WOW! Saw that live...by far THE most gruesome sports injury I have ever personally witnessed! Never want to see a guy lose like that
Ufc 168
- Thread starter Tao
- Start date
I don't see Zingano have any chances against Rousey. So far, no female competitors can even stand on the ground with her. Her judo skills are just too masterful for her opponents to handle.
We can only hope for a future Rousey vs Cyborg. That prob will never happen. Just like we all wanted to see GSP vs Silva in their primes.
Or Lesnar vs. Fedor.
If Cyborg is willing to cut to 135, Dana will probably make the fight happen, but not until he gets a couple of more fights out of Rousey in order to get maximum PPV $$.
Cyborg did tweet that she was coming after Rousey, so perhaps she'll be working on the cut, we can only hope. I hated Cyborg before but I hate Rousey infinitely more.
http://www.5thround.com/161718/cris-cyborg-justino-coming-to-get-ronda-rousey-after-ufc-168-win
I can't understand the desire to see Cyborg fight. She is poison for the sport. She would literally destroy it.
It's like some people are unaware of the steroid scandals over the last few years. They have never heard of Barry Bonds or Lance Armstrong. Roger Clemens. Mark McGwire. Marion Jones. Ben Johnson. Alex Rodriguez. It is terrible for a sport, even a beloved sport like baseball, when its greatest champions are seen as cheats. It casts a pall over the entire sport. Women's MMA, a new sport, simply doesn't have the longterm goodwill of baseball to help withstand that stain. Were Cyborg, a confirmed cheat, allowed to compete and win, the public would see the UFC as condoning steroid use, and women's MMA would take a terrible hit. The shortsightedness here is staggering.
Cyborg is a cheat. She was caught using steroids. You'd be naive to think that that was the only time. She is obviously a steroid abuser. She had that reputation before she was caught. Rousey called Cyborg out on that steroid abuse, saying she had abused throughout her career; Rousey's interviewers didn't question it and there was no backlash: Cyborg apparently has no defenders on this charge within the sport.
When caught, Cyborg, like your Lance Armstrong, was basically unrepentant, minimizing the whole thing and denying personal responsibility. This is typical: these athletes begin with denials that nobody takes seriously; followed by the inevitable confession, perjury conviction, etc. The public hates that kind of dishonesty; but Cyborg is not famous so it didn't create a stir. In my opinion, it's lying and insulting the intelligence of fans that disrespects the fans, not failing to shake a hand. (By the way, other athletes that have snubbed the handshake? LeBron James snubbed Dwight Howard after losing a playoff elimination game. Kevin Garnett snubbed Ray Allen. Conclusion? Big deal. To fuss about a denied handshake but to remain silent about the sportsmanship of a steroid abuser? Bizarre.)
Also, Cyborg looks like she abuses steroids and there is indeed a "look". There's no polite way of saying this: women who abuse steroids wind up looking excessively manly. You would have to be blind not to see that Cyborg is a steroid abuser.
Now Cyborg would no doubt become the new champion via her cheating. But the public hates cheaters and they would hate Cyborg -- which would be compounded by the fact that she has the personality of a barbell -- and wouldn't respect the UFC for rewarding cheating. And to beat Cyborg, you'd have to be 'roided up. All serious competitors would soon be 'roided up. Cyborg would surely win until she was beaten by an even more thoroughly 'roided up competitor. Nobody is going to care about a sport like that.
Basically, there are two choices: have a sport that people care about and respect or have a sport dominated by steroid users.
It's like some people are unaware of the steroid scandals over the last few years. They have never heard of Barry Bonds or Lance Armstrong. Roger Clemens. Mark McGwire. Marion Jones. Ben Johnson. Alex Rodriguez. It is terrible for a sport, even a beloved sport like baseball, when its greatest champions are seen as cheats. It casts a pall over the entire sport. Women's MMA, a new sport, simply doesn't have the longterm goodwill of baseball to help withstand that stain. Were Cyborg, a confirmed cheat, allowed to compete and win, the public would see the UFC as condoning steroid use, and women's MMA would take a terrible hit. The shortsightedness here is staggering.
Cyborg is a cheat. She was caught using steroids. You'd be naive to think that that was the only time. She is obviously a steroid abuser. She had that reputation before she was caught. Rousey called Cyborg out on that steroid abuse, saying she had abused throughout her career; Rousey's interviewers didn't question it and there was no backlash: Cyborg apparently has no defenders on this charge within the sport.
When caught, Cyborg, like your Lance Armstrong, was basically unrepentant, minimizing the whole thing and denying personal responsibility. This is typical: these athletes begin with denials that nobody takes seriously; followed by the inevitable confession, perjury conviction, etc. The public hates that kind of dishonesty; but Cyborg is not famous so it didn't create a stir. In my opinion, it's lying and insulting the intelligence of fans that disrespects the fans, not failing to shake a hand. (By the way, other athletes that have snubbed the handshake? LeBron James snubbed Dwight Howard after losing a playoff elimination game. Kevin Garnett snubbed Ray Allen. Conclusion? Big deal. To fuss about a denied handshake but to remain silent about the sportsmanship of a steroid abuser? Bizarre.)
Also, Cyborg looks like she abuses steroids and there is indeed a "look". There's no polite way of saying this: women who abuse steroids wind up looking excessively manly. You would have to be blind not to see that Cyborg is a steroid abuser.
Now Cyborg would no doubt become the new champion via her cheating. But the public hates cheaters and they would hate Cyborg -- which would be compounded by the fact that she has the personality of a barbell -- and wouldn't respect the UFC for rewarding cheating. And to beat Cyborg, you'd have to be 'roided up. All serious competitors would soon be 'roided up. Cyborg would surely win until she was beaten by an even more thoroughly 'roided up competitor. Nobody is going to care about a sport like that.
Basically, there are two choices: have a sport that people care about and respect or have a sport dominated by steroid users.
I hate to break this to you but if you think that the men and even some of the current and former champs are clean than I got a bridge to sell you.
I understand that doping exists, probably in all sports, and at the highest levels. But I also think that there are plenty of clean athletes that excel. And I think there are athletes who make mistakes with supplements and own up to it. And then there are your Lance Armstrongs, your Barry Bonds, and your Cyborgs.
And there is no athlete in men's MMA as toxic as Cyborg.
My main point is that when a professional athlete or professional sport is blatantly indifferent to doping it often causes the public to turn against the athlete or the sport, and that is the risk in letting Cyborg, a blatant and unapologetic doper, compete.
If there were a male MMA champion who, like Cyborg, was clearly doping, was doping so much that he looked 'roided up compared to everyone else, who showed no remorse when caught and instead brushed if off, and instead demanded championship fights, and insisted that clean fighters move to be at his weight class, and if the UFC condoned and accommodated that behaviour, it would tarnish all of men's MMA in exactly the same way. The same considerations apply to the treatment of doping in men's and women's MMA.
In fact, not only is Cyborg unrepentant, she is arrogant. She cheats and then has the nerve to expect that other fighters should move up to her weight class! And let's face it, the higher weight makes it easier for her to dope. So it looks, I think to any reasonable observer, like she is asking the UFC to run women's MMA around her doping. That is some chutzpah. There is no male MMA fighter that has been caught cheating and then displayed such a comedically arrogant attitude. But when we see that attitude from male athletes in other sports, like Lance Armstrong, the public heaps scorn on them. The wider public is not going to take a sport seriously if they tolerate athletes like that.
If you want a sport that appeals to the best and brightest, and to the younger generation, you have to get rid of your Armstrongs, your Bonds, and your Cyborgs. If you want to consign the sport to irrelevance, then yes, encourage athletes like Cyborg.
I'm wondering if you think Rousey dopes? I really doubt it. I don't think Tate dopes either. To me, that looked like a fair fight, where the more skilled fighter won. Rousey probably can live without juicing because of her skill-set. I look at women's MMA, and most fighters do not look juiced up. Couldn't that mean that they are not juicing up?
Why do you think Cyborg looks so different from these other women? I'm by no means an expert, but I'd say it's because she's doing something different. She's an abuser.
It would, to me, scream unfairness to have an obvious and proven doper like Cyborg bulldoze Rousey. To me, it's better for the sport to gear towards fighters like Rousey, rather than Cyborg.
I think that the point I'm making that I think is being missed here is that doping is not good for the growth of a sport. You point to men's MMA, but it's not that big relative to other sports. There are no iconic fighters from men's MMA: no Jordans, no Alis, no Gretzkys no Ruths (notice the icons from baseball are mostly old, as it has been dogged by drug scandals in recent years). This is a serious point, because great sports have iconic athletes. And iconic athletes cannot be cheaters, or at least, cannot be seen to be cheaters. I've been talking about Cyborg mostly, but the same kind of problem could stop men's MMA from reaching higher levels.
And I think people are missing the point I'm trying to make here, so I'll put it like this, and wonder if anyone could answer:
Do you think Rousey v Cyborg is a fair fight? Why? Is a fight like that good for women's MMA? I realize they are currently at different weights. If you can think of a situation where you think it would be fair, I'd be glad to hear it.
If women's MMA can be geared so that it doesn't favour steroid users like Cyborg, and instead favours Rousey's style, which I think rewards skill more than pure brawn, isn't that better for the sport?
I agree with you Kat.
This card was quick...almost all did not leave the first round. ...Barret and of course Silva were brutal to watch.
In my opinion Weidman was lucky....first match his luck was due to Silva fooling around, he wanted to lose. The second fight Silva wanted to win (remember has has been beat bad in the opening round before and has won) but he literally had a tough break. It is a shame. At least he did not cop out like GSP did and wanted a rematch 2 days after the first.
Tate, could have won the match. It appears to have been ego or gruge that diluted her sense of a tactical offense or defense that was her plan as she mentioned...stay away from Rousey and attack..do not grapple...she did not do this..she kept at her. She lost this fight on her own. She went the mile...even got out of a few submissions. She could have won.
This card was quick...almost all did not leave the first round. ...Barret and of course Silva were brutal to watch.
In my opinion Weidman was lucky....first match his luck was due to Silva fooling around, he wanted to lose. The second fight Silva wanted to win (remember has has been beat bad in the opening round before and has won) but he literally had a tough break. It is a shame. At least he did not cop out like GSP did and wanted a rematch 2 days after the first.
Tate, could have won the match. It appears to have been ego or gruge that diluted her sense of a tactical offense or defense that was her plan as she mentioned...stay away from Rousey and attack..do not grapple...she did not do this..she kept at her. She lost this fight on her own. She went the mile...even got out of a few submissions. She could have won.
Well as I recall one Josh Barnett has tested positive 3 times in his career and not once has he admitted that he was guilty.
If you remember he single handily torpedoed his fight with Fedor and the Affliction card was cancelled as a result of his failing a drug test. Of which he accepted no culpability I might add.
Kevin Randelman was suspended when his urine sample was deemed to be not from a human,lol. He has never addressed the topic. Go figure.
Chael Sonnen rejected any responsibility when he failed his drug test. I watched the stream of his hearing before the commission and it was laughable how he claimed his naivety on how this could happen to him and his excuses for not filling out the right paperwork. In interviews he stated that if he didn't receive TRT he could die. Yeah okay.lol.
Bigfoot Silva who just might have a legitimate case for TRT tested positive for Boldenone when he was in Elite XC. He claimed the positive test was for Nolvadex which he needed to boost his testosterone level because he has acromegaly. He never explained why he had Boldenone which is a veterinary steroid in his system however.
Cris Justino career was being managed and controlled by her husband at the time Evangelita Santos. When she tested positive most of the MMA community knew that her team had walked her down that path. She has since divorced him and signed with Tito and completely revamped her training and her life. I have never seen one interview where she seemed arrogant or unrepentant. In fact I personally know a few people who have brought her up here for a seminar and signing and said she was extremely humble and gracious in her demeanour. To say she is a ''poison'' in the sport is just ignorant.
Weidman was lucky? When Anderson was fooling around in the first fight what was he supposed to do stop trying and beg him to take him more seriously?
The broken leg was from a brilliant check from Chris. That's applying great coaching and training not a fluke or luck by any stretch. Remember he was getting hammered by leg kicks in the first fight and he said in the post fight presser that they specifically worked on that in the camp leading up to this fight.
Tate just doesn't have the tools to beat Ronda. Her striking just isn't good enough to keep Rousey from getting in on her. And although she has good jits her ground game is nowhere near Ronda's. Meisha is now in Rich Franklin territory and she knows it.
Vuillard, Lesnar I wouldn't be surprised using enhancements...GSP maybe for recovery.
But Gracie??? When was his? 90's?
Weismann lucky? Silva was apparently he all star and goofed around plenty of times in the past and managed to get away with it.
He just didn't get away with it with Weidman. Another thing to keep in mind, Weidman knocked Silva down in the last fight with a very strong right hook to the head...almost knocked him right out.
Weidman doesn't look like Much, but he certainly is gaining confidence and showing people he deserves that title.
He checked the kick, which his trainer/coach wanted to do after the first fight and it paid off.
The end.
I hope Weidman knocks Belfort out when they meet.
If anyone thinks Rousey, with her manly shoulders and traps bigger than most men, is clean- they are simply stupid. No other way to put. Her physique from her Judo days has transformed immensely. She's not clean. She's just got a good "team" around her who knows how to cycle properly. GSP isn't clean. Wiedman isn't clean. Lesnar wasn't clean. 95% of these guys aren't clean.
Anyone who has taken the juice or has seriously trained can take one look at Rousey and see her Cypionate traps to know she's as clean as a Gas Station toilet.
Anyone who has taken the juice or has seriously trained can take one look at Rousey and see her Cypionate traps to know she's as clean as a Gas Station toilet.
I highly doubt that Rousey or any other female in the UFC would take the compound testosterone cypionate.
Others maybe but not that one. It would make the weight cut extremely difficult with it's androgenic properties.
McMann couldn't finish Shayna Baszler and we saw how well she did on TUF. So that has me a little worried about her title credibility.
Dana probably had posters made up with Tate and McMann as well Kathleen. But yeah he's becoming more and more just like a dare I say MMA pimp.
Here's a lesson I learned a long time ago. Unless you actually see someone taking something then everything else is sheer speculation and should be treated as such.
Seems like a lot of fighters are using TRT, likely taking large doses then cutting down as testing time comes around. This is why I have lost respect for Belfort, he has become a ripped aggressive freak in the past few years. How does a guy get actually more muscular and stronger as he moves past his mid 30's?
http://www.titocouture.com/brazilian-commission-defends-allowing-belfort-to-fight-on-trt/
Speaking of TRT, I'm now in my mid 40's and have been completely unable to reduce my body fat, seems like the body goes to hell after 45. Has anyone here actually taken TRT and noticed a difference? I'm not looking to become a muscular freak but despite exercising more and eating better than I did 20 years ago my body is going crap.
http://www.titocouture.com/brazilian-commission-defends-allowing-belfort-to-fight-on-trt/
Speaking of TRT, I'm now in my mid 40's and have been completely unable to reduce my body fat, seems like the body goes to hell after 45. Has anyone here actually taken TRT and noticed a difference? I'm not looking to become a muscular freak but despite exercising more and eating better than I did 20 years ago my body is going crap.
Firstly you have to determine if you have low testosterone levels or not.
That means a trip to your doctor and he has to order blood tests.
He should order, LH, FSH, Total Testosterone, Free Testosterone. Or if you want to pay for it, Bioavailable Testosterone ( some doctors believe this is the best one but OHIP won't cover it)
If your levels are below the given ranges then you are a candidate for TRT.
Then the fun begins. The levels that the Ontario College Of Physicians allows a doctor to prescribe are generally to low to make much of a difference however some doctors will go outside of the guidelines to achieve a proper level for you.
Patients receiving TRT generally report increased libido, increased musculature as well as a decrease in body fat.
But the long term affects on prostrate growth have yet to be fully understood. As well the effect on male pattern baldness.
