And then Phaneuf, Bozak and Orr for Stamkos.
Actually, he could package all 5 of those Leafs and still not get even one of the above choices.
Toronto Maple Leafs 2014/15 Season
- Thread starter Ironhead
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Actually, he could package all 5 of those Leafs and still not get even one of the above choices.
I agree with you on the first 2 forward lines. I think Santorelli will be 3rd line centre with Komarov and Booth. 4th line Kontiola-Winnik-Bodie.Predicting my lineup.
JVR Bozak Kessel
Lupul Kadri Clarkson
Komarov Kontiola Winnik
Frattin Santorelli Bodie
Phaneuf Polak
Rielly Gardiner
Robidas Franson
Bernier
Reimer
Defensive pairings
Phaneuf Robidas
Gardiner Franson
Rielly Polak
Holzer
Yup, that easy huh? Have you submitted your application yet? Wait Dubass was more qualified.
Why he would just go out and acquire Crosby from the Pens or Getzlaf from the Ducks for Kadri and Reimer. Apparently it is that easy.
Go back an look at the names I listed above. No one said Crosby, Stamkos, or Getzlaf. The fact is that the names I mentioned have ALL been acquireable commodities in the last three seasons. Tell me why the Leafs weren't willing or able to land anything even close? Even John Tavares was available at one point, but never heard of even the remotest interest or effort in trying to acquire him. Wouldn't he be a player you could rebuild around if you were serious about actually rebuilding?And then Phaneuf, Bozak and Orr for Stamkos.
Actually, he could package all 5 of those Leafs and still not get even one of the above choices.
Even though nothing materialized, do you know for a fact that the Leafs had no discussions regarding these players?Go back an look at the names I listed above. No one said Crosby, Stamkos, or Getzlaf. The fact is that the names I mentioned have ALL been acquireable commodities in the last three seasons. Tell me why the Leafs weren't willing or able to land anything even close? Even John Tavares was available at one point, but never heard of even the remotest interest or effort in trying to acquire him. Wouldn't he be a player you could rebuild around if you were serious about actually rebuilding?
If there were discussions, what were the other teams asking for?
A lot of the times these discussions happen without the media knowing. Thus, the fans don't know about it. So we can't assume that the Leafs did not take to someone like Stamkos.Even though nothing materialized, do you know for a fact that the Leafs had no discussions regarding these players?
If there were discussions, what were the other teams asking for?
So this is my original point. If they did, and just couldn't get any deal done for anyone of quality, that kinda speaks to Nonis' ineptitude as a capable GM. If they didn't chase the quality players believing they could still be competitive with the stiffs they did acquire (which appears to be the case) it's even more damning evidence. How long has Nonis been in town now wearing the big hat? Truly good GM's get big deals done, either at the draft, thru free agency, or at the trade deadline. What exactly has been Nonis' BIG move considering his team, on the whole, is still likely a non-playoff team? Do you ever even hear him talk of pushing hard for a big fish?Even though nothing materialized, do you know for a fact that the Leafs had no discussions regarding these players?
If there were discussions, what were the other teams asking for?
Aaargh. I had a good long post that just got erased. Might try again later when I'm not so aggravated. Sorry.So this is my original point. If they did, and just couldn't get any deal done for anyone of quality, that kinda speaks to Nonis' ineptitude as a capable GM. If they didn't chase the quality players believing they could still be competitive with the stiffs they did acquire (which appears to be the case) it's even more damning evidence. How long has Nonis been in town now wearing the big hat? Truly good GM's get big deals done, either at the draft, thru free agency, or at the trade deadline. What exactly has been Nonis' BIG move considering his team, on the whole, is still likely a non-playoff team? Do you ever even hear him talk of pushing hard for a big fish?
I'm not sure what kind of back room info you're privy to, to be this presumptuous about what the Leafs are able / willing or not willing to do, but it doesn't make sense.Go back an look at the names I listed above. No one said Crosby, Stamkos, or Getzlaf. The fact is that the names I mentioned have ALL been acquireable commodities in the last three seasons. Tell me why the Leafs weren't willing or able to land anything even close? Even John Tavares was available at one point, but never heard of even the remotest interest or effort in trying to acquire him. Wouldn't he be a player you could rebuild around if you were serious about actually rebuilding?
An impact centre man is the most valuable and scarcest commodity in hockey. Would you take a bunch of 'stiffs' for one real difference maker.
There was nothing the Leafs could have offered to pry Tavares from Long Island. Anyone who believes that is literally nuts.
The only chance they have to get a good young stud centre would be to give up Gardiner along with another frontline player or top prospect.
There's no way around it. Gardiner, as much as I love this guy, is the most attractive piece.
He's young, not even in his prime, he's a proven stud, and he's locked in for 5 years at a great price.
You gotta give up something to get something, especially if you want something up the middle.
Why couldn't the Leafs have offered say, Bozak, Kadri and Gardiner for Tavares? Throw in a draft pick, throw in more 3rd tier players. Tavares was not considered an untouchable/untradable commodity when his contract was being reviewed. Yours is exactly the kind of 'can't do' mindset that has overshadowed the Leafs for years. No balls at all.I'm not sure what kind of back room info you're privy to, to be this presumptuous about what the Leafs are able / willing or not willing to do, but it doesn't make sense.
An impact centre man is the most valuable and scarcest commodity in hockey. Would you take a bunch of 'stiffs' for one real difference maker.
There was nothing the Leafs could have offered to pry Tavares from Long Island. Anyone who believes that is literally nuts.
The only chance they have to get a good young stud centre would be to give up Gardiner along with another frontline player or top prospect.
There's no way around it. Gardiner, as much as I love this guy, is the most attractive piece.
He's young, not even in his prime, he's a proven stud, and he's locked in for 5 years at a great price.
You gotta give up something to get something, especially if you want something up the middle.
So you'd do a 5 for 1, 3 of whom are top tier, plus a draft pic for 1.Why couldn't the Leafs have offered say, Bozak, Kadri and Gardiner for Tavares? Throw in a draft pick, throw in more 3rd tier players. Tavares was not considered an untouchable/untradable commodity when his contract was being reviewed. Yours is exactly the kind of 'can't do' mindset that has overshadowed the Leafs for years. No balls at all.
That's a lot of bodies you'd have to replace with more than just average talent to be successful. Sometimes what appears to be lack of balls may actually be lots of brains.
To begin with, I never said Tavares was untouchable or untradeable.Why couldn't the Leafs have offered say, Bozak, Kadri and Gardiner for Tavares? Throw in a draft pick, throw in more 3rd tier players. Tavares was not considered an untouchable/untradable commodity when his contract was being reviewed. Yours is exactly the kind of 'can't do' mindset that has overshadowed the Leafs for years. No balls at all.
But I see now, according to you, I apparently have no balls.
So, lets see how you do for brains.
John Tavares agreed to terms on a new contract in mid September, 2011.
Let's look at what you're offering. As of September, 2011, this is what Islanders' management would have seen from the players' pro experience.
Tyler Bozak
Games Goals Assists Points +/-
2010-11 Toronto NHL 82 15 17 32 -29
2009-10 Toronto NHL 37 8 19 27 -5
Toronto AHL 32 4 16 20 -8
Jake Gardiner
2010-11 Toronto AHL 10 0 3 3 4
Nazem Kadri
2010-11 Toronto NHL 29 3 9 12 -3
Toronto AHL 44 17 24 41 2
2009-10 Toronto NHL 1 0 0 0 -1
+ 3rd tier players and "throw in a draft pick" (? )
So, based on this , along with the fact that upside potential at the time was undetermined or modest at best, you would have made this deal if you were the Islanders' GM?
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Who said anything about 2011? A good GM could have made that trade work anytime after last season ended. The Isles are always open for business given their financial situation, and winning a cup ain't gonna happen for them anytime soon, so....To begin with, I never said Tavares was untouchable or untradeable.
But I see now, according to you, I apparently have no balls.
So, lets see how you do for brains.
John Tavares agreed to terms on a new contract in mid September, 2011.
Let's look at what you're offering. As of September, 2011, this is what Islanders' management would have seen from the players' pro experience.
Tyler Bozak
Games Goals Assists Points +/-
2010-11 Toronto NHL 82 15 17 32 -29
2009-10 Toronto NHL 37 8 19 27 -5
Toronto AHL 32 4 16 20 -8
Jake Gardiner
2010-11 Toronto AHL 10 0 3 3 4
Nazem Kadri
2010-11 Toronto NHL 29 3 9 12 -3
Toronto AHL 44 17 24 41 2
2009-10 Toronto NHL 1 0 0 0 -1
+ 3rd tier players and "throw in a draft pick" (? )
So, based on this , along with the fact that upside potential at the time was undetermined or modest at best, you would have made this deal if you were the Islanders' GM?
Isn't that what you meant here?Who said anything about 2011? A good GM could have made that trade work anytime after last season ended. The Isles are always open for business given their financial situation, and winning a cup ain't gonna happen for them anytime soon, so....
Why couldn't the Leafs have offered say, Bozak, Kadri and Gardiner for Tavares? Throw in a draft pick, throw in more 3rd tier players. Tavares was not considered an untouchable/untradable commodity when his contract was being reviewed.
No. What I meant was that even though Tavares was signed to a six year deal, no one on the island was ruling out a potential sign and trade given their cash crunch. There is even a modified NTC/NMC in his deal to ensure the Isles could potentially move him if the right deal came along. That says to me they didn't/don't consider him an untouchable.Isn't that what you meant here?
Well, the inference seemed to be that the opportunity for Tavares to be had was when his contract was being reviewed.No. What I meant was that even though Tavares was signed to a six year deal, no one on the island was ruling out a potential sign and trade given their cash crunch. There is even a modified NTC/NMC in his deal to ensure the Isles could potentially move him if the right deal came along. That says to me they didn't/don't consider him an untouchable.
Nonetheless, the fact that he's not untouchable doesn't make him any less unattainable for some teams given their rosters or circumstances.
Btw, no one is untouchable given the right deal.
At what point after Tavares signed, would you say this deal would have made sense to the Islanders?
I don't get the infatuation with Tavares. Very good player but he hasn't taken the Isles anywhere and does anyone see him carrying any other team? He eats up a lot of cap space so if you give up multiple roster players to
get him, unless those players are high salaried you end up replacing the traded players with less skilled skaters.
get him, unless those players are high salaried you end up replacing the traded players with less skilled skaters.
Tavares is a tremendous player. As an individual and as a team player and top notch character.I don't get the infatuation with Tavares. Very good player but he hasn't taken the Isles anywhere and does anyone see him carrying any other team? He eats up a lot of cap space so if you give up multiple roster players to
get him, unless those players are high salaried you end up replacing the traded players with less skilled skaters.
I think his hockey IQ is easily the highest in the league. He's impressed me every game I ever seen him play.
He dominates in the offensive zone, and who does he play with.
He was Hart Trophy finalist in 2013. Last year he missed 23 games, but his ppg was second only to Crosby.
All this in an insane asylum of a hockey organization.
He's in at 5.5M for the next 4 years. To say that is the best value in the NHL is the understatement of the century.
And he's only 24.
Exactly why Nonis should be going after him hard! :wink:Tavares is a tremendous player. As an individual and as a team player and top notch character.
I think his hockey IQ is easily the highest in the league. He's impressed me every game I ever seen him play.
He dominates in the offensive zone, and who does he play with.
He was Hart Trophy finalist in 2013. Last year he missed 23 games, but his ppg was second only to Crosby.
All this in an insane asylum of a hockey organization.
He's in at 5.5M for the next 4 years. To say that is the best value in the NHL is the understatement of the century.
And he's only 24.
The puck drops on the 2014/15 NHL season tomorrow.
If I am not mistaken the first game to start is Montreal at Toronto.
The Leafs have one more move to make to get down to the 23 man roster(last minute trade, send a player down or place on IR).
This appears to be the line up for tomorrow night's opener.
van Riemsdyk-Bozak-Kessel
Kozun-Kadri-Lupul
Komarov-Santorelli-Clarkson
Winnik-Holland-Frattin
Phaneuf Robidas
Gardiner Rielly
Percy Polak
Bernier
Reimer
If I am not mistaken the first game to start is Montreal at Toronto.
The Leafs have one more move to make to get down to the 23 man roster(last minute trade, send a player down or place on IR).
This appears to be the line up for tomorrow night's opener.
van Riemsdyk-Bozak-Kessel
Kozun-Kadri-Lupul
Komarov-Santorelli-Clarkson
Winnik-Holland-Frattin
Phaneuf Robidas
Gardiner Rielly
Percy Polak
Bernier
Reimer
What cash crunch? To my knowledge, the Islanders were struggling to get withing the salary cap floor.No. What I meant was that even though Tavares was signed to a six year deal, no one on the island was ruling out a potential sign and trade given their cash crunch. There is even a modified NTC/NMC in his deal to ensure the Isles could potentially move him if the right deal came along. That says to me they didn't/don't consider him an untouchable.
