Toronto Passions

Israel at war

Frankfooter

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Apr 10, 2015
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But again - pretending he isn't listening to his voters when his voter base isn't unified on the matter is silly.
You may not like which voters he is listening to, but until we start seeing polls saying Pennsylvania Democrats are massively against his position, I don't think you can say that.
80% of dems back a ceasefire.
You must understand that in US politics that much support definitely looks like his base is 'unified'.
 

Frankfooter

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Apr 10, 2015
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The full case against UNWRA probably involves allegations that it supplies 100's of teachers who teach jihad as part of the curriculum; that is has close ties at all levels with Hamas; that it allows UNWRA administered structures like schools and hospitals to be used as military installations, etc.

I think Israel and the west are also going to pressure for the total abolition of UNWRA and the termination of the extended definition of "refugee" in the Palestinian context in an effort to normalize Palestinian-Israeli relations and then push for a 1-state solution with pressure on Israel to remove far right zionist elements from the cabinet. The same plan also tacitly includes the destruction of the Hamas hierarchy structures and the de-Hamasification of Gaza and the West bank and its replacement with a conciliatory governing regime subject to the Israeli state.
The Israeli accusation lists 12 people. 2 of those are dead.
Of those accusations it says that only 4 people actually committed any acts of violence.

All of that 'intel' came from Hamas captured on Oct 7 and likely tortured.

Israel's move to destroy the UNRWA is an attempt to stop support for Palestinian refugees and destroy records of their registration for their Right of Return. In doing so they are cutting aid from 2.2 million starving people, worsening a genocide.

 

Butler1000

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Oct 31, 2011
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I'm still waiting for evidence on this.
Even if you take the accusation against these 12 as true, how does that make UNRWA a sponsor of terror?
Is there evidence that UNRWA funds are being used to plan and execute terrorism?
How does "these people are doing bad" lead to "the humanitarian institution must be shut down"?
12 caught SO FAR. What I wonder is how many more were involved in weapons smuggling and diversion of aid to be sold on the black market. As well as used for rocket and tunnel construction instead of to help people. There had to be many more inside. And how many more just shrugged, turned a blind eye and let it happen?

Hence a need for a larger investigation and shutdown in the interm.
 

Butler1000

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Oct 31, 2011
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He will neither gain nor lose the entire voting bloc in either case.
We're talking margins.

But again - pretending he isn't listening to his voters when his voter base isn't unified on the matter is silly.
You may not like which voters he is listening to, but until we start seeing polls saying Pennsylvania Democrats are massively against his position, I don't think you can say that.



No.
It shows that one group is actively protesting and rallying right now.
That's the same problem as the "but Trump and Sanders had bigger rallies" - it isn't a very accurate measure of actual voter intention or support.
From the looks of things it could very likely cost him Michigan. 80% muslim vote to him last election, with greater actual votes than what he won the state with. And now the regional leaders shunned the Dem reps who came out and have said they are done with them. I imagine even greater hardlining in the streets.

Georgia had similar numbers albet smaller in totals.
 

Klatuu

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Dec 31, 2022
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12 caught SO FAR. What I wonder is how many more were involved in weapons smuggling and diversion of aid to be sold on the black market. As well as used for rocket and tunnel construction instead of to help people. There had to be many more inside. And how many more just shrugged, turned a blind eye and let it happen?

Hence a need for a larger investigation and shutdown in the interm.
You need to learn the difference between a deductive and an inductive argument.
 
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Dutch Oven

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Feb 12, 2019
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12 caught SO FAR. What I wonder is how many more were involved in weapons smuggling and diversion of aid to be sold on the black market. As well as used for rocket and tunnel construction instead of to help people. There had to be many more inside. And how many more just shrugged, turned a blind eye and let it happen?

Hence a need for a larger investigation and shutdown in the interm.
You need to learn the difference between a deductive and an inductive argument.
You need to learn the difference between reasonable grounds for an investigation and a pause in operations and proof of further wrongdoing. You seem confused about the point Butler was making.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
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12 caught SO FAR. What I wonder is how many more were involved in weapons smuggling and diversion of aid to be sold on the black market. As well as used for rocket and tunnel construction instead of to help people. There had to be many more inside. And how many more just shrugged, turned a blind eye and let it happen?

Hence a need for a larger investigation and shutdown in the interm.
2 of those 'caught' are dead.
Only 4 accused of taking part.

Out of 30,000 UNRWA employees that provide food and shelter to millions of refugees.
 

Frankfooter

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Apr 10, 2015
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Typical violent nature of the protestors. Like the worldwide impression of Hamas, all they know is terrorism, intimidation and violence.
Funny, protesters haven't killed 12,000 children but you think they are more violent?
 

xmontrealer

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May 23, 2005
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2 of those 'caught' are dead.
Only 4 accused of taking part.

Out of 30,000 UNRWA employees that provide food and shelter to millions of refugees.
To me the worst are the UNWRA teachers who teach Gazan children in their schools, from a very young age, to hate Jews and strive for the annihilation of Israel.

In effect they are indoctrinating a whole generation of Gazans to kill Jews and not accept any peaceful solution.

I've seen many videos in this thread, and on the internet in general, supporting that assertion.

For years Israel has been advising the U.N. that this is going on, without any corrective action by the U.N.
 

Butler1000

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Oct 31, 2011
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You need to learn the difference between a deductive and an inductive argument.
I find it difflcult to believe 12 would openly participate in Oct 7th without feeling like they could get away with it and go back to work. Its clear the UNRWA has been infiltrated by terrorists working in the open. With billions lost. And this is my tax dollars.

So time to investigate, clean house, or end our participation in this.
 

Klatuu

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Dec 31, 2022
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To me the worst are the UNWRA teachers who teach Gazan children in their schools, from a very young age, to hate Jews and strive for the annihilation of Israel.

In effect they are indoctrinating a whole generation of Gazans to kill Jews and not accept any peaceful solution.

I've seen many videos in this thread, and on the internet in general, supporting that assertion.

For years Israel has been advising the U.N. that this is going on, without any corrective action by the U.N.
Delusional. Racist
 

Klatuu

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2022
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I find it difflcult to believe 12 would openly participate in Oct 7th without feeling like they could get away with it and go back to work. Its clear the UNRWA has been infiltrated by terrorists working in the open. With billions lost. And this is my tax dollars.

So time to investigate, clean house, or end our participation in this.
Complain to Israel. They should be paying the entire bill. It’s a mess of their creation. Instead they freeload off the world. And now these shnorrers want to control what they sponge off the world for.
 
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