Another Pedestrian Killed

[fuji]

Fuji: It is illegal to simply stop in the middle of a lane for any perceived reason. You cannot simply state "I thought proceeding was unsafe". There has to be a real reason.

A little more accurately, you have to have reasonable grounds to believe it was unsafe to proceed.

It is your "perceived" notion that riding past parked cars is dangerous. It is only dangerous if there is someone inside the parked vehicle. This is easily overcome if you use your eyes and look into the vehicles as they are passing.

You can't see a kid in the back seat who is lower than the window. It is *always* dangerous to ride (or drive) within a door-width of a parked car. If you are wrong as a cyclist the consequences aren't small---it is one of the most common causes of cyclist death.

Since one BIG rule of the road is "slower vehicles keep right" if you feel the right hand curb lane is unsafe, then you shouldn't be riding.

False. The rule is to keep as far right as is safe. That is at least one meter from the parked cars. A passing vehicle must provide at least one meter of clearance. This means a passing car must often pull out into the next lane over to pass a cyclist, even when the cyclist is following the law exactly and riding as far to the right as is safe.

Your understanding is simply false and wrong.

Taking the danforth for example, I pretty much always drive in the curb lane even if there are parked cars.

The lanes are set up so you clear the parked cars by more than a door width when you drive by. What you are asking cyclist to do is move over into a space cars do not drive in either.

A cyclist should move right to allow a driver to pass, but that does not mean yielding the entire lane--it only means moving as far right as is safe. Furthermore a cyclist need not move right immediately--only when, in the opinion of the cyclist, it is safe to do so.

- - -

We have been debating the law. Now a dose of reality:

A cyclist who moves to the extreme right of the lane puts his life in danger because some 70% of drivers will then attempt an unsafe pass, attempting to pass the cyclist with minimal clearance so as to avoid having to pull out partly into the next lane and effect a safe pass. The drivers are reluctant to pull into the next lane because that would mean waiting for a safe opportunity to pass and prefer to put the cyclist's life in danger in order to get where they are going quicker.

Moreover it's debatable whether or not the cyclist is indeed the slower vehicle. Between lights, for a few moments, the cyclist may appear to be slower, but since the cyclist is simply going to pass the car again at the next light arguably the car is the slower vehicle--depending of course on traffic and situation.


There is no point pulling right to allow someone to pass you unsafely when you are simply going to pass them again in a minute or two.

 

[tboy]

Again: please state where, in the HTA, is specifically says a vehicle/bicycle/motorcycle can't travel within 1 meter of a parked car? If you can't? STFU. This is another example of how you write your own laws in your head......

As for a leading cause of deaths to cyclists: provide some data to back that up or stfu. Seriously.

Since we're using our imagination to create situations to justify our position, when I run you over I'll say to the police: I thought he was carrying an uzi and was about to spray that crowd of people. Gimme a medal! and they will! (least according to Fuji logic)

BTW: if a kid in the back seat is so small you can't see him over the sill of the door? He won't have enough strength to open the fricken door...jesus you can be dumb sometimes. And they say "tboy logic"? At least I make some sense, you're re-writing the laws of physics to support your inane claims.

What happened to your retort about the impact the car makes on the economy? Proved you wrong on that one didn't I?

To the other intelligent cyclists out there: I realize the danger of car doors opening. I drove a motorcycle and bicycle in this city for 20 yrs. In that 20 yrs only once did I almost get a door opened in front of me because I kept an eye open for drivers inside the vehicle. Since, afterall, that's what smart people do as the danger of a car door being opened is FAR less than getting run over by a dump truck. But according to fuji, it is better to ride in front of 3000 lbs of rolling iron than beside it...maybe that's why so many pedestrians are getting killed? They think like Fuji.........and paid the price for that flawed thinking......

 

[fuji]

See the MTO's guide for cyclists, page 14:

http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/pubs/cycling-guide/pdfs/cycling-guide.pdf

Ride in a straight line at least one metre away from parked vehicles. Keep to this line even if the vehicles are far apart to avoid continuous swerving.

 

[fuji]

You might also like this advice from the MTO on page 15:

In urban areas where a curb lane is too narrow to share safely with a motorist, it is legal to take the whole lane by riding in the centre of it.

The MTO's interpretation of the HTA move right requirement is that it means cyclists should be in the right-most lane and only move right to allow a vehicle to pass if, in the opinion of the cyclist, the lane is wide enough to allow that.

 

[fuji]

The silence is deafening.

 

[oldjones]

And as the earlier HTA quote states, should the police have a contrary opinion, they have the means to lay a charge for the court to eventually sort out.

Like imagining there's some law by which all jaywalking is illegal, imagining one cycling rule covers all reasonable or unreasonable behaviour is pie in the sky. Laws aren't being run over and killed. Laws aren't likely to fix things, or they already would have.

All sorts of possible reasons—I loved tboy's complaint his A pillar was so massive he had a huge left blindspot. Who's fault is that? Ford's for bulding it? The MoT's for licencing it? His for buying it? The Roads Dept for putting crosswalks in that blindspot when he's at the stopline? Never mind hoodies and iPods and all the other things drivers and their victims use to make their own little worlds cut off from the dangers and ugliness of this one. Or the rush. Or the fact there's more people, more cars and the roads aren't any bigger or the day any longer.

Gotta fix it and only people do that.

Here's a quuestion: They invented Elmer when I was in Grade 3 or so and we got an Elmer day every year after. There was even a High School version annually. And there was what we got in Cubs, Scouts and Sunday School about traffic rules and safety as well. And it still wasn't enough to keep everyone safe, but it helped. How much traffic safety education do we know our kids are getting? Can't tell you when the last Elmer flag came down, but what's replaced that program?

Does it seem to you it's working?