2]

That is just ridiculous. Only someone dumb enough to think the Sun is news would think that the Province is on the hook for a subway no matter what the city does.

It is if that's the promise the Liberals have made. And that is what they have been promising.

Do you think the Liberals will keep their promise?

 

[fuji]

It is if that's the promise the Liberals have made. And that is what they have been promising.

Do you think the Liberals will keep their promise?

The Liberals never, ever promised subways at any cost. Stop being an idiot.

Reading the Sun has lowered your IQ.

 

[boodog]

The Liberals never, ever promised subways at any cost. Stop being an idiot.

Reading the Sun has lowered your IQ.

On July 17 the City of Toronto council passed the subway proposal, 28 to 16, spelling out clearly the proposal needs $1.8b (minus the $85m) from the Province transfer the LRT to Subway Project.

For that on July 18 Mitzie Hunter gave her 100% unconditional support on............the said SUBWAY.


I will keep reminding you in order to bring up your IQ.

 

[fuji]

On July 17 the City of Toronto council passed the subway proposal, 28 to 16, spelling out clearly the proposal needs $1.8b (minus the $85m) from the Province transfer the LRT to Subway Project.

For that on July 18 Mitzie Hunter gave her 100% unconditional support on............the said SUBWAY.

I will keep reminding you in order to bring up your IQ.

Hunter is not the Minister. While I am sure she herself supports subways she does not speak for the government. Metrolink's master agreement with the city is on its website and the province has always between clear both about the funds available and about its commitment to complete the crosstown.

Stop reading the Sun.

 

[luckyjackson]

Whatever your opinion about subways vs lrt, any thinking person must be depressed at the level and quality of what passes for public discussion on this issue.

Personally, I think subways are the smarter way to go in the long run, but even though I've made a fair effort to follow the story, I don't feel I have anything like the kind of information at hand to make a good decision about how much the real cost of a subway will be, how it will be paid for, and even where exactly they would run. I bet at least 19 out of 20 people don't either.

 

[boodog]

I am quite sure that the city manager knows Kennedy station is in Scarborough.

This is some slimy spin from Ford's film flam man to pressure the province to cough up more money so that Ford won't have to reinstate the vehicle registration fee or other sensible measures to raise the required cash.

The City of Toronto doesn't really want subways. It only wants free subways.

I fix your statement.

28 to 16 the City Council, after studying the financial feasibility report from the City Manager, voted for subway on the advice of TTC Chair and TTC General Manager.

The City will levy subway surtax.

I am not sure what you mean "I am quite sure that the city manager knows Kennedy station is in Scarborough."

Let me refresh your memory one more time:

On July 17 the City of Toronto council passed the subway proposal, 28 to 16, spelling out clearly the proposal needs $1.8b (minus the $85m) from the Province transfer the LRT to Subway Project.

For that on July 18 Mitzie Hunter gave her 100% unconditional support on............the said SUBWAY.

 

[fuji]

Pasting the same thing over and over is a stupid troll move.

Murray speaks for the liberal government on this issue. He is the minister, not Hunter.

Kennedy is in Scarborough and included in the 1.8b for Scarborough because it is in Scarborough. Look at a map.

The master agreement between the city and the province along with other planning documents and materials can be found on the metrolinx site but as a Sun reader that is probably beyond your reading level.

 

[boodog]

Hunter is not the Minister. While I am sure she herself supports subways she does not speak for the government. Metrolink's master agreement with the city is on its website and the province has always between clear both about the funds available and about its commitment to complete the crosstown.

Stop reading the Sun.

Yes Metrolink master agreement had been signed but your Minister of Transportation had been promising subway for the Scarborough Voters the last few months.

Are you now saying "He is just a minister. He does not represent the Government of Ontario"?

The Liberal standard bearer, Mitzie Hunter, the parachute candidate for this coming by-election, has been promising 100% unconditional support for the subway knowing full well "the City of Toronto council passed the subway proposal, 28 to 16, spelling out clearly the proposal needs $1.8b (minus the $85m) from the Province transfer the LRT to Subway Project."

Did the Liberal Party of Ontario rebuke her campaign statement, no sir?

Did the Liberal Minister of Transportation of Ontario rebuke her campaign statement, no sir?

Did the Liberal Premier of Ontario rebuke her campaign statement, no sir?

 

[boodog]

Pasting the same thing over and over is a stupid troll move.

Murray speaks for the liberal government on this issue. He is the minister, not Hunter.

Kennedy is in Scarborough and included in the 1.8b for Scarborough because it is in Scarborough. Look at a map.

The master agreement between the city and the province along with other planning documents and materials can be found on the metrolinx site but as a Sun reader that is probably beyond your reading level.

Yes Kenneday is in Scarborough and there is some sunk cost converting from LRT to subway including the amount that have been spent at this station. And the TTC General Manager admits that.

He estimates, based on his knowledge on this particular construction on the (formerly) LRT, is around $85m.

And he, on the behalf of TTC, therefore strongly disputes the $400m claw back by the Liberals (or Lieberals).

Should we call in an independent forensic accounting and, after thoroughly analysing all e-mail correspondences between the Province, the City, Metrolink and TTC, to determine the amount? What the Liberals got to hide anyway, right?

 

[fuji]

You don't know what you are talking about, maybe because you believe the fictions the Sun printed in its paper distributed blog.

The 400m upgrades to Kennedy are attached to the crosstown development. They are not sunk costs. They have nothing to do with the cancelled Scarborough lrt. It is for work that is still going to be done.

Metrolinx warned the city a year ago that the funds for crosstown were not up for grabs.

It is not a claw back. The money was never there for the city to take, it is already allocated to higher priority work.

 

[fuji]

And stop being an idiot. Nobody ever promised subways at any cost. The province has made money available that can be spent on subways but the onus is on Ford to produce a plan including whatever money is required in addition to the provincial funds.

He fucked up and now he is trying to blame someone else for his innumeracy.

 

[HenrySenior]

They still need a subway in Mississauga

Mississauga better recruit Greg Sorbara as their MPP if they want to build a subway.

 

[Butler1000]

Mississauga better recruit Greg Sorbara as their MPP if they want to build a subway.

Cripes. So its 400 million. Approve it. Its 2 years until it starts. How ever long to build it. I think betwween the city, the prov, the feds all can come up with that much spread over 5 years or so.....
Oh and for all those who keep harping about Mike Harris stopping Eglinton. It was the OLD Metro council who made that decision. They had the Choice and changed it to Sheppard. It was the city's fault. Time to make up for that now and start moving ahead.

 

[Butler1000]

Mississauga better recruit Greg Sorbara as their MPP if they want to build a subway.

Well I did just vote for Doug H in an advance poll. Considering we turfed out MikeY Iggy in the last fed election I remain hopeful we can get him in up there.