Sue-Ann Levy (Sun) - Liberals refuse to make needed spending cuts

Lovehobby

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Sep 25, 2013
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Right. So what are you going to give up? Your phone, computer, dishwasher, fridge, flatsscreen, air conditioner etc?

We as a society as we we go more electronic with more population will use more energy. That's the bottom line.
And it has to be a consistent supply. Present renewables don't supply that. Nulcear will until the technologies for renewables are better. Maybe 40+ years down the road.
It is nuclear not nulcear

yes that is all true but I would use gas before nuclear. We can ratchet down use with massive insulation, reduced lighting, high efficiency products. Read George Monbiot. Wind turbine in the sea using DC, excluse bus lanes on major highways, toll roads, cover the Sahara with solar panels, .... it is do it or die.
 

Butler1000

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Oct 31, 2011
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It is nuclear not nulcear

yes that is all true but I would use gas before nuclear. We can ratchet down use with massive insulation, reduced lighting, high efficiency products. Read George Monbiot. Wind turbine in the sea using DC, excluse bus lanes on major highways, toll roads, cover the Sahara with solar panels, .... it is do it or die.
Ok Teach...by the way it's exclusive, not "excluse". How about we don't play spelling cop?

And products are becoming more high efficiency. Insulation etc are better. What happens if electric cars come in as a major product?
As for personal conservation the only way to really accomplish that is artificial high rates. And that will overtly affect the poorest. Cheap electricity is one of the best ways to encourage business, and to bring the modern world to the poor across the world. Try to take a look at sources you don't agree with (I do). Nuclear is a viable solution. At least a hell of a lot better than solar panels in the Sahara anyway.
 

lomotil

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Mar 14, 2004
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Sue-Ann Levy is a nice hairy unshaved dyke, with strong conservative musings, but is often out a a tree limb, and sawing it off at the same time.
 

Lovehobby

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Sue-Ann Levy is a nice hairy unshaved dyke, with strong conservative musings, but is often out a a tree limb, and sawing it off at the same time.
I would paraphrase that column as "the Liberals are acting like liberals. i can't seem to persuade them to act like conservatives." WTF.
 

Lovehobby

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Sue-Ann Levy is a nice hairy unshaved dyke, with strong conservative musings, but is often out a a tree limb, and sawing it off at the same time.
I would paraphrase that column as "the Liberals are acting like liberals. i can't seem to persuade them to act like conservatives." WTF.
 

slowandeasy

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Increase in taxes? Great idea. The government is not run for your welfare. It is run for the benefit of the whole society. Social mobility is slowing down services are stretched to the limit, infrastructure is crumbling, what this province needs is a tax increase.

I gladly pay. It is the price of a civilized society.
I don't mind having to pay taxes for the improvement of our society, but not when our governments at all levels piss away our money.
 

Lovehobby

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I don't mind having to pay taxes for the improvement of our society, but not when our governments at all levels piss away our money.
The think is people don't agree on what is piss. Harper is pissing away my money on the army, prisons, and oil subsidies in my opinion. He should tax the rich more and really go after offshore accounts.
 

Moviefan-2

Court Jester
Oct 17, 2011
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Yes but conservation is a far better bridge.
As I said on the weekend, you're dreaming.

Coincidentally, Konrad Yakabuski had a piece in the Globe today on this exact topic. As he notes, politicians who claim they can replace nuclear with "renewables" are indulging in fantasies. Furthermore, if you think the goal should be to reduce the amount of man-made carbon dioxide going into the atmosphere, policies such as the experiment in Germany have the opposite effect.

Politicians who suggest that “renewables” will pave the way to a carbon-free future are either delusional or deceptional. Wind and solar power are unreliable options with short track records. Their power can’t be stored and, unlike new reactors with 50-year lifespans, they have exhibited alarmingly high failure rates.

It is simply irresponsible to suggest that wind, solar or biomass can be more than complementary power sources. They may not even be that green. Ontario’s increasing reliance on natural-gas-fired generation to back up intermittent wind proves that overinvestment in renewables can actually lead to higher carbon emissions. And while the province will soon close its last coal plant, plans to reduce nuclear will result in more carbon over time.
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/glob...ar-option/article15355550/#dashboard/follows/

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On the broader issue of the Wynne government's reckless approach to the books, Kelly McParland at the National Post has penned a good piece on that issue.

As McParland notes, the short-sighted thinking that favours opinion polls over governing is the same type of thinking that led to the gas plants scandal. I would build on that point and remind Liberals that the scandal ultimately forced Dalton McGuinty to resign in utter disgrace.

http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com...berals-play-pretend-with-the-ontario-economy/
 

Lovehobby

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If you expect a minority Liberal government to do more things to make themselves unpopular between now and the election for the convenience of Timmy, you are really naive.
 

Moviefan-2

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If you expect a minority Liberal government to do more things to make themselves unpopular between now and the election for the convenience of Timmy, you are really naive.
Not everyone would disagree with the government cutting unnecessary spending. I suspect the real problem is a fear of making decisions.

Whatever the case, I stand by my previous point: Governing solely according to opinion polls didn't work out all that well for McGuinty.
 

Lovehobby

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If we go back to the original post, Tories seem to work themselves into a frenzy when Liberals and Social Democrats (total vote 62%) refuse to do what opposition Tories tell them to do although they represent about 33% of the vote. You want to run things you need to win. If Hudak cannot win a majority he will be premier for about a month before a nonconfidence motion is put and the LG is told the other parties have an agreement.
 

Moviefan-2

Court Jester
Oct 17, 2011
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If we go back to the original post, Tories seem to work themselves into a frenzy when Liberals and Social Democrats (total vote 62%) refuse to do what opposition Tories tell them to do although they represent about 33% of the vote.
In fact, the original post was about the Wynne government's phony claims that the government is "on track" to balance the books.
 

Lovehobby

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In fact, the original post was about the Wynne government's phony claims that the government is "on track" to balance the books.
Balancing the books is vastly overrated. There are many much higher priorities. Tories just dont get that.
 

Moviefan-2

Court Jester
Oct 17, 2011
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Balancing the books is vastly overrated. There are many much higher priorities. Tories just dont get that.
It was the Wynne government that made the ridiculous claim that Ontario "remains on track" to balance the books.

If it's so overrated and not a priority, why are the Liberals making that claim? Particularly when you consider that it's based on projections that simply aren't believable.
 

groggy

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Mar 21, 2011
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It was the Wynne government that made the ridiculous claim that Ontario "remains on track" to balance the books.

If it's so overrated and not a priority, why are the Liberals making that claim? Particularly when you consider that it's based on projections that simply aren't believable.
Because people like the Ford nation like easy to understand concepts.
So Hudak will go after the unions, telling us how those decent wages are dragging us all down and Wynne will say she'll keep services and balance the budget.
 

Lovehobby

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It was the Wynne government that made the ridiculous claim that Ontario "remains on track" to balance the books.

If it's so overrated and not a priority, why are the Liberals making that claim? Particularly when you consider that it's based on projections that simply aren't believable.
Try to pay attention:

Tories would balance it faster of course they would slash health, education, environment etc to do it.

Liberals would balance it but take longer, do less damage.

NDP would take even longer to benefit from growth and do no damage to those critical services above.

Any idiot can balance the budget. The point is how.
 

Moviefan-2

Court Jester
Oct 17, 2011
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Because people like the Ford nation like easy to understand concepts.
So Hudak will go after the unions, telling us how those decent wages are dragging us all down and Wynne will say she'll keep services and balance the budget.
You're blaming Kathleen's dishonesty on Ford Nation?

Try to pay attention:

Tories would balance it faster of course they would slash health, education, environment etc to do it.

Liberals would balance it but take longer, do less damage.

NDP would take even longer to benefit from growth and do no damage to those critical services above.

Any idiot can balance the budget. The point is how.
Don't worry. I've been paying attention. And it's clear to me that you're tripping over your own feet as you try to defend the indefensible.

On the one hand, you claim a majority of Ontario voters support the Liberals' hidden agenda.

However, you also say the Liberals are "smart" not to reveal their hidden agenda, because that would hurt the Liberals and would help "Timmy."

Your positions are completely contradictory. If the Liberal agenda is so popular, then it's impossible to see how an honest articulation of that agenda would help Hudak.

The fact that the Liberals are being so intellectually dishonest tells us quite a bit about how they think voters would respond to their true agenda.
 

Lovehobby

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Sep 25, 2013
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You are a tory partisan who cannot see past your bias. Your post makes no sense whatsoever.
 

Moviefan-2

Court Jester
Oct 17, 2011
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You are a tory partisan who cannot see past your bias. Your post makes no sense whatsoever.
Actually, the point is all too clear: If the Liberals' budget plans are as popular as you claim, there's no reason for the Liberals to be lying about them.
 

fuji

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Actually, the point is all too clear: If the Liberals' budget plans are as popular as you claim, there's no reason for the Liberals to be lying about them.
What is this "true agenda"?

Is your opinion of Rob Ford the same st the municipal level? He doesn't even try to hide the lies in his financial claims.
 
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