Yes, truly a sad story. May she RIP.
Kinda supports that whole need to screen clients argument too...
Kinda supports that whole need to screen clients argument too...
"Nanny slain in hotel room was moonlighting as prostitute": Toronto Sun
- Thread starter cdnsimon
- Start date
Your Absolutly right ! But unfortunately this business, is liaised with many sickos !!!!!The premise that prostitution is inherently dangerous is simply a lie and demonstrably false.
Date rape, domestic violence, teachers/priests/doctors, etc. Then there is also stranger on stranger sexual assaults/murders. Almost all these crimes committed by males. Almost all the victims are females. Maybe the Tories will ban males?occasional violence also happens in relationships when there is no money involved.
The premise that prostitution is inherently dangerous is simply a lie and demonstrably false. The majority of transaction happens without any violence and occasional violence also happens in relationships when there is no money involved.
You can't really compare a gun with a knife or hammer. The only thing a gun can be used for is as a weapon to harm or threaten. That violence can be used for good or evil: hunting, target practice, robbing banks or stopping criminals; but it remains violent. That's why I said it is inherently violent, although it is not inherently evil.
See. This is exactly what I mean. The premise of your argument is an absolute truth to you. Hence, your argument is ineffective. You say the sky is grey. I say it's black.
Is your premise really absolute? Does it apply to the entire spectrum of prostituion or only the trade that your patronize? Would you concede that prostituon can be dangerous? Is it possible that girls can be lured to falsely believe that they consent to sexwork? Is it possible that a girl can become caught up in the industry and lifestyle and make bad decisions? Impossible? Nothing to do with prostitution, but rather life circumstances? It can happen to anyone? Any girl? And you're ok with that?
you say the majority of transaction happen without violence. What if the other side says (and, btw, they DO) that payment itself is the act of exploitation. Your strong evidence that this is demonstrably false is?
btw, you assume they mean violence. They actually don't say that. Physical violence is only one of the problems they allege. That's why the happy hookers campaign is important.
I use guns to punch holes in paper. You say target practice is inherently violent. In that case, I'm terribly sorry. My office is responsible for hundreds, perhaps thousands, of violent acts eachweek. I feel awful.
Sledgehammers have peaceful purposes? Knives do? Those poor fruit....
We`re looking at this through clouded lenses as johns and hookers who want to continue in this hobby relatively hassle free, for johns it`s for pleasure and hookers for financial gain. However for the 80%+ of people (estimate) who aren`t involved in the industry, how are they supposed to be convinced the profession isn`t dangerous when a sex worker is brutally murdered.
When I say ''prostitution'' I mean the exchange of sex for money, in any shape or form. Abolitionists say it is always degrading and violent, regardless of circumstances. That is what inherent means: that it cannot ever happen without violence and exploitation. That it can never be beneficial to both parties. There is no basis for that affirmation. My affirmation that it is not inherently harmful is based on all the available sociological evidence not just on an opinion.Is your premise really absolute? Does it apply to the entire spectrum of prostituion or only the trade that your patronize?
Hammers can be used as a weapon. You can also use a fluffy teddy bear to smother someone to death. Prostitution can also be exploitive in various ways. This is true but not the definition of inherently violent. Potentially is not the same as inherent. When you have a loaded gun and pull the trigger you are certain of causing some damage to something. The power to cause harm is inherent to gun use.
It is possible I suppose to argue that sexuality can be inherently dangerous, both on a physical and psychological level. However this would apply with free sex as well as prostitution.
The simple fact that these stories are still quite rare. Since I started hobbying some 4 years ago this is the second news about about a murdered escort that I have noticed (I remember another one a couple years ago in Montreal, where an escort and her driver threatened a client and the woman was killed in the fight). I have seen way more stories about pedestrians and cyclists getting killed by cars in my city. The problem is people didn't use to hear about prostitution except in the context of these bad news. Now more and more we hear the positive side of it in the media....However for the 80%+ of people (estimate) who aren`t involved in the industry, how are they supposed to be convinced the profession isn`t dangerous when a sex worker is brutally murdered.
Driving a cab and working in construction is inherently more dangerous.Since I started hobbying some 4 years ago this is the second news about about a murdered escort that I have noticed (I remember another one a couple years ago in Montreal, where an escort and her driver threatened a client and the woman was killed in the fight). I have seen way more stories about pedestrians and cyclists getting killed by cars in my city.
Question: Why did she moonlight as a prostitute?
Convenience store clerks, pizza parlour clerks, TTC ticket Collectors, High School Students, night club customers have also been brutally murdered in Toronto. Why don't we declare those to be "dangerous" professions or "dangerous" activities and ban them also. Spouses have also been murdered within the confines of a marriage, Mr. MacKay's choice as the only place where sex is safe. Maybe we should consider banning life in Canada because there is always the chance you could get murdered.We`re looking at this through clouded lenses as johns and hookers who want to continue in this hobby relatively hassle free, for johns it`s for pleasure and hookers for financial gain. However for the 80%+ of people (estimate) who aren`t involved in the industry, how are they supposed to be convinced the profession isn`t dangerous when a sex worker is brutally murdered.
No one deserves a death like that.. May her soul rest in peace. We sp's need to be careful out here... Because these types of things sadly does happen.
I agree with Teaseplease.
I think there is an important point to be made: does any agency really know how many women have been pressured into selling themselves; from women held in cargo containers from China to a university educated Canadian that wants the $ without 40-60 hr. work weeks. Has there ever been a comprehensive, Canada-wide, widely-supported account of those in the trade? I don't think there has and if comprehensive honest research isn't done then all anyone can do is speak in hypotheticals.
Interesting article on CBC (somebody probably already posted it):
http://www.cbc.ca/m/news/politics/s...exit-industry-witnesses-urge-ottawa-1.2699682
"Rick Hanson, Calgary's police chief, also called for a national strategy in which Ottawa, the provinces, municipalities and social agencies would work towards abolishing prostitution.
Hanson described the $20-million pledge, which he said amounts to $125,000 a year in Calgary, as "woefully inadequate.""
That amount of money into support is probably less than they spend on office supplies in a year!
I think there is an important point to be made: does any agency really know how many women have been pressured into selling themselves; from women held in cargo containers from China to a university educated Canadian that wants the $ without 40-60 hr. work weeks. Has there ever been a comprehensive, Canada-wide, widely-supported account of those in the trade? I don't think there has and if comprehensive honest research isn't done then all anyone can do is speak in hypotheticals.
Interesting article on CBC (somebody probably already posted it):
http://www.cbc.ca/m/news/politics/s...exit-industry-witnesses-urge-ottawa-1.2699682
"Rick Hanson, Calgary's police chief, also called for a national strategy in which Ottawa, the provinces, municipalities and social agencies would work towards abolishing prostitution.
Hanson described the $20-million pledge, which he said amounts to $125,000 a year in Calgary, as "woefully inadequate.""
That amount of money into support is probably less than they spend on office supplies in a year!
The premise that prostitution is inherently violent is a stereotype that is not based on actual fact.The premise that prostitution is inherently dangerous is simply a lie and demonstrably false. The majority of transaction happens without any violence and occasional violence also happens in relationships when there is no money involved.
You can't really compare a gun with a knife or hammer. The only thing a gun can be used for is as a weapon to harm or threaten. That violence can be used for good or evil: hunting, target practice, robbing banks or stopping criminals; but it remains violent. That's why I said it is inherently violent, although it is not inherently evil.
But you are stereotyping the shooting sports in the same way, also without regards to facts.
2 million Canadians legally possess 7 million firearms, and the only valid reason they are allowed to own them is recreation and subsistence. Research shows that this group of people is 5 times less likely to commit a homicide than the general population. So if you think that firearms in the hands of people somehow make them want to kill.... because guns are inherently violent..., doesn't wash. Firearms are inanimate objects and as such, are not violent any more than chainsaws or baseball bats in the hands of those who have no ill intent. That's because humans have an inherent revulsion to killing other humans. This was proven in research after WW2 that concluded that "only 15 to 20 percent of soldiers fired their weapons at enemy soldiers in view, even if their own lives were endangered.... This refusal is profound, surprising, and well-hidden [and] this is welcome proof of our humanity".
(On Killing: The Psychological Cost of Learning to Kill in War and Society).http://citizen-soldier.org/On-Killing.html
In any case, handguns in Canada are 3 times more likely to be used in a homicide than a long-gun, but there are 10 times fewer handguns than long-guns in private legal hands. Plus, most crime handguns are unregistered and illegally in the hands of criminals. So it was nonsense to require the registration of long-guns, when their owners were 5 times less likely to kill than the general population, and while it is the unregistered handguns used by unlicensed criminals that are most likely used to commit homicides even though they have been required to be registered since 1934.
This is the problem with Boivin. She is rational when it suits her purpose as concerns prostitution, but was not regarding registration of long-guns. As for the Conservatives, they also were rational when it suited them as concerned the long-gun registry, but not regarding prostitution. In other words, intelligent thought goes out the window when facts get in the way of the argument.
BTW, any competent machinist in a common machine shop can make a gun. In fact, the British WW2 Sten sub-machinegun was designed to be made inside of a day in a clandestine machine shop by a single person, in case Britain got invaded by the Germans. However, it is not in the interest of a law-abiding person to manufacture a gun as that will send him to prison for 5 years. As far as criminals, it is easier to obtain a smuggled handgun from the US through the local black market. Nothing to do with the long-gun registry.
To suggest that target shooting is violent, you obviously never shot a real firearm. Competition target shooting of any kind involves intense concentration, practice and attention to detail; a sense of violence implies anger and anger destroys concentration. In fact, target shooting is more related to Zen, in that outside influence and emotions have to be eliminated to be successful, including anger. Women tend to do well in the shooting sports because of their attention to detail and their ability to multi task, and I can't see them getting angry because they have a gun in their hands. I suspect that your misconceptions about shooting have to do with exposure to violent video games, as well as exposure to the glorification of gun violence in the popular entertainment media. People into the shooting sports tend not to watch violent movies of the Rambo kind, because they can see the inane stereotypes displayed. I don't hunt because I don't have the hunting instinct and I have an aversion to killing scient being; but I don't presume that hunters are angry at their prey.
