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Trump's approach to Iran is muddled and unpredictable

bver_hunter

Well-known member
Nov 5, 2005
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Trump does stuff on impulse. The day he withdrew that Iranian Treaty based on his whims and fancies to just please his base and cause resentment among the NATO allies, is creating a mess. This mess gets worse by the minute!!

Early Tuesday, pro-Iranian Iraqi militia members and demonstrators stormed the US Embassy compound in Baghdad after the Trump administration's airstrikes on a Iranian-backed militia on Sunday. The embassy attack, perhaps the worst crisis between Iraq and the US since 2003, reveals the inconsistency and vulnerability of the Trump administration's policies toward both Iran and Iraq.

Like a modern-day Gulliver, President Trump is metaphorically wandering around a Middle East where he'd rather not be, tied up both by smaller powers whose interests are not his own -- and by America's illusions about the region, perpetuated by Trump who somehow believes he can force Iran to bend to his will. The odds are that the situation for the US in Iraq and Iran is likely to get worse before it gets still worse.
US in a bind
The US had little choice but to respond on Sunday to recent pro-Iranian Iraqi militia attacks against US forces in Kirkuk, which claimed the life of an American contractor and wounded US forces. The Trump administration needed both to deter and signal to Tehran that such attacks were unacceptable. Failure to do so would have left the administration in violation of one of its own red lines -- that the US would not tolerate attacks against Americans.

But the US attacks in response seemed intentionally disproportionate, killing at least 25 militia and injuring scores of others . And it seems the US did not take into consideration that the airstrikes would seriously embarrass the government of Iraq or could lead to reactions like a storming of the American Embassy.
The storming of the embassy raises questions as to why the administration didn't think through how Tehran might respond to Sunday's airstrikes on five pro-Iranian militia bases in Iraq and Syria, and why security at the embassy wasn't beefed up in advance.
The US doesn't have home court advantage
Iran has effectively coordinated attacks against US forces before, especially during the early phases of the Iraq war. But following this most recent attack, it should be clear that Washington isn't on a level playing field in Iraq and that Iran enjoys a tremendous advantage, for a number of reasons.

First, the Iraqi government is much more financially and economically dependent on its Iranian neighbor than it is obligated to the US. Iraq is the second-largest importer of Iranian non-oil commodities, and Iran is a key supplier of electricity to the country's southern region.
Second, while we have spent billions in training, equipping and assisting Iraqi security forces with arguably a fair amount of success, the integration of several of the most pro-Iranian militias into those security forces is increasingly problematic. These forces have played a role in brutally helping the Iraqi government repress recent Shia demonstrators, and the initial storming of the embassy compound could not have been accomplished without government security forces' acquiescence to the militias.
Third, the US handed Iran a tremendous propaganda advantage. It has turned anti-Iranian sentiment among Iraqis against the US and sparked protesters at the US Embassy to throw rocks and chant "Death to America."
What's Trump's end game with Iran?
Things appear calmer around the embassy Wednesday morning. But it's too early to determine whether recent events will lead to a broader US confrontation with Iranian proxies or Iran itself. One thing is clear: President Trump's approach to Iran is muddled by a number of cross-cutting factors which make any policy move on Iran unpredictable.
On one hand, in the wake of his withdrawal from the Iran nuclear accord, Trump launched a tough-minded campaign of maximum pressure on sanctions that's devastated Iran's economy. But such sanctions have neither halted Iran's regional activities in Lebanon, Yemen or Iraq, nor made it any more flexible on nuclear issues.
On the other hand, his tough rhetoric withstanding, Trump has made clear many times that he'd like to sit with Iranian President Rouhani, presumably to negotiate a new and better nuclear deal. And risk averse when it comes to confronting Iran directly, he chose not to respond by striking Iran in retaliation for its attacks on Saudi oil facilities last September.
As we enter 2020 and an election year, it's unlikely that this confusion will end anytime soon, raising serious questions about what Trump really wants -- to weaken Iran, change the regime or cut a new nuclear deal.

Trump, who ran on a platform of withdrawing from the Middle East and would just as soon get out of these unwinnable wars, faces a genuine conundrum: how to avoid looking weak but avoid triggering a messy conflict with Iran and deeper involvement in Iraq that would be certain to alienate his base and energize his opponents.
On Tuesday night, Trump threatened that Iran would pay a "big price" for the embassy storming. But it remains to be seen whether this is characteristic Trumpian bluster, or an uncharacteristic threat from the President that actually leads to a more aggressive American response to Iran.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/01/01/opinions/trump-approach-iran-muddled-unpredictable/index.html
 

LickingGravity

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Sep 9, 2010
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Well Bevr you seem have firm grasp of the obvious in regards to Trump. It's taken a long time. Now see if you can apply that same logic to Trudeau.
 

bver_hunter

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Nov 5, 2005
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Hey Licking, a screw up, is a screw up is a screw up. Any excuses for Trump, or is it just a deflection to throw Trudeau into a mix that he has nothing to do with??
 

drawcoat

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Sep 2, 2004
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Wrong again Charlamenge, so wrong. KABOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM goes that general. This is a great day for freedom and justice. That douche Bag has the blood of thousands americans on his hand.

He's been working all day. Even CNN can't find someone to blame Trump.

Just more FAKE NEWS Charlotte. Your good at that
 

bver_hunter

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Nov 5, 2005
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LMAO!!! So true!
I agree, that this is very true. All along, the Republicans and the right wingers on this Board came up with that constant nonsense about how Trump would pull out the Americans troops out of the Middle East. But he has escalated it and now we are going to see tit for tats. Tearing up that Iranian Nuclear Treaty was a true and utter cockup. Now we are seeing the biggest mess since Bush's Iraq War!!
 

Gooseifur

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Aug 13, 2019
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The American War Machine put him up to this and he fell for it. He's not running the show they are. It's about time for another war. They need to test their new military equipment on humans. It's not any presidents fault when the go to war, it's the military war complex behind them.
 

bver_hunter

Well-known member
Nov 5, 2005
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The American War Machine put him up to this and he fell for it. He's not running the show they are. It's about time for another war. They need to test their new military equipment on humans. It's not any presidents fault when the go to war, it's the military war complex behind them.
Then Trump should have shared this information with the Intel Committees prior to this strike. I agree that this is now where this is headed for.... a new war!!
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
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The American War Machine put him up to this and he fell for it. He's not running the show they are. It's about time for another war. They need to test their new military equipment on humans. It's not any presidents fault when the go to war, it's the military war complex behind them.
This is all Trump.
He made the call, didn't let congress or his allies know and then went and tweeted out an american flag as it happened.

This is Trump.
 

Gooseifur

Well-known member
Aug 13, 2019
3,766
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This is all Trump.
He made the call, didn't let congress or his allies know and then went and tweeted out an american flag as it happened.

This is Trump.
He has the final say but he was given information by the industrial war machine to make this strike. Don't forget how much shit he got for wanting to pull out of Syria. The industrial military complex loves war, thrives of it. They needed to give him an excuse to do it. Ultimately the responsibility is his but he is influenced by a lot of people.
 

bver_hunter

Well-known member
Nov 5, 2005
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He has the final say but he was given information by the industrial war machine to make this strike. Don't forget how much shit he got for wanting to pull out of Syria. The industrial military complex loves war, thrives of it. They needed to give him an excuse to do it. Ultimately the responsibility is his but he is influenced by a lot of people.
The manner in which Trump pulled out of Syria was condemned rightfully so, by both sides of the aisle, especially as the biggest ally in the region in the form of the Kurds, had to pay the price for it.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
82,290
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He has the final say but he was given information by the industrial war machine to make this strike. Don't forget how much shit he got for wanting to pull out of Syria. The industrial military complex loves war, thrives of it. They needed to give him an excuse to do it. Ultimately the responsibility is his but he is influenced by a lot of people.
I thought he doesn't trust US intel, the CIA or the FBI.
Now you're saying he does and he's just their puppet?
Even after he's fired most of the state department and ambassadors and put in his own leaders of all those agencies?

The word is that this was Trump's personal decision.
Stop trying to excuse him.
 

Gooseifur

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Aug 13, 2019
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I thought he doesn't trust US intel, the CIA or the FBI.
Now you're saying he does and he's just their puppet?
Even after he's fired most of the state department and ambassadors and put in his own leaders of all those agencies?

The word is that this was Trump's personal decision.
Stop trying to excuse him.
Well according to most people he's not that smart. He got the intel from someone and advice from someone, yes ultimately it's his decision but you can't pretend there aren't influences within the government getting what they want.
 

Gooseifur

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Aug 13, 2019
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Then Trump should have shared this information with the Intel Committees prior to this strike. I agree that this is now where this is headed for.... a new war!!
He didn't need to inform anyone of a strike, war, yes, a strike, no. Timing was of the essence because the target could have moved, just like when Obama got Bin-Laden, he didn't tell congress either.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
82,290
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He didn't need to inform anyone of a strike, war, yes, a strike, no. Timing was of the essence because the target could have moved, just like when Obama got Bin-Laden, he didn't tell congress either.
Killing Iran's #2 commander, a country that the US is not presently at war with, is not just a strike.
 

bver_hunter

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Nov 5, 2005
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He didn't need to inform anyone of a strike, war, yes, a strike, no. Timing was of the essence because the target could have moved, just like when Obama got Bin-Laden, he didn't tell congress either.
He should have informed the Intel Committees prior to the strike as this is not just a target of an individual, but of a General in what is now a rival nation. Just not true that Obama did not inform the Intel Committees. He clearly did so, prior to the killing of Osama Bin Laden!!

https://www.latimes.com/politics/la-xpm-2011-may-01-la-pn-congressreax-binladen-20110501-story.html
 

Gooseifur

Well-known member
Aug 13, 2019
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He should have informed the Intel Committees prior to the strike as this is not just a target of an individual, but of a General in what is now a rival nation. Just not true that Obama did not inform the Intel Committees. He clearly did so, prior to the killing of Osama Bin Laden!!

https://www.latimes.com/politics/la-xpm-2011-may-01-la-pn-congressreax-binladen-20110501-story.html
Wrong!!! Your article states he informed congress of the death of Bin Laden before he made the announcement to the public not about the actual mission. He actually entered another country without their knowledge to get Bin Laden and also didn't tell congress. Here is what really happened.
https://www.nytimes.com/2015/10/29/us/politics/obama-legal-authorization-osama-bin-laden-raid.html

You were in such a hurry to condemn Trump and kiss Obama's ass you didn't read your own article.
 
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