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krealtarron

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That's what I am saying.
You think that Trump would have been able to make it so that they could oust Zelensky and assert control over the rest of Ukraine's foreign policy without sending more troops past the occupied Donbas regions? I don't think Trump would have been able to do that, but I agree that it would have prevented any larger invasion, since they would have control without having to spend troops.
Trump would have turned down Ukraine's admission to NATO, and that right there would have taken away from any Russian justifications for the invasion and it wouldn't have happened. It would have been status quo, 2014 borders.
 

krealtarron

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krealtarron

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Trump was an ideologue, I agree.
I disagree. Trump was just a selfish piece of shit obsessed with himself. His commitment to any ideology was only a matter of convenience, not conviction.
 

jcpro

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I disagree. Trump was just a selfish piece of shit obsessed with himself. His commitment to any ideology was only a matter of convenience, not conviction.
Trump’s greatest sin was turning his back on the warmongers, wanting to secure boarder while his critics lived in gated communities, and the domestic economic revival that would benefit the American workers instead of the "global village" outsourcing grifters. And they won. So, now we have wars and instability, garbage economy and open borders.
 

krealtarron

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Trump’s greatest sin was turning his back on the warmongers, wanting to secure boarder while his critics lived in gated communities, and the domestic economic revival that would benefit the American workers instead of the "global village" outsourcing grifters. And they won. So, now we have wars and instability, garbage economy and open borders.
The US does not have open borders. I have several immigrant colleagues and friends, and I will never forgive Trump for the torture he put them and their families through. This is the major reason why I absolutely detest Trump.

Trump should be the last one complaining about outsourcing. Even his MAGA hats were made in China! :ROFLMAO:

I did like his general anti-war stance and his tax cuts though.
 

danmand

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I disagree. Trump was just a selfish piece of shit obsessed with himself. His commitment to any ideology was only a matter of convenience, not conviction.
It is clear, to me anyway, that Trump has good instincts against war and use of military power.
The military establishment ignored and end ran him at every turn.
 

Valcazar

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Trump would have turned down Ukraine's admission to NATO, and that right there would have taken away from any Russian justifications for the invasion and it wouldn't have happened. It would have been status quo, 2014 borders.
You honestly think that Putin was going to go back to 2014 borders if Trump did that?
Why on earth would he?
 

krealtarron

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krealtarron

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You honestly think that Putin was going to go back to 2014 borders if Trump did that?
Why on earth would he?
There wouldn't have been a war, so he would have stayed where he was, aka 2014 borders.
 

krealtarron

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It is clear, to me anyway, that Trump has good instincts against war and use of military power.
The military establishment ignored and end ran him at every turn.
I generally agree with this that he wasn't willing to start wars or participate in any.
 

jcpro

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The US does not have open borders. I have several immigrant colleagues and friends, and I will never forgive Trump for the torture he put them and their families through. This is the major reason why I absolutely detest Trump.

Trump should be the last one complaining about outsourcing. Even his MAGA hats were made in China! :ROFLMAO:

I did like his general anti-war stance and his tax cuts though.
The border IS open. The numbers are numbers.
 
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krealtarron

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The border IS open. The numbers are numbers.
How are you defining open borders?

Does anybody get to just waltz in? Do they need to have a visa?

If the answers to those questions are "No" and "Yes", respectively, then they are not open borders.
 
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jcpro

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How are you defining open borders?

Does anybody get to just waltz in? Do they need to have a visa?

If the answers to those questions are "No" and "Yes", respectively, then they are not open borders.
The numbers are the numbers.

 

Valcazar

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I disagree. Trump was just a selfish piece of shit obsessed with himself. His commitment to any ideology was only a matter of convenience, not conviction.
I think he has an ideology wrapped up in that self interest.
I don't know if he could articulate it clearly, but that kind of "dominance is the only rule"/"rules are for suckers" belief system is an ideology.
 
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krealtarron

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Valcazar

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It is clear, to me anyway, that Trump has good instincts against war and use of military power.
The military establishment ignored and end ran him at every turn.
"War should be used to gain maximum benefit for the US at all times and no one must question our military power" is good instincts for war and the use of military power?
Good old-fashioned Jacksonian thinking?

Fuck, do we disagree about that.
 
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