What's with the mental ilness?
- Thread starter skypilot
- Start date
10 years ago i was on zoloft because my family doc thought i was depressed. i was tired all the time didn't want to get out of bed. i was on it for 2 years it killed my sex drive so i stopped taking it. turns out i wasn't going through depression i was diabetic and my high blood sugar (29) was making me lethargic and i was really close to being in a diabetic coma.
always get full lab tests done before taking any meds, no matter how smart your doctor thinks he is
always get full lab tests done before taking any meds, no matter how smart your doctor thinks he is
Well, as sad as it may be that someone reaches that point, I am all in favour of legalizing suicide. IMO if someone's life is that bad, or they are so unhappy and truly want to end it, I say, why not?james t kirk said:
For eg: someone whose whole life revolved around sports and they were in an accident and became paralyzed from the neck down, or someone dying of lou gehrig's disease, etc. Even someone who has lost the love of their life and is severely depressed over it (I know many older couples die within months of each other because they just can't live without the other).
I have a saying I often use: there are worse things in life than dying....and this is the cold hard truth: we have more than enough people in this world, if someone really wants to check out, I say let them!
Both. One problem is that most doctors who prescribe meds for psych issues are not sufficiently qualified, don't put in the necessary time, or just don't care enough. Another problem is that the more widespread a diagnosis becomes, the more credible and socially acceptable the diagnosis becomes. Would your mother keep secret her valium use? Did you know that the Asperger Pride and neurodiversity movements are gaining traction? See Michel Foucault.skypilot said:
But it's not as bad as you think. I have no idea how to get benzo and amphetamine scripts. Should I take a trip to Canada?
People have the right to die if they want to, but it's a moral imperative that if they ask for help that you give it to them. Give them the number for a suicide hotline, but don't ignore them outright.tboy said:
So, I take your advice the first time she calls me. Turns out she kills herself. That's unfortunate, but at least I'm not an "enabler".Hank Reardon said:
One thing all ya all need to think about is if a person can only be a little mentally ill (insane). They can also be just a little sane........and you deal with them everyday.
LOL yeah, I used to see many of them sitting in bumper to bumper traffic coming into the city every morning.......papasmerf said:
Back onto the suicide issue: if someone is truly serious about suicide a) no one will know until after they've done it and b) there is nothing you can do to stop them.
For example: someone was telling me about their sister/wife/gf (I forget which) tried to commit suicide by taking pills. Only problem was they took the pills 30 minutes before this guy was supposed to show, she left the door unlocked (and normally double locks it) and called him 30 minutes prior to confirm that he was going to be on time. If this person was serious, they would have done it 8 hrs before, double locked the doors, and not said a peep to anyone.
Anyone out there who wants to kill them-self and talks about it is not serious.
Ya get one chance to do it right so make an impression.
Ya get one chance to do it right so make an impression.
Or perhaps they're ambivalent about doing it and wondering if anyone really cares.papasmerf said:
jwm
I have read this thread with great interest at to see what others think about depression, other mental illness (bi-polarism), and the use of medications. Unfortunately, I have come to the conclusion that most people still do not understand the nature of these diseases and the treatments available.
I do agree that many doctors perscribe medications as a quick fix when the illness has not been diagnosed correctly. Losing ones loved one is not clinical depression, though it may feel like it at the time. It is normal for one to greive the loss of someone close to them. This can last quite a time. I'm not stating that this is not a form of depression, it absolutely is, however in most cases, after time the person will be able to resume full functionality. Divorce, alimont payments, loss of a pet, loss of a job, etc. can cause the same temporary effect.
Clinical depression, (a feeling of uselessness, sadness, lack of motivation, cronic sleeping or insomnia, feelings it will never get better, possible thoughts of suicide) is usually caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain. Bi-polarism, is a cross between depression and mania (excitableness, jitters, cronic talking and fidgeting, sometimes confusion, anxiety, etc.).
Another way to think about it is to bicture a graph. If there was a flat horizontal line running across it that represented the emotions of a normal persion, depression would be below that line. Mania would be above the line and bi-polar would be fluctuating between the two extremes.
The typical causes of depression and bi-polarism id that the brain either produces too little or too much seratonin. The receptors that pick up the seratonin, have a problem regulating the amount needed to function normally. SSRI drugs regulate this imbalance, and allow the brain to function "almost" normally. One of the problems being, that different people react differently to different amounts of these drugs, and different variations of them. Effexor might work well at a low dose for one person, at a high dose for another, and not at all for a third. A qualified doctor may spend many months trying to figure what drugs and in what quanitities work best.
A lot of work has gone into these drugs in recent years. When I first started taking them, if I saw a child hit by a truck I wouldn't have batted an eye. I was totally emotionally numb. With the newer meds, my emotions, (sans depression), have almost fully returned. Colours are not as bright, and roses don't quite smell so sweet, if you know what I mean, but the alternative is far worse.
Further, these drugs may have some pretty harsh side effects. For some people it is impotence, problems ejaculating, dry mouth, anxiety, stomach aches, nausea, and muscle soreness. The question one must ask themselves before taking these medications is "are the side effects better than the problem of depression?" This is a question only the patient and his/her doctor can answer. It is for nobody else to decide, as others have no idea what is going through an individuals mind, and have no idea what sort of emotional pain tolerance they are capable of enduring.
Psychyitrists can and do help. Good luck getting one though, quite often they are booked months in advance and are only able to take a person on a waiting list. Qualified therapists can help as well, however not many, (if any), are covered by OHIP. At the cost of $100-$300 per week though, they may not be affordable to the masses, especially if one does not have a comprehensive benefit plan. I firmly beleive that friends and family may do more harm than good by offering advice as they are not trained and qualified, and basically do not understand and individuals issues.
One of the common misconceptions is that depression is more likely in the poor folks. Infact, depression strikes about 1 in 10 people in their lifetime regardless of age, race, or social status. It is one of the leading causes of workplace cronic absenteeism. On top of that, many depressive turn to substance abuse to help ease the pain of the depression. One of the causes of addiction is exactly that, a temporary relief from the underlying issues that are causing pain in ones life. Therefore, addiction is a symptom of a cause, an effect.
In short, in my opinion, many people do not understand what depression is, what causes it and what effective treatments are. People jump on the 'drug are bad' bandwagon, believe that a person can just shake it off, or are basically ignorant about mental illness, (through no fault of their own). The same was true of AIDS in the 1980's, with people believing it was a gay disease. With more knowledge, people learned that no one is immune, and how to take precautions to protect themselves. Unfortunately, mental illness is still usually swept under the rug and people do not understand it for what it is. An illness.
Peace, health and happiness all.
I do agree that many doctors perscribe medications as a quick fix when the illness has not been diagnosed correctly. Losing ones loved one is not clinical depression, though it may feel like it at the time. It is normal for one to greive the loss of someone close to them. This can last quite a time. I'm not stating that this is not a form of depression, it absolutely is, however in most cases, after time the person will be able to resume full functionality. Divorce, alimont payments, loss of a pet, loss of a job, etc. can cause the same temporary effect.
Clinical depression, (a feeling of uselessness, sadness, lack of motivation, cronic sleeping or insomnia, feelings it will never get better, possible thoughts of suicide) is usually caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain. Bi-polarism, is a cross between depression and mania (excitableness, jitters, cronic talking and fidgeting, sometimes confusion, anxiety, etc.).
Another way to think about it is to bicture a graph. If there was a flat horizontal line running across it that represented the emotions of a normal persion, depression would be below that line. Mania would be above the line and bi-polar would be fluctuating between the two extremes.
The typical causes of depression and bi-polarism id that the brain either produces too little or too much seratonin. The receptors that pick up the seratonin, have a problem regulating the amount needed to function normally. SSRI drugs regulate this imbalance, and allow the brain to function "almost" normally. One of the problems being, that different people react differently to different amounts of these drugs, and different variations of them. Effexor might work well at a low dose for one person, at a high dose for another, and not at all for a third. A qualified doctor may spend many months trying to figure what drugs and in what quanitities work best.
A lot of work has gone into these drugs in recent years. When I first started taking them, if I saw a child hit by a truck I wouldn't have batted an eye. I was totally emotionally numb. With the newer meds, my emotions, (sans depression), have almost fully returned. Colours are not as bright, and roses don't quite smell so sweet, if you know what I mean, but the alternative is far worse.
Further, these drugs may have some pretty harsh side effects. For some people it is impotence, problems ejaculating, dry mouth, anxiety, stomach aches, nausea, and muscle soreness. The question one must ask themselves before taking these medications is "are the side effects better than the problem of depression?" This is a question only the patient and his/her doctor can answer. It is for nobody else to decide, as others have no idea what is going through an individuals mind, and have no idea what sort of emotional pain tolerance they are capable of enduring.
Psychyitrists can and do help. Good luck getting one though, quite often they are booked months in advance and are only able to take a person on a waiting list. Qualified therapists can help as well, however not many, (if any), are covered by OHIP. At the cost of $100-$300 per week though, they may not be affordable to the masses, especially if one does not have a comprehensive benefit plan. I firmly beleive that friends and family may do more harm than good by offering advice as they are not trained and qualified, and basically do not understand and individuals issues.
One of the common misconceptions is that depression is more likely in the poor folks. Infact, depression strikes about 1 in 10 people in their lifetime regardless of age, race, or social status. It is one of the leading causes of workplace cronic absenteeism. On top of that, many depressive turn to substance abuse to help ease the pain of the depression. One of the causes of addiction is exactly that, a temporary relief from the underlying issues that are causing pain in ones life. Therefore, addiction is a symptom of a cause, an effect.
In short, in my opinion, many people do not understand what depression is, what causes it and what effective treatments are. People jump on the 'drug are bad' bandwagon, believe that a person can just shake it off, or are basically ignorant about mental illness, (through no fault of their own). The same was true of AIDS in the 1980's, with people believing it was a gay disease. With more knowledge, people learned that no one is immune, and how to take precautions to protect themselves. Unfortunately, mental illness is still usually swept under the rug and people do not understand it for what it is. An illness.
Peace, health and happiness all.
Or just head over to the Leaside Bridge.tboy said:
That's a for sure.
Just don't jump on the DVP, aim for the bush below so you don't hurt anyone else in the process.
I don't think anyone here is saying that without exception drugs are bad. But like you said, misdiagnosis (or too-quick diagnosis) leads to over-prescription. It makes it hard to figure who actually needs medication because of a chemical imbalance and who 'needs' them because they've come to rely on them. Like other have said, being depressed for good reason and for a short while (ie over the death of the loved one) does NOT warrant anti-depression meds.a 1 player said:
Shit, how about that million dollar suicide screen they put up on the Danforth Viaduct? However thought of that ought to be shot...seriously and fined for incompetence. I mean really: if someone wants to jump they can now just go one street north or south.....a perfect example of our tax dollars at work!!!james t kirk said:
Bipolar Condition is a mixture of many things. There is the biological component, as explaied in a 1 player's long post, where serotonin levels are either higher or lower than the general population. There is an inherited aspect to this, as depression tends to run in families, through multiple generations, but it need not be inherited, like a genetic disease, such as cystic fibrosis.
There is an environmental factor as well. Traumatic life events can make a pre-exising condition worse, or can manifest a latent condition.
As per a 1 player's post, most people have a fairly even temperament, most of the time. They feel sad sometimes, and euphoric other times, but only occaiionally do they deviate from the norm. Someone with bipolar disorder will often feel sad for extended periods of time, and when they are euphoric, they can tend to be over the top. It's like having a car with no 2nd or 4th gear, only 1, 3, and 5.
Depression affects one's ability to sleep, either causing the patient to sleep too often, or not enough, and for extended periods of time. It also affects memory, but not necessary an inability to remember things, but often an inability to forget things that are not beneficial to mental stability. Perhaps an event from years earlier may still haunt them, while someone else might be able to put it out of their mind, and move on.
The undiagnosed patient may be seen by others as lazy, moody, indifferent, or forgetful, and may believe this of themselves.
There is some similarity between bipolar condition and post traumatic stress. We are starting to see more and more soldiers returning from war with stress related mental injuries. Years ago, they would have been told to "Suck it up, Nancy, and be a man", and many of them did, and suffered silently.
No two people have identical genetic and environmental conditions, except perhaps the Olsen twins, and some people deal with trauma, disappointment, betrayal, ill fortune, etc. better than others.
Some people who never smoke will die of lung cancer. Some people who chain smoke will never get lung cancer. Some people who could get lung cancer will get it if they smoke, and won't if they don't. Having a serotonin inbalance just increases one's odds of developing bipolar condition if certain environmental factors occur.
Psychiatric medicine is the least precise, because different medications affect different people in different ways. For example, For about 80% of people, Zoloft will have a calming effect, while for the other 20%, it will have either no noticeable effect, or will act as a strong stimulant.
There has been some recent research into using artifical cannabinols, (ie: THC, marijuana), for the treatment of depression. That's still in the development stage, but when they get to human testing, I'm sure there will be a lineup of volunteers similar to the one at the Maple Leaf Gardens box office for concert tickets around 1972, before credit card sales by phone. I'm sure quite a few people from that lineup would be in this one, too.
There is an environmental factor as well. Traumatic life events can make a pre-exising condition worse, or can manifest a latent condition.
As per a 1 player's post, most people have a fairly even temperament, most of the time. They feel sad sometimes, and euphoric other times, but only occaiionally do they deviate from the norm. Someone with bipolar disorder will often feel sad for extended periods of time, and when they are euphoric, they can tend to be over the top. It's like having a car with no 2nd or 4th gear, only 1, 3, and 5.
Depression affects one's ability to sleep, either causing the patient to sleep too often, or not enough, and for extended periods of time. It also affects memory, but not necessary an inability to remember things, but often an inability to forget things that are not beneficial to mental stability. Perhaps an event from years earlier may still haunt them, while someone else might be able to put it out of their mind, and move on.
The undiagnosed patient may be seen by others as lazy, moody, indifferent, or forgetful, and may believe this of themselves.
There is some similarity between bipolar condition and post traumatic stress. We are starting to see more and more soldiers returning from war with stress related mental injuries. Years ago, they would have been told to "Suck it up, Nancy, and be a man", and many of them did, and suffered silently.
No two people have identical genetic and environmental conditions, except perhaps the Olsen twins, and some people deal with trauma, disappointment, betrayal, ill fortune, etc. better than others.
Some people who never smoke will die of lung cancer. Some people who chain smoke will never get lung cancer. Some people who could get lung cancer will get it if they smoke, and won't if they don't. Having a serotonin inbalance just increases one's odds of developing bipolar condition if certain environmental factors occur.
Psychiatric medicine is the least precise, because different medications affect different people in different ways. For example, For about 80% of people, Zoloft will have a calming effect, while for the other 20%, it will have either no noticeable effect, or will act as a strong stimulant.
There has been some recent research into using artifical cannabinols, (ie: THC, marijuana), for the treatment of depression. That's still in the development stage, but when they get to human testing, I'm sure there will be a lineup of volunteers similar to the one at the Maple Leaf Gardens box office for concert tickets around 1972, before credit card sales by phone. I'm sure quite a few people from that lineup would be in this one, too.
