Toronto cops make mad loot writing tickets. Still think the system isn't corrupt?

[AK-47]

If you think it's such a cushy deal, then strap on a badge and a gun and a kevlar vest and hit the streets!!

How has this evolved to: "If you think it's such a cushy deal, then strap on a badge and a gun and a kevlar vest and hit the streets"

Really what you're saying is please excuse our OT court money, because we get shot at and deserve it!!

Isnt that what you're saying???

 

[viking1965]

Well thanks for writing that out for me, and yes thats exactly what cops hope for, its called playing the percentages, the more tickets you write, the more you go to court.

Simple isnt it??

Yes, and in the process, more "offenders" pay more fines (net $8MM after all expenses according to the article) and our roads become potentially safer as these offenders are hopefully less likely to repeat their infractions.

EVERYBODY WINS!!!!

 

[AK-47]

Yes, and in the process, more "offenders" pay more fines (net $8MM after all expenses according to the article) and our roads become potentially safer as these offenders are hopefully less likely to repeat their infractions.

EVERYBODY WINS!!!!

And the more cops making $100K to $200K the happier you'd be, right??!!!

 

[masterchief]

Nice try trying to paint me as an angry motorist

I used to train with cops in my local gym, and listened to them talk about extra court time. Please dont play me like I'm stupid, it really insults my intelligence.

And apparently you're not doing a good job convincing the Toronto Star either.
Go read the original article

First off I'm not trying to convince anyone...let alone a newspaper with an agenda.

Second, I could care less what you heard at the gym. You seem comfortable making broad insulting generalizations about corruption and greed about hundreds of hard working, honest people who decided to take a job that you probably couldn't handle for a day let alone 30 years.

But let's not go there.

So according to your posts based on the unproven allegations of a few we should generalize the actions of the group as a whole. So by that logic then since you go ot a gym you must be a stereriod injecting muscle-headed, small penis jock?

If you're intelligence is insulted by a logical discussion...well that's your own fault.

 

[masterchief]

And the more cops making $100K to $200K the happier you'd be, right??!!!

Aside from the fact that they have to pay income tax on all that....and the overtime is taxed at a higher rate.

 

[AK-47]

LMAO......I'm having a discussion with a bunch of crooked cops on a hooker forum, doesnt get much weirder than this folks

So by that logic then since you go ot a gym you must be a stereriod injecting muscle-headed, small penis jock?

Yes Masterchief, everyone in my gym is addicted to steroids, cant wait for you guys to come arrest some juiceheads, except you guys are too busy writing parking tickets and going to night court

 

[masterchief]

LMAO......I'm having a discussion with a bunch of crooked cops on a hooker forum, doesnt get much weirder than this folks

Yes Masterchief, everyone in my gym is addicted to steroids, cant wait for you guys to come arrest some juiceheads, except you guys are too busy writing parking tickets and going to night court

You guys?

Way off the mark, much like your skills at being able to deal with someone making a comparison. I won't even waste my time trying to explain what I was trying to highlight.


Also....Night Court has been gone from Toronto for a few years, and LEO's don't write traffic tickets....here's a new concept for you....fact checking.

 

[viking1965]

And the more cops making $100K to $200K the happier you'd be, right??!!!

No, I'd much rather see the cops home on their days off and the guilty offenders just pay their fines. Much more net profit in that approach.

But as long as people continue to think that what they did wasn't illegal, we'll keep having to pay LEO's to appear in court and defend their actions.

 

[AK-47]

Also....Night Court has been gone from Toronto for a few years, and LEO's don't write traffic tickets....here's a new concept for you....fact checking.

Oh whatever, night court, over-time court....whatever, you know what I meant.

 

[viking1965]

How has this evolved to: "If you think it's such a cushy deal, then strap on a badge and a gun and a kevlar vest and hit the streets"

Really what you're saying is please excuse our OT court money, because we get shot at and deserve it!!

Isnt that what you're saying???

You were the one who accused hardworking, life-risking law enforcement officers of "lining their pockets".

Yes, I took offense and responded accordingly.

 

[AK-47]

No, I'd much rather see the cops home on their days off and the guilty offenders just pay their fines. Much more net profit in that approach.

But as long as people continue to think that what they did wasn't illegal, we'll keep having to pay LEO's to appear in court and defend their actions.

Viking, I agree with you.

My only issue is that I seen what David Miller has done with Toronto parking ticket control, its gone completely haywire, they write out tickets for nothing nowadays, just to make more money to balance their budget, this is dangerous my friend!!

 

[fuji]

I clarified earlier that we're not talking about "bogus" tickets. Any officer found to be "creating" overtime by perpetrating such acts should be summarily fired.

You are proposing firing cops over bogus tickets as a solution but I do not think that is a good solution.

There are too many gray and iffy cases, borderline situations, is it bogus or not? Cops make mistakes and not every mistake is a firing mistake.

So no I do not think that solves the problem. The conflict of interest remains and has not been resolved simply by saying you would fire anybody you caught cheating. It's too had to catch them, and too hard to tell whether it was really cheating or an honest mistake.

As I asked earlier, what's you're proposed annual "overtime exempt" salary?

Yes. I am proposing their salaries be increased by the average amount that they have been receiving as court stipend and then dropping any further compensation for court stipend.

How much would we have to pay you to do their job?

I am not proposing that we pay them any more or any less than we do now, total target pay remains the same. We are just altering the structure of their compensation to remove the temptation to write bogus tickets.

It is a matter of public confidence here, police not only have to obey the law, they have to be SEEN to be obeying the law, and this situation opens up too many questions. Even when the cops are doing their job completely properly the reputation of the force will suffer if the public can't clearly SEE that htey are.

 

[viking1965]

Viking, I agree with you.

My only issue is that I seen what David Miller has done with Toronto parking ticket control, its gone completely haywire, they write out tickets for nothing nowadays, just to make more money to balance their budget, this is dangerous my friend!!

I think it's already been established that we're not talking about parking tickets.

Regardless, if there are laws in place, and people violate them, then they should be cited and pay the appropriate fine. As someone stated earlier, Police Officers/Traffic Agents don't write the laws, they enforce them.

What you're doing is the equivalent of shooting the messenger.

 

[masterchief]

Oh whatever, night court, over-time court....whatever, you know what I meant.

See I'm not psychic so I can only understand what you actually write.

There is no such thing as over-time court. It's court....and if the officer is paid thier overtime union rate since they are mandated buy the civillian oversight and the Police Service...so be it.

Don't like it...then go apply for the Police Services Board.

 

[viking1965]

Yup, you cops are drama queens

Taxi drivers have higher death rates than cops, gimme a break dude!!

Not a cop, but a son of one, and a friend of many.

What would your buddies at the gym think of your position here? Have you accused them of "lining their pockets" to their faces? I'd love to witness the ensuing drama.

Have some statistics to back up your claim?

 

[masterchief]

Yup, you cops are drama queens

Taxi drivers have higher death rates than cops, gimme a break dude!!

Once again...not a cop.
Second...your point is irrellevant since Fishermen have a higher death rate then most jobs.

 

[AK-47]

Ah... so we have 2 cops, masterchief and Viking. Welcome guys, how's the hobbying going??


Just so you lads know we're on the same page, I fully support law-enforcement.
I only believe that overtime court costs should be restricted, that's all

Thats not to say cops shouldnt get any overtime pay, only that it should be capped.
Much like the NHL has a salary cap

Pretty simple, eh??!!

 

[masterchief]

Ah... so we have 2 cops, masterchief and Viking. Welcome guys, how's the hobbying going??


Just so you lads know we're on the same page, I fully support law-enforcement.
I only believe that overtime court costs should be restricted, that's all

Thats not to say cops shouldnt get any overtime pay, only that it should be capped.
Much like the NHL has a salary cap

Pretty simple, eh??!!

No...there are never simple answers to complex issues.
Just simple people.

 

[AK-47]

No...there are never simple answers to complex issues.
Just simple people.

BTW Ostifer, how's the hobbying going??

 

[viking1965]

You are proposing firing cops over bogus tickets as a solution but I do not think that is a good solution.

There are too many gray and iffy cases, borderline situations, is it bogus or not? Cops make mistakes and not every mistake is a firing mistake.

So no I do not think that solves the problem. The conflict of interest remains and has not been resolved simply by saying you would fire anybody you caught cheating. It's too had to catch them, and too hard to tell whether it was really cheating or an honest mistake.



Yes. I am proposing their salaries be increased by the average amount that they have been receiving as court stipend and then dropping any further compensation for court stipend.



I am not proposing that we pay them any more or any less than we do now, total target pay remains the same. We are just altering the structure of their compensation to remove the temptation to write bogus tickets.

It is a matter of public confidence here, police not only have to obey the law, they have to be SEEN to be obeying the law, and this situation opens up too many questions. Even when the cops are doing their job completely properly the reputation of the force will suffer if the public can't clearly SEE that htey are.

Fuji,

I don't know what industry you're in or what position you hold, but let's assume that you're a Vice President at a mid-sized financial institution.

The shareholders are upset because it seems that some of the Vice Presidents are working extra hard and at the end of the year these hard workers are getting "bonuses" for their efforts, and by working even harder (and ostensibly raising revenue or lowering expenses), their bonuses are getting even bigger.

The shareholders need to put a stop to this because they don't want to continue paying larger bonuses (even though net profits are going up) so they decide to determine what the "average" bonus is among ALL Vice Presidents (even the ones who haven't earned any bonus over the last few years) and set a flat salary, inclusive of this "average bonus" for ALL Vice Presidents.

So if you want to work hard, go ahead, but your gonna get paid the same as all the other Vice Presidents, even the ones who just put in their 37.5 hours a week.

Sound like a good deal?

Which Vice Presidents are going to work harder?