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Why Korea's, Iran's nuclear weapons don't matter.

WoodPeckr

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This taken from: http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/trinitite.html gives a good brief overview on just what power the US Military has at its disposal. Included also is a brief synopsis of the M.A.D. policy the USA & late USSR used which worked well back then in preventing WWIII.

The US spent $5 trillion dollars (1950s dollars) building a nuclear deterrent capability that can actually melt any nation and it's people into a giant slab of green glass. The USSR knew it, the world knows it, Saddam knew it. The government of Iran knows it.

....The [Ohio class] submarine has the capacity for 24 Trident missile tubes in two rows of 12. The dimensions of the Trident II missile are length 1,360cm x diameter 210cm and the weight is 59,000kg. The three-stage solid fuel rocket motor is built by ATK (Alliant Techsystems) Thiokol Propulsion. The US Navy gives the range as "greater than 7,360km" but this could be up to 12,000km depending on the payload mix. Missile guidance is provided by an inertial navigation system, supported by stellar navigation. Trident II is capable of carrying up to twelve MIRVs (multiple independent re-entry vehicles), each with a yield of 100 kilotons, although the SALT treaty limits this number to eight per missile. The circle of equal probability (the radius of the circle within which half the strikes will impact) is less than 150m. The Sperry Univac Mark 98 missile control system controls the 24 missiles.
The 14 Trident II SSBNs carry together around 50 percent of total U.S. strategic warheads. (The exact number varies in an unpredictable and highly classified manner below a maximum set by various strategic arms limitation treaties.) Although the missiles have no pre-set targets when the submarine goes on patrol, the SSBNs are capable of rapidly targeting their missiles should the need arise, using secure and constant at-sea communications links. The Ohio class are the largest submarines ever built for the U.S. Navy, and are second only to the Russian Typhoon class in mass and size. A single submarine carries the destructive power more than nine times greater than all Allied ordnance dropped in WWII.....
 

K Douglas

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What a bunch of horseshit. WoodPeckr its clear that you have to find more constructive use of your time.
 

Ranger68

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Okay, why is this "horseshit"? What are you debating about this post??

But, woodpeckr, clearly these weapons *do* matter. It makes the US think *very* hard about committing conventional forces towards "regime change" in those nations. For nations like Iran and North Korea, they are defensive measures. Nobody in their right mind would consider using them aggressively - they'd be turned into glass. Which is why the "missile defense shield" is such a stupid idea. BUT, they very effectively prevent the US from doing what it's doing now in Iraq .......
 

K Douglas

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Ranger68 said:
Okay, why is this "horseshit"? What are you debating about this post??
I'm not debating about this post because it is pure horseshit.
 

Fritz96

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They matter because both countries could give them to terrorists to explode in the US.
 

WoodPeckr

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Ranger68 said:
Okay, why is this "horseshit"? What are you debating about this post??

But, woodpeckr, clearly these weapons *do* matter. It makes the US think *very* hard about committing conventional forces towards "regime change" in those nations. For nations like Iran and North Korea, they are defensive measures. Nobody in their right mind would consider using them aggressively - they'd be turned into glass. Which is why the "missile defense shield" is such a stupid idea. BUT, they very effectively prevent the US from doing what it's doing now in Iraq .......
The reason the article interested me was because it pointed out how much money, $5 Trillion, had been spent over the years on the MIC to defend the USA from its foes and what have we to show for all that spent money?
It worked against the USSR due to the M.A.D. policy.
Now that the USSR is gone the MIC has to come up with another rationale for all this massive defensive spending on the MIC, and 'terrorists' like Osama Bin Laden, who don't forget was created and nurtured by Reagan/Rummy/Cheney, et al., will have to suffice until a better bogeyman comes along.

These weapons do matter to the extent they terrify everyone so. However terrorists know chemical, biological and even airliners can have just as great an effect, plus are much easier to acquire and far cheaper than nukes.

Just look back to that 'unsolved' Anthrax attack in the USA a few years ago that went nowhere.....or is it just being 'covered-up' to protect some 'far right-wing nutcases'..... :eek:
 

Mcluhan

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K Douglas said:
What a bunch of horseshit. WoodPeckr its clear that you have to find more constructive use of your time.
One guy posting on a message board, says to the other guy posting on a message board, 'You need to find a more constructive use of your time'.

And you don't of course.
 

Pete Graves

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I am not worried about Korea because Jimmy Carter won a peace prize for negotiating them stopping their nuclear program.
 

Ranger68

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Fritz96 said:
They matter because both countries could give them to terrorists to explode in the US.
That's a laugh. As if either country, having taken GREAT PAINS to develop a tiny handful of nuclear weapons, is going to give them away.
Not a chance.
 

Fritz96

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Once they have the technology, they're not necessary limited to "a tiny handful". Besides, it only takes one to destroy Washington D.C.
 

Ranger68

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Just because they have the technology doesn't make it any less massive an effort to build them.
They're not going to give them away.
 

cyrus

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Uranium Conversion Irreversible
According to
Mahmoud Ahmadinejad

TEHRAN, Oct. 23--President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said on Saturday Iran will not stop activities at Isfahan’s Uranium Conversion Facility (UCF).
Addressing a gathering of university representatives, the president said, “We believe access to peaceful nuclear technology has become a national ideal. Today the issue of nuclear technology is similar to the issue of oil industry nationalization and our people’s morale is similar to the morale of that era.“
Ahmadinejad noted that Iran’s 20-Year Strategy aims at an advanced society at the regional level, which exerts an influence on global affairs.
Stressing that the strategy is knowledge-based, he said its foundations are cultural and spiritual.
“Science is not useful without wisdom and knowledge. Knowledge can be achieved in light of religious, revolutionary and Islamic considerations, which the campuses should facilitate,“ he said.
Ahmadinejad also said the primary mission of universities is to nurture creative and committed forces.
“The next mission is development and generation of indigenous knowledge,“ he said.
He pointed out that hundreds of years ago Iran was the center of knowledge generation.
“Today universities must generate knowledge instead of using knowledge. This is achievable,“ he said.
Referring to the high fees of universities, especially Azad University, Ahmadinejad said, “From the day we began to evaluate everything with money, many yardsticks and criteria were destroyed. We thought money could lead to exaltation, but many state sectors such as education sector cannot be evaluated with money. Of course, it is important to allocate the budget needed for growth and advancement of the education sector, but this is not a fundamental issue.“
Ahmadinejad declared that real progress will take place when all the talented people of the country get equal opportunities.
 

WoodPeckr

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Looks like Team 'W' will have to flip a coin on which county to attack next....or is that spread democracy into next. Will it be Iran or Syria?

BTW there are reports out that US troops are already engaging and fighting in Syria similar to what Nixon did illegally in Cambodia during the Viet Nam War when back then Nixon secretly ordered US troops into Cambodia on 'covert military actions'.
 

stalemate6

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Toronto
uhuh
 

Peeping Tom

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Hellholes of the earth
That is why we should pancake most of them and boil the rest in oil. Let them stew in their own juices ...

Ranger68 said:
That's a laugh. As if either country, having taken GREAT PAINS to develop a tiny handful of nuclear weapons, is going to give them away.
Not a chance.
 

The Mugger

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WoodPeckr said:
This taken from: http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/trinitite.html gives a good brief overview on just what power the US Military has at its disposal. Included also is a brief synopsis of the M.A.D. policy the USA & late USSR used which worked well back then in preventing WWIII.

The US spent $5 trillion dollars (1950s dollars) building a nuclear deterrent capability that can actually melt any nation and it's people into a giant slab of green glass. The USSR knew it, the world knows it, Saddam knew it. The government of Iran knows it.
While this is very true, the fact is that these countries can strike one another. North Korea and Iran have well established allies and enemies. The problem is this - there is no way to keep the US uninvolved in many scenarios because an attack against Israel, Pakistan, Taiwan, Japan or to a lesser degree Europe would bring an immediate and deadly response - which is what you call the green glass deterrent. It's very the monstrous size of the US deterrent that might actually be the problem. In my mind it is very possible that some maniac might look at a limited strike, killing many of the enemy and their own civilians, not in the best interest of the US to retaliate in a way that would affect things on a planetary scale and you know what Wood, that maniac might just be right.

The fact remains, that nations like North Korea and Iran entering the nuke club is a big deal - because it becomes more likely they will be used.
 
May 3, 2004
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WoodPeckr said:
and 'terrorists' like Osama Bin Laden, who don't forget was created and nurtured by Reagan/Rummy/Cheney, et al.,
Hey Pecker, engaging in the politics of mass deception? Gee, you wail and cry like a little baby about misinformation, deception and lies all the while engaging in the same.

Hypocrite. Why the misinformation, deception and lies Pecker? To give any cause for terrorism is to be an apologist for terrorism and to delve into misinformation, deception and lies as cause for terrorism borders on fanaticism.
 

red

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Nov 13, 2001
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rogerstaubach said:
Hey Pecker, engaging in the politics of mass deception? Gee, you wail and cry like a little baby about misinformation, deception and lies all the while engaging in the same.

Hypocrite. Why the misinformation, deception and lies Pecker? To give any cause for terrorism is to be an apologist for terrorism and to delve into misinformation, deception and lies as cause for terrorism borders on fanaticism.
are you objecting to his use of "quotations" or his allegation that osama was created/nurtured by certain US government officials?
 
May 3, 2004
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red said:
are you objecting to his use of "quotations" or his allegation that osama was created/nurtured by certain US government officials?
No, no, no ...... I'm objecting to Pecker's incapability of being a sane, rational, intelligent human being.
 
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