Taxpayers to Fork Out $13,000,000,000: The Cost of Doug's Unlawful and Spiteful Labor Wage Legislation

[SammyS]

Unions start beating the war drums ahead of contract negotiations and start their usual diatribe to gain public support and to scare people into thinking their services will be affected if a strike happens.
Politicians need to make it look like they are fiercely protecting the public purse and unions know this.
So they drag out negotiations on both sides sometimes right up to the last minute. This all happens in private. Each side accusing the other of not "coming to the table", etc.
Then magically, behind closed doors and away from the public and union membership's view, a deal is magically struck and only tidbits are revealed to the public afterwards.
It's like the classic fake fight where two people "make it look good".
I say we get rid of this whole charade and scrap these public sector unions altogether. No mess, no fuss.

^^^^^^^^^^
Who gives a shit about public support???
Personally, NEVER HAVE... NEVER WILL!!!
Make education an essential service and you don't have these back and forth negotiations that drag on forever.

 

[Not getting younger]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Hey Skooby,
That's a great idea man. Let pass legislation that gets rid of public sector unions.
And while we're at it, let's pass legislation that gets rid of the Ontario's debt so that we can all enjoy life man!!!

"Bargaining" in union-speak means asking for way more than you are entitled to because your union has convinced you that everyone else has it way better than you do."
^^^^^^^
A union is an organization formed by workers who join together and use their strength to have a voice in their workplace. Through their union, workers have the ability to negotiate from a position of strength with employers over wages, benefits, workplace health and safety, job training and other work-related issues.

"Bargaining" in union "negotiations" means keeping kids at home and not in school for as long as it takes so that the public puts pressure on the government to settle and students/parents suffer in the meantime.
^^^^^^^
A union is an organization formed by workers who join together and use their strength to have a voice in their workplace. Through their union, workers have the ability to negotiate from a position of strength with employers over wages, benefits, workplace health and safety, job training and other work-related issues.

"Bargaining" from a union's perspective is making demands that far exceed reality so that negotiations come to a stand-still and an arbitrator is brought in to get what they actually really wanted in the first place.
^^^^^^^
A union is an organization formed by workers who join together and use their strength to have a voice in their workplace. Through their union, workers have the ability to negotiate from a position of strength with employers over wages, benefits, workplace health and safety, job training and other work-related issues.

why do you think it’s outdated given the underlying issues HAVE NOT been addressed. Nor has a budget been balanced YET ( never mind BEFORE 2018 and Boomers). And the fact, many of the things the Ford administration is doing. Is advice and recommendations right out of it? And in fact many are worse ( thanks to Covid, population explosion and boomers).

I have NOT read the full report but I'm assuming that the term pressure is referring to the financial situation that Ontario was in, in 2012

Nope. He is referring to the pressure that comes from the electorate to spend spend spend spend spend.

The lesson here is that governments can hold the lid on spending for a while by taking extraordinary measures to contain compensation costs, postpone capital projects and scrimp on infrastructure maintenance. But unless fundamental spending reforms are implemented, the old pressures reassert themselves and governments with newly balanced budgets have a hard time resisting

With specific references to historical facts such as Rae then Harris as well as Chrétien and other provinces.

Just for starters

None of these choices will be easy and many of our proposals will draw vigorous criticism.
But it must be kept in mind that our recommendations can deliver the needed degree of spending restraint to balance the budget by 2017-18 only if all are implemented.

point, I urge you to consider holding broader consultations on the economic and fiscal challenges facing this province.
Ontarians have not yet grasped ( NO FUCKING KIDDING given threads and responses here) the extent to which the slow decline of this province's manufacturing base has undermined both its historic economic advantage relative to the rest of Canada and the provincial government's long-term ability to finance the public services they treasure.

In Ontario, a deep recession and five years of deficits raised the debt ratio from 12.7 per cent in 1989-90 to 29.2 per cent in 1994-95. After the 1995 election, the Harris government substantially reined in spending, with the exception of health care; the two most dramatic moves were a 22 per cent cut in social assistance rates and a downloading of program responsibilities to municipal governments,

Ontarios today is over 40% as is the Feds

The federal government's elimination of the deficit between 1995 and 1998 is the best-known example. Departmental operating budgets, as well as grants and contributions, were reduced by 15 per cent to 25 per cent, while transfers to the provinces were cut by more than 21 per cent over two years.

by all mean, if you think you know better, post your CV, credentials, and successful applications to cheif economist positions with big banks, federal finance ministries and more..

I’m eagerly waiting

btw if your “not finished” reading. All those quotes are from the first 30 pages…….so um..

 

[Skoob]

^^^^^^^^^^
Who gives a shit about public support???
Personally, NEVER HAVE... NEVER WILL!!!
Make education an essential service and you don't have these back and forth negotiations that drag on forever.

You know who cares about public support? The unions.
Why do you think they continually put out ads about how bad they have it ahead of "negotiations" and election?

Why do you think they do that if no one cares about public support?

 

[Not getting younger]

You know who cares about public support? The unions.
Why do you think they continually put out ads about how bad they have it ahead of "negotiations" and election?

Why do you think they do that if no one cares about public support?

and the politicians in Queens Parks and Ottawa Skoob………..


Nope. He is referring to the pressure that comes from the electorate to spend spend spend spend spend.

The lesson here is that governments can hold the lid on spending for a while by taking extraordinary measures to contain compensation costs, postpone capital projects and scrimp on infrastructure maintenance. But unless fundamental spending reforms are implemented, the old pressures reassert themselves and governments with newly balanced budgets have a hard time resisting

With specific references to historical facts such as Rae then Harris as well as Chrétien and other provinces.

Just for starters

None of these choices will be easy and many of our proposals will draw vigorous criticism.
But it must be kept in mind that our recommendations can deliver the needed degree of spending restraint to balance the budget by 2017-18 only if all are implemented.

point, I urge you to consider holding broader consultations on the economic and fiscal challenges facing this province.
Ontarians have not yet grasped ( NO FUCKING KIDDING given threads and responses here) the extent to which the slow decline of this province's manufacturing base has undermined both its historic economic advantage relative to the rest of Canada and the provincial government's long-term ability to finance the public services they treasure.

In Ontario, a deep recession and five years of deficits raised the debt ratio from 12.7 per cent in 1989-90 to 29.2 per cent in 1994-95. After the 1995 election, the Harris government substantially reined in spending, with the exception of health care; the two most dramatic moves were a 22 per cent cut in social assistance rates and a downloading of program responsibilities to municipal governments,

Ontarios today is over 40% as is the Feds

The federal government's elimination of the deficit between 1995 and 1998 is the best-known example. Departmental operating budgets, as well as grants and contributions, were reduced by 15 per cent to 25 per cent, while transfers to the provinces were cut by more than 21 per cent over two years.

by all mean, if you think you know better, post your CV, credentials, and successful applications to cheif economist positions with big banks, federal finance ministries and more..

I’m eagerly waiting

 

[SammyS]

why do you think it’s outdated given the underlying issues HAVE NOT been addressed.
^^^^^^^
It's outdated because in 2012 there wasn't a teacher shortage.
NGY... Today there is a teacher shortage!!!

^^^^^^NGY still processing the Drummond report
A LOT OF P-R-E-S-S-U-R-E IN HIS HEAD!!!!!

And again, referring to page 221 of the Drummond Report
"Since their development in the mid-19th century, publicly funded schools have been a cornerstone of Ontario’s public services. With the rise of the knowledge economy, a strong education system is MORE CRITICAL than ever to Ontario’s prosperity and global competitiveness. The importance of a strong foundation through education and the progress made in Ontario’s education system in recent years must be kept in mind when considering how to meet Ontario’s fiscal challenges."

^^^^^^^You already have a teacher shortage. If publicly funded schools are the cornerstone of Ontario's public service doesn't it make sense to invest in education to build a strong foundation???

^^^^^^^^NGY's Ontario... NO THANK YOU!!!

 

[SammyS]

You know who cares about public support? The unions.
Why do you think they continually put out ads about how bad they have it ahead of "negotiations" and election?
Why do you think they do that if no one cares about public support?

^^^^^^^^
Well, I disagree. Yes, unions use money to let the public know what is happening but it's a very, very small piece of the puzzle!!!

 

[Not getting younger]

^^^^^^^^
Well, I disagree. Yes, unions use money to let the public know what is happening but it's a very, very small piece of the puzzle!!!

Have you read the Chief elections officers concerns since 2011?

 

[SammyS]

Have you read the Chief elections officers concerns since 2011?

^^^^^^^^^^LOL!!!!

^^^^^^NGY still processing the Drummond report
A LOT OF P-R-E-S-S-U-R-E IN HIS HEAD!!!!!

And again, referring to page 221 of the Drummond Report
"Since their development in the mid-19th century, publicly funded schools have been a cornerstone of Ontario’s public services. With the rise of the knowledge economy, a strong education system is MORE CRITICAL than ever to Ontario’s prosperity and global competitiveness. The importance of a strong foundation through education and the progress made in Ontario’s education system in recent years must be kept in mind when considering how to meet Ontario’s fiscal challenges."

^^^^^^^You already have a teacher shortage. If publicly funded schools are the cornerstone of Ontario's public service doesn't it make sense to invest in education to build a strong foundation???

^^^^^^^^NGY's Ontario... NO THANK YOU!!!

 

[Not getting younger]

^^^^^^^^^^LOL!!!!

By chance are you a teacher? Or maybe you’re born sometime after 2000. Or maybe like many, your heads been in the sand and drinking koolaid since McGuinty bought teachers and unions for their and the electorate support.

Given you were so badly wrong about Drummond, ( unions striking or threatening to)

LOL at you.

14 year later (with laws changed in 2016) and they are still concerned about it. Maybe you missed the link I posted early too.

The meaning of “third party” in this context means a person or entity who is not a candidate. Eligible individuals, corporations and trade unions can register to be third party advertisers. Third party advertising is separate from any candidate’s campaign and must be done independently from a candidate.

Third Parties

www.elections.on.ca

See also this from 2012

Ontario Tories lose legal fight to Working Families coalition of unions

The Progressive Conservatives have lost a major legal battle in their long-running war with the Working Families coalition of unions.

www.thestar.com

So Sammy S. Given all the above ( including the Drummond report ) How deep in the Koolaid and sand, is your head? Where have been the last 20 years. On Mars?

I sincerely pray for our children you’re not a teacher.

 

[SammyS]

By chance are you a teacher? Or maybe you’re born sometime after 2000. Or maybe like many, your heads been in the sand and drinking koolaid since McGuinty bought teachers and unions for their and the electorate support.
Given you were so badly wrong about Drummond, ( unions striking or threatening to)
I sincerely pray for our children you’re not a teacher.

^^^^^^^^^^
YET AGAIN NGY picks and chooses what he wants to reply to.
And again, referring to page 221 of the Drummond Report
"Since their development in the mid-19th century, publicly funded schools have been a cornerstone of Ontario’s public services. With the rise of the knowledge economy, a strong education system is MORE CRITICAL than ever to Ontario’s prosperity and global competitiveness. The importance of a strong foundation through education and the progress made in Ontario’s education system in recent years must be kept in mind when considering how to meet Ontario’s fiscal challenges."

^^^^^^^Ontario has a teacher shortage. If publicly funded schools are the cornerstone of Ontario's public service doesn't it make sense to invest in education to build a strong foundation??? To draw good people... you need good wages. DUH!!!

^^^^^^^^NGY's Ontario... NO THANK YOU!!!

 

[Skoob]

^^^^^^^^
Well, I disagree. Yes, unions use money to let the public know what is happening but it's a very, very small piece of the puzzle!!!

The only thing that will keep public sector unions thriving is public opinion. So that's why unions want to ensure they always sway public opinion their way.

Why you ask? Why would that matter is laws protect unions?

Because if the unions convince the public that privatizing in any way is bad, the politicians will be less likely to go against public opinion.
If the unions convince the parents that their kids will suffer, the parents will complain to the politicians.

So it's not as small a part as you suggest.

 

[Skoob]

By chance are you a teacher? Or maybe you’re born sometime after 2000. Or maybe like many, your heads been in the sand and drinking koolaid since McGuinty bought teachers and unions for their and the electorate support.

Sure sounds like he is.
You know the type...complain their whole career about how bad they have it. Then retire at 55 or younger with a cushy pension and tell everyone how good they have it.

 

[Not getting younger]

^^^^^^^^^^
YET AGAIN NGY picks and chooses what he wants to reply to.
And again, referring to page 221 of the Drummond Report
"Since their development in the mid-19th century, publicly funded schools have been a cornerstone of Ontario’s public services. With the rise of the knowledge economy, a strong education system is MORE CRITICAL than ever to Ontario’s prosperity and global competitiveness. The importance of a strong foundation through education and the progress made in Ontario’s education system in recent years must be kept in mind when considering how to meet Ontario’s fiscal challenges."

^^^^^^^Ontario has a teacher shortage. If publicly funded schools are the cornerstone of Ontario's public service doesn't it make sense to invest in education to build a strong foundation??? To draw good people... you need good wages. DUH!!!

^^^^^^^^NGY's Ontario... NO THANK YOU!!!

So out of 600 pages that say an awful lot about debt, deficits, spending getting out of control. Cost cutting and wages restraints. Pressure to spend spend spend, Reforming public services, including “ privatization of none core” and so much more…..

in essence a 600 page damnations of the left…

The best YOU CAN DO is CHERRY PICK ONE CONFIRMATION BIAS serving quote from PAGE 221.

then have the gall and Audicity.
SCUSE ME???LMFAO.

 

[SammyS]

So out of 600 pages that say an awful lot about debt, deficits, spending getting out of control. Cost cutting and wages restraints. Pressure to spend spend spend, Reforming public services, including “ privatization of none core” and so much more…..in essence a 600 page damnations of the left…
The best YOU CAN DO is CHERRY PICK ONE CONFIRMATION BIAS serving quote from PAGE 221.
then have the gall and Audicity.
SCUSE ME???LMFAO.

^^^^^^^^^^

So NGY... who jerks off with the Drummond report can't even answer 1 f@#king question.

And again, referring to page 221 of the Drummond Report
"Since their development in the mid-19th century, publicly funded schools have been a cornerstone of Ontario’s public services. With the rise of the knowledge economy, a strong education system is MORE CRITICAL than ever to Ontario’s prosperity and global competitiveness. The importance of a strong foundation through education and the progress made in Ontario’s education system in recent years must be kept in mind when considering how to meet Ontario’s fiscal challenges."

Ontario has a teacher shortage. If publicly funded schools are the cornerstone of Ontario's public service doesn't it make sense to invest in education to build a strong foundation???

^^^^^^^^^^^NGY: "We can make cuts to education and still have a strong foundation."

 

[Not getting younger]

^^^^^^^^^^

So NGY... who jerks off with the Drummond report can't even answer 1 f@#king question.

And again, referring to page 221 of the Drummond Report
"Since their development in the mid-19th century, publicly funded schools have been a cornerstone of Ontario’s public services. With the rise of the knowledge economy, a strong education system is MORE CRITICAL than ever to Ontario’s prosperity and global competitiveness. The importance of a strong foundation through education and the progress made in Ontario’s education system in recent years must be kept in mind when considering how to meet Ontario’s fiscal challenges."

Ontario has a teacher shortage. If publicly funded schools are the cornerstone of Ontario's public service doesn't it make sense to invest in education to build a strong foundation???

^^^^^^^^^^^NGY: "We can make cuts to education and still have a strong foundation."

Hmmm. I thought healthcare was considerably more important and have you heard of Boomers….A province that’s a mess…with a ton of problems that need $$$. Money they don’t have…aka a train wreck.

And for someone who clearly can’t read much, and is in denial. Shame your a teacher…whether that reading, comprehending and absorbing the report, spending pressures, wage restraints, reforms and even union influences as per chief election officer. You “laughed at”. Nor major headlines back in the day, you knew nothing about..Or history. Say the 1990s and Harris and Rae…and Chrétien.

you’ve yet to post much substance in rebuttal other than your opinion, and wet farts…nor your CV and applications to replace the like of Drummond and more. You clearly think you are smarter than and know better than

 

[SammyS]

Hmmm. I thought healthcare was considerably more important and have you heard of Boomers….A province that’s a mess…
And for someone who clearly can’t read much, and is in denial. Shame your a teacher…Of both the report, spending pressures and even union influences as per chief election officer. You “laughed at”. Nor major headlines back in the day, you knew nothing about..
you’ve yet to post much substance in rebuttal other than your opinion, nor your CV and applications to replace the like of Drummond and more. You clearly think you are smarter than and know better than

^^^^^^^^^^

NGY says wait one minute.... I'm on page 273 of the Drummond Report....

NGY... I have some bad news for you... you're shooting blanks!!!! Zero answers... to 1 question.

Page 221 of the Drummond Report
"Since their development in the mid-19th century, publicly funded schools have been a cornerstone of Ontario’s public services. With the rise of the knowledge economy, a strong education system is MORE CRITICAL than ever to Ontario’s prosperity and global competitiveness. The importance of a strong foundation through education and the progress made in Ontario’s education system in recent years must be kept in mind when considering how to meet Ontario’s fiscal challenges."

Ontario has a teacher shortage. If publicly funded schools are the cornerstone of Ontario's public service doesn't it make sense to invest in education to build a strong foundation???

^^^^^^^^^^^
NGY....LOL!!!

 

[Not getting younger]

^^^^^^^^^^

NGY says wait one minute.... I'm on page 273 of the Drummond Report....

NGY... I have some bad news for you... you're shooting blanks!!!! Zero answers... to 1 question.

Page 221 of the Drummond Report
"Since their development in the mid-19th century, publicly funded schools have been a cornerstone of Ontario’s public services. With the rise of the knowledge economy, a strong education system is MORE CRITICAL than ever to Ontario’s prosperity and global competitiveness. The importance of a strong foundation through education and the progress made in Ontario’s education system in recent years must be kept in mind when considering how to meet Ontario’s fiscal challenges."

Ontario has a teacher shortage. If publicly funded schools are the cornerstone of Ontario's public service doesn't it make sense to invest in education to build a strong foundation???

^^^^^^^^^^^
NGY....LOL!!!

Shrug.
Par for the coarse from the left handed handicapped, that’s lost…the plot of green.. Say no more.

 

[SammyS]

https://media.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExM2JyeHh4YTU5N2NjeG54dmllcXY4YXAwdDRxcTZobDg5Z3psbDNodiZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfYnlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/2oyfwkRTgdfMW7FTHd/giphy.gif[/IMG]

Page 221 of the Drummond Report
"Since their development in the mid-19th century, publicly funded schools have been a cornerstone of Ontario’s public services. With the rise of the knowledge economy, a strong education system is MORE CRITICAL than ever to Ontario’s prosperity and global competitiveness. The importance of a strong foundation through education and the progress made in Ontario’s education system in recent years must be kept in mind when considering how to meet Ontario’s fiscal challenges."

Ontario has a teacher shortage. If publicly funded schools are the cornerstone of Ontario's public service doesn't it make sense to invest in education to build a strong foundation???
1 question... just 1 question

 

[Frankfooter]

Hmmm. I thought healthcare was considerably more important and have you heard of Boomers….A province that’s a mess…with a ton of problems that need $$$. Money they don’t have…aka a train wreck.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1771226519257350569

 

[SammyS]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1771226519257350569

^^^^^^^^
Hey Frankfooter,

Sorry NGY is busy rereading the Drummond Report... he'll get back to you in a bit!!!

Ontario’s doctors warn of worsening health-care crisis if family doctor shortage is not addressed immediately - Jan. 29, 2024
Family doctor shortage
Page 221 of the Drummond Report
"Since their development in the mid-19th century, publicly funded schools have been a cornerstone of Ontario’s public services. With the rise of the knowledge economy, a strong education system is MORE CRITICAL than ever to Ontario’s prosperity and global competitiveness. The importance of a strong foundation through education and the progress made in Ontario’s education system in recent years must be kept in mind when considering how to meet Ontario’s fiscal challenges."

Ontario has a teacher shortage. If publicly funded schools are the cornerstone of Ontario's public service doesn't it make sense to invest in education to build a strong foundation and as a result, have more doctors???

^^^^^^^^NGY's Ontario... NO THANK YOU!!!