Why I Am Voting Liberal

oldjones

CanBarelyRe Member
Aug 18, 2001
24,488
11
38
I would not vote for anybody who spent so little time in Canada in the last 20 years only returning for politics.....send him back to the USA where he belongs! Layton doesn't know his head from his ass, so that leaves Harper the lesser of all evil?!?!?!?! Give him a chance with a majority government. What a waste of tax dollar money to call an election at this time with the shaky economy thats a selfish move from the Liberalndp party.
Well it was Harper who went to the GG and asked for it. Back in 2004 he told that GG to look at the opposition before listening to a defeated PM begging for an election.

How good a PM can he be when he lets a guy who doesn't know his head from his ass and an opportunist outfox?
 

Garrett

Hail to the king, baby.
Dec 18, 2001
2,361
6
48
I find it funny how people dig in over politics, but rarely get into real policy issues. I do not think either the liberals or conservatives have a very compelling platform coming into the election. What is clear though is Iggy will build programs that will cost us billions. On the other hand, Harper has never demonstrated what I would call inspiring leadership (and anyone who thinks he is similar to a Bush-era Republican is, well, nuts). As for Layton, I have only seen disaster under an NDP government (and I have lived under a few) and truly consider him the wolf in sheep's clothing. He is really the only charismatic one of the bunch though.
 

Anynym

Just a bit to the right
Dec 28, 2005
2,961
6
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-Harper is as big a liar as I have ever seen in politics
-Attack ads reek of American political dirtiness, I don't like it!
-Harper is a massive megalomaniac to the nth degree
-Everything the current Conservative party is, is laden with Republican ideals, bullying and dirty tricks.
-Anytime anyone leads with religious fervor like Harper does, I get scared. Always separate religion and state.
-Harper has taken direct, negative interest in my means of making a living
Your hatred is your own, and it's clear that facts won't change your mind. But your list has all venom and no facts behind any of your claims (well, except for your means of making a living. I don't know what you do, but the Conservatives have taken a hard line on criminals.)
 

blackrock13

Banned
Jun 6, 2009
40,085
1
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Your hatred is your own, and it's clear that facts won't change your mind. But your list has all venom and no facts behind any of your claims (well, except for your means of making a living. I don't know what you do, but the Conservatives have taken a hard line on criminals.)
......but is the line effective. Every expert I've heard and spoken to in the field of criminology, law enforcement, and the legal system has said he's wrong and it won't work., yet he and his bum buddy Vic Teuws have ignored the advise and went ahead anyways.
 

Anynym

Just a bit to the right
Dec 28, 2005
2,961
6
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......but is the line effective. Every expert I've heard and spoken to in the field of criminology, law enforcement, and the legal system has said he's wrong and it won't work., yet he and his bum buddy Vic Teuws have ignored the advise and went ahead anyways.
You obviously haven't listened to very many experts.
 

JustSex

New member
Dec 21, 2010
468
0
0
You obviously haven't listened to very many experts.
Let see - the members of the national police chiefs have all opposed Harper's attack on the gun registry. While it was expensive to set up, they do not want it all wasted by removing it completely. I guess your experts are the writing staff of the Harper brochure writers.

I have just been bent over in yet another unjustified gas rip off and no tangible pledges to stop the process. Could it be that the fact that a sizable part of the increase is Federal and Provincial taxes rather than tax a fixed amount - is allowed to slide to ridiculous levels because both parties like the revenue ?

And what about continuous suggestion that there will be Senate reform but still both parties fill this tax paid haven with political hacks. Also both parties seem willing to accept elected members who are willing to change political sides. Let them change - but hold a by election to see if the constituents are in agreement.

Finally anyone who gets elected on a specific platform and then changes it should be charged with fraud if they cannot prove in court that the change was necessary to new circumstances. That would save the cost of continuous elections while putting some accountability in these election promises.
 

blackrock13

Banned
Jun 6, 2009
40,085
1
0
You obviously haven't listened to very many experts.

You're obviously aren't paying attention. I won't comment on a retention problem as that is saved for a select few members that you don't qualify for.

We went through this exercise about a year ago in another thread where the lawyers/PO's/CO's on this BB and members who work on the fringes of academia, the courts, and such discussed it in great length. We talked at great length and gave reference about how the death penalty did little to fight crime how the exact same program that Harper is proclaiming is an utter failure in the US, to the point where criminals are going back into jail so much that other criminals have to be let out early, some real bad asses, so as to have room. Is crime decreasing in the US? In country with more dynamic criminals systems that emphasize rehabilitation and not punishment, the crime rate has been much lower than ours, exponentially lower than the US, and going down faster.
 

blackrock13

Banned
Jun 6, 2009
40,085
1
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Let see - the members of the national police chiefs have all opposed Harper's attack on the gun registry. While it was expensive to set up, they do not want it all wasted by removing it completely. I guess your experts are the writing staff of the Harper brochure writers.

I have just been bent over in yet another unjustified gas rip off and no tangible pledges to stop the process. Could it be that the fact that a sizable part of the increase is Federal and Provincial taxes rather than tax a fixed amount - is allowed to slide to ridiculous levels because both parties like the revenue ?

And what about continuous suggestion that there will be Senate reform but still both parties fill this tax paid haven with political hacks. Also both parties seem willing to accept elected members who are willing to change political sides. Let them change - but hold a by election to see if the constituents are in agreement.

Finally anyone who gets elected on a specific platform and then changes it should be charged with fraud if they cannot prove in court that the change was necessary to new circumstances. That would save the cost of continuous elections while putting some accountability in these election promises.
Unfortunately your last point has already been tried in BC(?) and failed. With all the hullabaloo and roadblocks that are put up to keep RECAll off the books, what makes you think a politician will pass a law that might have them end up in jail.
 

oldjones

CanBarelyRe Member
Aug 18, 2001
24,488
11
38
Quite sadly right, blackrock13. In fact the appriate legal remedy in such instances would be a competency hearing for the voter who actually believed that an election promise would come to pass. Or who believe the pols who wave their enfeebled, degenerated, ineffective mutant measures they claim are the fulfillment of their promises—Harpo's "no more PM-called elections' being my personal fave.

But JustSex's remedy and mine require an assumption that voters are thoughtful, and vote intelligently for honest politicians. We're heading into a third (or is it a fourth?) election that might again anoint a proven loser as PM. With not enough of his own votes to get anything done and a proven record of not being able to find them elswhere, and prone to blame his opponents for that failing. But they vote for him again. Clearly, rationality cannot be involved in anyway.
 

nottyboi

Well-known member
May 14, 2008
22,507
1,372
113
I would not vote for anybody who spent so little time in Canada in the last 20 years only returning for politics.....send him back to the USA where he belongs! Layton doesn't know his head from his ass, so that leaves Harper the lesser of all evil?!?!?!?! Give him a chance with a majority government. What a waste of tax dollar money to call an election at this time with the shaky economy thats a selfish move from the Liberalndp party.
Why, what does that have to do with ANYTHING? Do you really think Harpo has a better understanding of Canada then Iggy? Why give Harper a chance with a majority? We have already seen what an asshole he is with a minority. That is like giving Gadhaffi nuclear weapons. Harpo has squandered the surplus it to a decade to build. The Libs put together a buffer, which they continually criticized in opposition, and squandered when in government... so when the recession hit, we ended up with record deficits. That is the stark record of your so called "safe pair of hands". Why not give Iggy a minority. If he is that bad, he will be quickly defeated and we will have a new liberal leader.
 

nottyboi

Well-known member
May 14, 2008
22,507
1,372
113
You obviously haven't listened to very many experts.
Why do you need experts? We can simply look south and see what the effect is. In the US the harsh sentences have led to a soaring crime rate as time in prison hardens criminals, forces them to join gangs and build a network of criminal contacts. The US is has the highest rate on incarceration in the world, it is bankrupting them and destroying their society.
 

wet_suit_one

New member
Aug 6, 2005
2,059
0
0
In the past, I would comment on this matter as it is about Canuck politics. A most important matter.

The only real question is whether the Liberals have been out of office long enough to purge themselves of the contempt they have for Canadians. I'm not sure that they have... Harper is a good liar (e.g. I will not tax income trusts. That one was AWESOME!!!!), as good as any politician out there, however, I'm not sure he's got the royal jelly to make a go of it. I'm prepared to suffer a Con majority under Harper for the moment. He's steered the ship of state passingly well over the last several years.

Would another minority be bad? I don't think so, but I also think that more minority government with another election in 18 months to 2 years is a waste of cash. We've got the band of idiots that we've got. Make a call (for some majority government), hold your nose and decide whether the dumbasses that were elected were the right dumbasses or not.

Sad to see that this is what democracy is reduced to, but that's life here in lalaland. It could always be so much worse!
 

oldjones

CanBarelyRe Member
Aug 18, 2001
24,488
11
38
Why do you need experts? We can simply look south and see what the effect is. In the US the harsh sentences have led to a soaring crime rate as time in prison hardens criminals, forces them to join gangs and build a network of criminal contacts. The US is has the highest rate on incarceration in the world, it is bankrupting them and destroying their society.
Geez nb! Woddya expect Cons to do? Look at places with low crime rates and copy them? Those places are socialist! (in Con/American terms, not as the rest of the world labels things.) They're societies that emphasize community and common values, human support and development. Total opposite of America. You're asking them to give up idolizing outlaws!

Try to be realistic; those super jails have nothing to do with crime. They're like the pyramids, or cargo-cult airplanes, or Stonehenge, useless and ever-grander expressions of religious attachment to comforting myths unattached to real things.
 

Don

Active member
Aug 23, 2001
6,288
10
38
Toronto
But they vote for him again. Clearly, rationality cannot be involved in anyway.
Actually the rational is that the other choices are as bad (or worse). Of course this opinion will vary depending on people's political leanings.
 

Don

Active member
Aug 23, 2001
6,288
10
38
Toronto
Look at places with low crime rates and copy them?... They're societies that emphasize community and common values, human support and development.
You mean like the Japanese? They have been praised by many for their civil behavior in the face of disaster. They are perhaps the most civil and advanced society in the world.

Oh and they have the death penalty. So we should copy them, right?
 

james t kirk

Well-known member
Aug 17, 2001
24,045
3,915
113
I am voting liberal because I still haven't forgiven the party of Diefenbaker for cancelling the Arrow.

They may have buried Diefenbaker, but they didn't bury him deep enough or soon enough as far as I'm concerned.
 

moviefan

Court jester
Mar 28, 2004
2,531
0
0
You mean like the Japanese? They have been praised by many for their civil behavior in the face of disaster. They are perhaps the most civil and advanced society in the world.

Oh and they have the death penalty.
They also have some interesting fetishes in their porn. For example, rape fantasies are common in Japanese porn.

(Hey, if you wanted to debate policy, you should have put this in the Politics forum. :D)
 

Mr. Piggy

Banned
Jul 4, 2007
3,033
1
0
Oshawa
Really?

The guy has worked in the private sector all his life and he's a "parasite"?

Contrasted to Stephen Harper who finished law school and started working for the Reform party (as a back room fluffer), then the alliance party (again as a back room fluffer), then got elected as an MP in Alberta, now as PM.

So, Iggy who worked at HARVARD as a professor, for 30 years, written books, been his own man, is a parasite, and the guy who worked for the Government all his life is not?

Boy, I guess I've had things mixed up all these years.
Iggy worked at Harvard for 30 years. That's in the US not Canada. Guess Canada wasn't good enough for him to live or work in. So now he comes back cause he thinks he can be PM. He doesn't care about Canada, just the taxpayer dollars that will be going into his pockets. Lets not forget the nice pension he will get if he does win. Like I said, fucking parasite.
 

blackrock13

Banned
Jun 6, 2009
40,085
1
0
Iggy worked at Harvard for 30 years. That's in the US not Canada. Guess Canada wasn't good enough for him to live or work in. So now he comes back cause he thinks he can be PM. He doesn't care about Canada, just the taxpayer dollars that will be going into his pockets. Lets not forget the nice pension he will get if he does win. Like I said, fucking parasite.
Give me the name of an academic who would give his left nut to teach at Harvard. The fact that he taught at some top universities in the world and for so long tell most normal thinkers he was good at what he did. Did he give up his passport or citizenship at any time? Then he was very much a full time Canadian who taught at one of the most prestigious universities in the world.

As far as Harper is concerned. Yes, he's been involved in politics since the mid 80's. A field of endeavor that is trusted by the general public just a little more than a used car salesman and proven by many of the same ilk to be just about right. In 20 years, he's worked for the Liberals, the Progressive Conservatives, and the Reformers. It sounds like he can't stay on course for very long and cares only about Steven Harper. His Masters degree in Economics comes from U of Calgary. I've never thought it to be one of the top Economic schools in Canada, I could be wrong. It certainly not on the same level of Harvard, London School of Economics, or Oxford. Apparently he dropped out of UofT. I guess he was getting a start on his career with the various national political parties.

All of the members of parliament qualify for the pension in one way or another. Are they all parasites? Get a grip MP. Hmmm, MP?
 
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