I just hope the staff will be treated well. I’ve been to countries where tips are unnecessary, but you know I may have been brought up so that I always pay for the service if I like it.
Some Ontario restaurants are starting to adopt a tip-free dining model. Here's how it works
- Thread starter canada-man
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Some places have noticed that removing tipping results in the staff being treated better.
There are clients who come in specifically because they know they can hold tips over the staff's head and get off on the power trip. Those clients stop showing up.
And how is that different from upgrading your airline ticket or flogging the cabbie with some cash or slipping a $50 to maitre d' at dinner or lunch rush?
No different then "flogging the cabbie with some cash or slipping $50 at dinner" - both should be banned because both are bribes. You are getting your service at the experience of other paying customers who are officially entitled to the same service. If it was an official payment for "getting in front of the line" (like priority boarding at airlines) then it is fine. However, if the "tip" is already included in the bill (which is the case when it is said that waiters get sufficient wage and tipping is not required to supplement their income), tips should be avoided. And definitely no tips to "getting the best sit at a restaurant or your table ready faster" - it is pure bribe at the expense of other customers. ]
In case of upgrading airline tickets: we are talking about different products. No one is saying the price of pasta and stake should be the same. But that price should be stated on the menu.
totally agree. I treat it also as service tips...if you provide service (bring food to my table, massage my back etc etc...) tip should be given...if you're just delivering my food on the counter (i.e. fast food) no need for tipping that.
Asian aquatance from China told me once that they don't tip back home and they don't tip here, it's not even a thought. Even though they mostly frequent Asian restaurants 99% of the time,they still don't tip when they hit up a Candian chain place.
Since Toronto is so diverse I wonder what other cultures here have the same attitude towards no tipping.
Since Toronto is so diverse I wonder what other cultures here have the same attitude towards no tipping.
ROTFLMFAO! It's not a bribe, it's an incentive. It is not my fault that some individuals do not know what cash is for. The most valuable commodity of them all is time and you especially get to appreciate it when you get older. Besides, I've done my share of lining up like a good little sheep behind the Curtain to last me two or three lifetimes. Someday I'll tell you how I get to the head of the line at other places.
Oh, btw- fuck the other customers, I'm not dining with them.
It is called bribe. Let's say you need a new passport and the line to apply fro a passport is 2 hours long (it is the case now). Would it be OK if you give $100 to a clerk working there to get in front of the line? How about slipping $200 to a triage nurse at the hospital emergency room so that she will put you in front of the line to see a doctor? You are from former USSR, right? Me too. So, we should know what the bribe is.ROTFLMFAO! It's not a bribe, it's an incentive. It is not my fault that some individuals do not know what cash is for. The most valuable commodity of them all is time and you especially get to appreciate it when you get older. Besides, I've done my share of lining up like a good little sheep behind the Curtain to last me two or three lifetimes. Someday I'll tell you how I get to the head of the line at other places.
Oh, btw- fuck the other customers, I'm not dining with them.
Corrupting a public servant IS a bribe. Using cash to gain preferential private service is just tipping.
It is a bribe if that person changes the way he performs his duties and this change can harm other customers. I.e., if it is stated that for $50 paid to the business you get preferential treatment, it is OK. If you get it by paying to the employee under the table, it is a bribe. The employee does not have the right to put you in front of the line for his own benefit - this right belongs to the owner of the business and payment must be made to the owner. In addition, such payment should be fully disclosed to all customers so that they will be fully aware of the service they receive for the regular payment (putting your ahead of the line reduces the service quality for them, so, they are entitled for compensation if it was not disclosed to them up front).
Another example would be if you paid the flight attendant to let you sit in a business class when you have economy ticket. It is a bribe. Or you pay the usher at a cinema to let you in without a ticket. Or you paid extra to a towing company to get your driveway cleaned first after the big storm, delaying the service to other people who paid for seasonal snow removal and were told that they will be served before any one-time requests. As long as you paid to someone to give you something that he does not have the right to give (the right belongs to the business owner) - you are giving a bribe. And it does harm everyone, sometimes directly, sometimes indirectly the way shoplifting does.
Tips change the way duties are performed, isn't that obvious? Whether the future large tip(reward) is implied, paid upfront or you have a history of leaving larger tips. The employee has a duty to make your service as good as possible and it rewards the principal with repeated business. There is no downside nor moral ambiguity, here, except for "others " who are cheap or don't understand the purpose of cash.
Yes, but there are two problems:
1) Withholding good service (that should be provided by default)
2) Providing extra service for tips has a negative effect on service quality for other customers.
If the employee receives the wage he agrees on, he must provide good service. If you believe his service is extremely good, a good review is in order, and, possibly, a note to the manager so the value of such employee will increase and he will have a better chance to ask for and receive a raise. Paying to get a good service is different from tipping for a good service. The first one assumes that without tip the service quality would be lower, the second is simply expressing gratuity. Paying the agreed-upon price is not "cheap", it is a norm. Providing a good service for agreed-upon wage is a norm. It is like when you give an SP whose company you really enjoy an extra tip - you do it not because you expect special treatment, but simply as a way to "thank you".
In a perfect world what you're saying would made perfect sense, but we're dealing with people, here and far from a perfect world. And the simple truth is that service, everywhere, is uneven. I simply choose to "help" it along to make my existence more pleasant and easier.
Agree. Maybe it is too harsh of a comparison, but people in Russia also wanted just live their lives as easy as possible helping themselves along the way. Now they have Putin. We need a system that prevent such "helping", be it bribes or tips or anything that is paid under the table. If you give a valet $10 to bring your car faster and he did it even when there are a few people in line ahead of you - he should be fired. Simple. Of course, there may be two-tiered system like "fast pass" in amusement parks, as long as it is stated up-front.
I just hope the staff will be treated well. I’ve been to countries where tips are unnecessary, but you know I may have been brought up so that I always pay for the service if I like it. I used to work as a waiter, and I know how the tips encourage you to do your best at work. Btw, we went to one of the restaurants tofino, and we had a $300 dinner. And I paid $300 tips because the food was too delicious. The service was the best. I hope the food will become even more delicious because of my tips.
Tip Creep is upon us. It's what happens when tipping becomes routine... it becomes expected. Another reason why tipping should be abolished.
montrealgazette.com
Josh Freed: We've reached a tipping point with 'tip creep'
When you grab your own sandwich from a cooler and bus your own table, you shouldn’t be pressured to tip 15 per cent, or more.
montrealgazette.com
