Another Pedestrian Killed

[Top Northerner]

Very funny! LOL

 

[Top Northerner]

If the driver does something stupid and the pedestrian is careful, the pedestrian survives./QUOTE]

Pedetrian waits for walk light, lokos both ways, walks briskly while keeping eyes open, car comes screaming aroung a right on a red without slowing and hits pedetrian. Pedestrian doesn't survive. One example of probably many where abiding by lawws/rules/common sense you can still get killed. My favourite is old fuck driver who shouldn't be driving but family aren't strong enough to take car away and they can't see the victim because of cateracts and can't hold the steering wheel because of debilitating arthritis, they can't see over dasj because their spin is bent so far because of acute osteoporosis, and the alzheimers makes them forget that when they checked if there was a pedestrian on teh cross walk they saw one.

 

[fuji]

In every one of these recent pedestrian fatalities (except the old lady who ran over the mother with the stroller) , the pedestrian was jaywalking, talking on their cell phone, crossing against a red light, crossing the street on the back side of a hill in the dark wearing a black jacket etc.

Do you have a source for that? How many of the motorists were talking on their cell phone, crossing against a red light, turning without properly slowing down?

In any case we have a problem. The only thing that has changed recently is the papers have begun reporting it, for years roughly HALF of traffic fatalities in the city are pedestrians, and of the remainder some are cyclists. Whoever is "at fault" there needs to be some sort of practical solution, and almost all of the practical solutions are going to involve slowing down or reducing automotive traffic.

 

[Brill]

Wow.... using tboy logic to argue against tboy! LOL!

Your glib post chiding the previous comments by saying it is easy for tboy to blame the victims countering the OP suggesting manic motorists are at blame...is an implied assignment of blame.

Now you are saying you didn't assign blame.

Let's hear your tboy logical explanation for this....

tboy is always quick to judge and always blames the victim. That's all I judged and all I'm blaming him for.

 

[toughb]

In summation both drivers and pedestrians are stupid. Plain and simple.

Let the carnage continue.

...

 

[blank_dave]

Pedetrian waits for walk light, lokos both ways, walks briskly while keeping eyes open, car comes screaming aroung a right on a red without slowing and hits pedetrian. Pedestrian doesn't survive. One example of probably many where abiding by lawws/rules/common sense you can still get killed.

Then they weren't being careful now were they? I nearly got tagged myself by one of them, now I also do a shoulder check for cars turning against the light.

 

[red]

is it just me that finds it odd that they are elderly? You have to wonder if they were crossing with the lights, against them, or ?? I know one was hit on rutherford road by the 401. I bet she didn't stop at the island. Not to excuse her being hit, but that's what islands are for, in case you can't make it across in one light......

One thing I HAVE noticed recently: pedestrians are acting like idiots. I can't tell you how many just cross right in front of me along queen and NOT at an intersection or crosswalk.

I've also noted more and more aren't even pushing the crosswalk buttons, just stepping off into traffic. They don't even do the old stop look point......

Not saying it's right to hit and kill them but as a pedestrian, you HAVE to be careful.....

i agree. why there was pedestrian walking kind of crazy just this morning so I drove up onto the sidewalk and ran them down.

 

[red]

One victim was 57 and walked with two canes and was killed by a dump truck. Let's face it. Elderly people are S-L-O-W but don't kill them.

yeah in the old days we would just put them on ice flows. Can't we keep any of our Canadian traditions?

 

[red]

Do you have a source for that? How many of the motorists were talking on their cell phone, crossing against a red light, turning without properly slowing down?

In any case we have a problem. The only thing that has changed recently is the papers have begun reporting it, for years roughly HALF of traffic fatalities in the city are pedestrians, and of the remainder some are cyclists. Whoever is "at fault" there needs to be some sort of practical solution, and almost all of the practical solutions are going to involve slowing down or reducing automotive traffic.

I have seen the police reports, 30% of the pedestrians were walking with staplers- so they got what they deserved.

 

[chiller_boy]

Do you have a source for that? How many of the motorists were talking on their cell phone, crossing against a red light, turning without properly slowing down?

In any case we have a problem. The only thing that has changed recently is the papers have begun reporting it, for years roughly HALF of traffic fatalities in the city are pedestrians, and of the remainder some are cyclists. Whoever is "at fault" there needs to be some sort of practical solution, and almost all of the practical solutions are going to involve slowing down or reducing automotive traffic.

A large percentage of the accidents have occurred while the driver is in the process of making a turn(both right and left). I saw an interview with a policeman who felt that right turns were a big factor. Perhaps there are intersections in which right turn on red is not a good idea.
Nothing can be done about the cell phone idiots. I have seen two recently who were oblivious walking against the light while talking. In both cases drivers had to stop and honk. In one case the woman didnt even hear the honking. just kept on walking against the light.

 

[tboy]

Chiller: There are lots of intersections in toronto where you can't make a right on a red and some where you can't make any turns period. (I love those, you zip right through).

I know I seem to be "anti" pedestrian, but there is one route I take to get to my local Home Depot and I can say, every second or third time some idiot walks out in front of me against the red. They don't even slow down at the intersection and walk right out against the red. Then when you honk, they look at your strange and keep on going.

I think I posted this once before but I was crossing a big 4 lane street and when I was crossing with the green (walking) I heard and saw a cop car blasting down at about 80 kph. I quickened my pace to get out of his way and then saw a (asian) young lady pushing a stroller towards me. I put out my arms to stop her and said "WAIT" but she bolted around me and almost into the path of the cop car. The cop car actually hammered on the brakes, squealed the times a bit and blasted through the intersection. I turned to the mother and said quite loudly FUCKING IDIOT.....

I do like to walk around the city in the spring and fall, and I NEVER assume a car is going to stop at a red. I NEVER start or walk in front of a moving car even if I have the green and they have the red. If I'm crossing the street at a cross walk and there's a car in the middle lane? I stop and make sure no other cars are coming in the curb lane.

I guess I got all this from riding a motorcycle in this city for about 20 yrs.

Just a note to all the pedestrians: the rule of law regarding crosswalks is: a vehicle MUST stop but only if it is safe to do so. In other words just because you step off the curb, if the car can't stop without skidding or swerving to miss you, they don't have to stop. Like in boating: the more maneuverable you are, the more you have to yield. A person can move laterally infinitely faster than a car can stop, turn or accellerate.

Now, not all pedestrians are stupid, but a LOT are, here are some of the biggest boners:
1) Pedestrians that stand with their toes overhanging the edge of the sidewalk. Lanes are only SO wide and with many trucks and SUVs these days with windcatcher rear view side mirrors, these people are lucky they don't get whacked.
2) Pedestrians that don't go on up on the curb after crossing the street at a 4 way intersection. I so FUCKING hate it when they turn and stand on the road in the other crosswalk. Some even stand a foot or more in the opposing lane!! What, that extra foot is gonna kill you? No, but the car turning might......
3) CrossWALKS are for pedestrians, not bicyclists (mounted), not electric scooters, not electric motorcycles, What park of WALK don't people understand?
4) Lookielous: Oh I SO fricken hate people who walk out into the passing lane looking for the next streetcar. Listen, it will be along in a minute. Why risk your life to see if it will be there in 5 munutes? Not only do they go out there to look, but many STAND there as if it will magically appear.
5) Orange light wanderers: Don't you just love those people that either start crossing on the orange or if it changes while they're partway they don't speed up? Just the other day a LOL (Little old lady) pushing a bundle buggy was halfway across, the light changed to orange, and she actually looked, saw me waiting to turn left, and SPED UP and got to the other side before the light turned red. Honest to god, I felt like pulling over, walking up to her and giving her a big hug.
6) Undeciders: OH don't get me started on the fucking idiots who start crossing the street, get partway, stop, turn around walk back 2 steps, turn around walk forward 2 steps.....Make up your mind BEFORE stepping off the curb.
7) Middle of the road meeters: OH man, don't you just love people who are crossing the street, get almost to the middle, meet someone there crossing against them, stop, have a meeting, then turn around and walk back the way they came? It isn't them changing direction that gets me, it's the stopping in the middle of the lane to talk! Meet on the sidewalk dipshit.....

I don't have ANY problem with pedestrians, just STUPID pedestrians.....

Now this last one will ruffle a few feathers but: It is my opinion that if you're texting, chatting on your cellphone, or bopping to music and walk out in front of a car or dump truck doing 50 kph? You deserve to die. In fact, not only do you deserve to die, but your estate should have to pay for any damages to the vehicle. I know it sounds harsh but Darwin wasn't wrong: if you're dumb enough to do that, you're just going to dilute the gene pool and the sooner you're gone, the better off mankind will be.

Oh and for the record? If you're caught texting while driving? It is my opinion that you should forfeit your licence permanantly. No ifs, ands or buts. If you're dumb enough to do that, you shouldn't be driving....(same goes for drinking, eating a bowl of soup, putting on your makeup, changing your shirt/blouse)

 

[Rockslinger]

Was watching a TV phone in show this afternoon. One of the callers said that he hit a pedestrian (broke her leg) and the police cleared him of any charges BUT the victim's familiy launched a civil suit for $1 million dollars. He said this accident has ruined his life, the legal fees alone is $40,000 so far and the civil suit is far from an end.

So far, it seems that none of the 14 victims are children. Is it because they are young and agile? One would have thought children are more careless and they are smaller and therefore are harder for drivers to see.

What really pisses me off are drivers who don't stop behind streetcars and school buses or pull over for emergency vehicles.

 

[Cycleguy007]

Its the loss of the game of road hockey.
Nobody knows what it means when someone yells ..... CAR !!!

OK... so waddaya do when kids WON'T EVEN MAKE AN EFFORT to get off the road?! They expect you to go around them! I mean WTF?! The road is there for the cars!!!! Not their silly game of road hockey!

 

[tboy]

Was watching a TV phone in show this afternoon. One of the callers said that he hit a pedestrian (broke her leg) and the police cleared him of any charges BUT the victim's familiy launched a civil suit for $1 million dollars. He said this accident has ruined his life, the legal fees alone is $40,000 so far and the civil suit is far from an end.

So far, it seems that none of the 14 victims are children. Is it because they are young and agile? One would have thought children are more careless and they are smaller and therefore are harder for drivers to see.

What really pisses me off are drivers who don't stop behind streetcars and school buses or pull over for emergency vehicles.

What pisses me off even more are the drivers who don't know the rules of the road. How you only have to stop behind the back doors of the streetcar when it is loading or unloading passengers. Same as schoolbuses: you only have to stop when the 4 way lights are flashing. What if the driver just pulls over to answer his cellphone? You don't have to stop then......

 

[Shallow Throat]

Here's a good one I watched 2 days ago.
I was about to cross the street as the light just turned when I heard and saw a Firetruck, sirens blazing going quite fast.
All cars pulled over and all pedestrians stopped at the corners.
One woman turned, looked at the truck and started to cross the street walking at a normal pace.
Yep, she saw it coming and still started to cross anyway. Fortunately, the truck did not have to turn.

 

[blackrock13]

Cell phone, Ipods, jaywalking, stupid ; nuff said. Not just the pedestrians though.

 

[Hard Idle]

One victim was 57 and walked with two canes and was killed by a dump truck. Let's face it. Elderly people are S-L-O-W but don't kill them.

Actually most 57 year olds move at a normal pace. But in the case of this person with mobility issues, they probably were moving slow enough to be seen and avaoided in most circumstances.

HOWEVER, a 57 year old might be expected to know that the area immediately in front of a dump truck is somrthng of a blind spot and should be avoided.

Any flat nosed vehicle where the driver sits up high has a blind about a foot under the windshield and even more so the windows. You don't need to be a driver to know this. Just sit in any bus or streetcar with the window closed and try to look straight down - you can't - if a short person or a child were to walk right up aginst the side of a bus, you could not see them from inside. (in the old days of street warfare, guerillas exploited such blind spot by joggin in a crouch right alongside tanks or trucks undeteced and lobbing mines & molotov coktails on to the hatches or intakes..)

In this particular case, the old person who was struck was not legaly in the wrong. But if one's mobility is so limited as to require two canes to get around, it would have been a wise idea to postpone your move until a vehicle with frontal blind spots was long gone. I cant remember if dump trucks beep when they make turns like they do when they make stops, if they don't it would probably be a good idea to add that feature!

 

[catman42]

Another Pedestrian killed

Then there was the pedestrian that walked into that silly street car that was in hes way!!! daw.

 

[Hard Idle]

Whoever is "at fault" there needs to be some sort of practical solution, and almost all of the practical solutions are going to involve slowing down or reducing automotive traffic.

Practical? No, your are cunstructing practical to suit your own political and civic engineering fetishes ... to which you are perfectly entitled, but call them what they are.

What you are conveniently ignoring is that ALL of the people killed in the last 3 weeks would still be alive if they had also been driving.

Only the two people wipped out by the inept old geezers were struck at a speed which might cause significant vehicle damage and some sprains & soft tissue damage. The others would have been minor bumper damage or cracked tail lights leaving everyone unhurt. So that's another way of looking at "practical".

As for reducing and slowing down traffic...LOL! gimme a break, one of these idiots cut in front of a fucking STREETCAR as it was pulling from stop - what was it, around 6:30AM?? - that's pretty fucking slow and very light traffic - I mean a STREETCAR? The things rings a bell and rumbles like a landslide! You should be feel it through your feet!

Fact is as long as pedestrians have absolutely no checks & balances on their behaviour, absolutely no accountability through ticketing, fines, insurance premiums and all the other enforcement structures targeted solely at personal car dirvers ... and a halo of unconditional victimhood perpetuated by municipal politicians and lefty media, they are going to keep finding ways to get hurt.

While we don't have the full brakedown of responsibility assessed in all of this year's incidents, last year I followed many of these on CP24 and in the majority of the cases no charges were laid on the drivers becuase they weren't doing anythig wrong and would have had to go well above and beyond to prevent the collision on their end. I many cases charges were ruled out the same day of the report. I'm going to bet this year's incidents will have simillar outcomes.

 

[oldjones]

Hard Idle, if you actually mean to argue with logic, then your

What you are conveniently ignoring is that ALL of the people killed in the last 3 weeks would still be alive if they had alos been driving.

leaves half the story untold and leaves your point not made yet. The same would be true, i.e. ALL of the people killed in the [past 3 weeks would still be alive if no one had been driving. There are very few fatal pedestrian-pedestrian accidents, in fact none I've ever heard of. The second case is as realistic as the first, and if it fails, so does your proposition.

Quite clearly you thought such a possibility too fantastic to be mentioned if you considered it at all, but you really should have dealt with your own pro-car prejudice if you were going to chastise someone else for arguing from "…personal political and civil engineering fetishes".

Fact is, as long as drivers are allowed to have soundproofed, airconditioned cars with tinted windows, as long as they're allowed to chat, listen to talk radio, tune the radio, operate GPS's, read maps, or just be innattentive, they're gonna hit people and things they could have avoided. But armoured with a couple of tons of steel they'll quite likely do way more damage than if I bump into you on the sidewalk.

Not to take anything away from your advice to pedestrians, but your logic says that from the aspect of danger to others it's the drivers who should change.