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In the 21st century, anti-Zionism means anti-Semitism

Frankfooter

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Moved to the correct thread.

Are Ukrainians launching unguided rockets towards Russian cities? Are there Ukrainian suicide bombers or gunmen shooting up civilians at bus stops?

In my view, freedom fighters attack the invading military (that also makes it legitimate for the military to respond). Terrorists target civilians based on political hatred.
Palestinians don't have guided rockets.
Israel does, and they use them and snipers to target civilians.
Which you never seem to have a problem with.

 

basketcase

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...

Palestinians don't have guided rockets.
...
Yes, that's why it's a war crime, not an excuse like you're trying to claim. If Hamas wants to go to war with Israeli troops then it wouldn't be terrorism but instead they choose to target civilians and openly celebrate civilian victims.


And sorry but this thread is about antisemitism. All you're doing by trying to change the topic is to show examples of it.
 

basketcase

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You're making shit up,...
Show me one quote from BDS that advocates either a One State or a Two State peace.


Of course there isn't one and you just like the group because of their Israel hatred. BDS is not a humans rights groups, nor are they peace advocates.
 

Frankfooter

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Yes, that's why it's a war crime, not an excuse like you're trying to claim. If Hamas wants to go to war with Israeli troops then it wouldn't be terrorism but instead they choose to target civilians and openly celebrate civilian victims.
No, its still a crime of using indiscriminate weapons unless you can prove they target civilians the way Israel does.
Israel is the one that targets civilians using very accurate weapons.
Just like they did with Abu Akleh


And sorry but this thread is about antisemitism. All you're doing by trying to change the topic is to show examples of it.
Now you're saying posting Independent Jewish Voices is 'antisemitic'?
You raised the topic of targeting civilians and now you say its antisemitic to respond to your posts?
Nice.

Show me one quote from BDS that advocates either a One State or a Two State peace.
Why? Its not a binary situation where those are the only two options. Nor do they have to answer to your terms.
You and Israel killed the two state solution and you say you are against the one state solution anyways.
So why not follow the South African model and use sanctions to end apartheid?
That method worked nonviolently.

BDS is not a humans rights groups, nor are they peace advocates.
Your personal, Islamaphobic, views are irrelevant.
You appear to accuse all Palestinians of being violent and genocidal repeatedly on this board.
Including Defence for Children International and now BDS.

Sorry, you just want to post random tweets demonizing Israel in a thread about antisemitism.
Posting tweets that show you do not speak for the majority of Israelis or American Jews is not 'random'.
Its on topic and you have no answer to the fact that you are backing extremist views here.
 

canada-man

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The nasty and antisemitic world of pro-Palestinian advocacy



A few days ago, the Canadian government cut funding to a so-called anti-racism group after it was revealed that one member of the group had posted antisemitic material on social media.

The member in question, Laith Marouf, a “senior consultant”, had tweeted, “You know all those loud mouthed bags of human feces, aka the Jewish White Supremacists; when we liberate Palestine and they have to go back to where they come from, they will return to being low voiced bitches of [their] Christian/Secular White Supremacist Masters.”

One might assume that someone who receives government funding would be more discrete or would disguise his antisemitism into something that at least sounds like legitimate criticism of Israel. But the reality is that pro-Palestinian posts and comments on social media rarely disguise their antisemitism because there is little incentive to do so.


Moderators act only against very blatant antisemitic posts, and even then, not always. Posts that praise terrorists who have killed Israelis are typically not seen by them as contravening the rules, even after many people report the posts. Consequently, anti-Israel activists feel very comfortable posting hateful material.

Criticizing terrorists is in fact more dangerous on social media than praising them. Senior UN official Sarah Muscroft was recently demoted for tweeting, “Relieved to see a ceasefire agreed ending hostilities impacting both Palestinians and Israeli civilians. Such indiscriminate rocket fire of Islamic Jihad provoking Israeli retaliation is condemned. The safety of all civilians is paramount — the ceasefire must be upheld.”

In May 2021, then Canada’s Green Party leader Annamie Paul was vilified on social media by vocal members of her party for not taking the side of Hamas against Israel. From that point on, Paul had to fight to retain her position as leader, and she finally resigned in November of the same year. Paul, who is both black and Jewish, described her time as leader as “the worst period in my life”.

Being pro-Palestinian does not automatically make someone an antisemite. If it did, then I would be one. But when pro-Palestinian advocacy consists of denying Israel the right to exist and to defend itself then it certainly is antisemitic, and as anyone who follows postings about Israel-Palestine on social media knows, pro-Palestinian advocacy is overwhelmingly in the antisemitic camp.

Pro-Palestinian advocacy is unfortunately not centered on how to achieve statehood for the Palestinians. Instead, it is centered on a false narrative that I wrote about previously and that can be summarized as follows: Jews are European colonialists who stole the Palestinians’ country, and if the Palestinians resist long enough, the colonialists will be discouraged and leave, just like other colonialists have left in the past.

In other words, pro-Palestinian advocacy is centered on an antisemitic lie. No one who has even a basic knowledge of Jewish history can honestly claim that Jews belong more in Europe which committed the Holocaust in an attempt to destroy the Jewish people than they belong on the land of Israel where they have over 3000 years of history, a far longer history than the Palestinians have on the same land. And we all know that there has never been an independent Palestinian state, and that when one was offered to the Palestinians in the 1947 UN partition plan and in later negotiations with Israel, they turned it down.


To gain credibility among pro-Palestinian advocates, one must accept that antisemitic lie, a lie upon which all pro-Palestinian rhetoric is built. One must support any and all forms of violence against Israel as legitimate “resistance against the occupation”, with the “occupation” covering not only the West Bank but all of Israel.

Palestinian President Mahmood Abbas’ blatant lie that Israel had committed “50 holocausts” was so shocking to German Chancellor Olaf Scholz that it left him speechless. Consequently, one must have to assume that Scholz has not read some of the typical pro-Palestinian rhetoric on social media, because if he did, he would not have been surprised by Abbas’ words.

In the end, the antisemitic rhetoric of pro-Palestinian advocates hurts the Palestinians more than it hurts Israel. It weakens pro-Palestinian advocacy by destroying its credibility. As Israel’s centrist minister of Defense, Benny Gantz, said, “Those who seek peace are expected to acknowledge the past and not to distort reality and rewrite history”. But distorting reality and rewriting history is just routine for pro-Palestinian advocates, therefore any reasonable person quickly learns that they are not seeking peace but the destruction of Israel.

The nasty and antisemitic world of pro-Palestinian advocacy | Fred Maroun | The Blogs (timesofisrael.com)
 

basketcase

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No, its still a crime of using indiscriminate weapons ...
Yet you brought up Hamas' lack of precision weapons as an excuse for their war crimes.

And instead of admitting that there is no justification for indiscriminate weapons fired by Gaza militants (as attested by your own rights groups) , you just make up shit about Israel in your usual whataboutdemonization..


IJV is a misguided fringe group. It is the people who use them as their token pet Jews to justify their hatred is where the antisemites are found.


And no, you CAN NOT find BDS supporting any peace process because they don't. There is also not a single prominent Palestinian leader who endorses either a One State or Two State peace the way that Israel's leader just did at the UN. Instead the 'moderate' PA leader's speech was focussed on whining about Balfour and calling Israel's creation an "occupation".




Why do you keep pushing for war?
 

basketcase

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...



Posting tweets that show you do not speak for the majority of Israelis or American Jews is not 'random'.
...
I make no claim to speak for Americans or Jews as I'm not even a member of either community. I also don't have your egotistically racist view that you can speak for both Jews and Palestinians (both of whom reject the One State peace you want Israelis and Palestinians forced into).
 

basketcase

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...

The member in question, Laith Marouf, a “senior consultant”, had tweeted, “You know all those loud mouthed bags of human feces, aka the Jewish White Supremacists; when we liberate Palestine and they have to go back to where they come from, they will return to being low voiced bitches of [their] Christian/Secular White Supremacist Masters.”
...
I find it interesting that little attention was put on the calls for ethnic cleansing of Jews from Israel.
 
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Frankfooter

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Yet you brought up Hamas' lack of precision weapons as an excuse for their war crimes.

And instead of admitting that there is no justification for indiscriminate weapons fired by Gaza militants (as attested by your own rights groups) , you just make up shit about Israel in your usual whataboutdemonization..


IJV is a misguided fringe group. It is the people who use them as their token pet Jews to justify their hatred is where the antisemites are found.


And no, you CAN NOT find BDS supporting any peace process because they don't. There is also not a single prominent Palestinian leader who endorses either a One State or Two State peace the way that Israel's leader just did at the UN. Instead the 'moderate' PA leader's speech was focussed on whining about Balfour and calling Israel's creation an "occupation".
No, that boat left years ago.
Its only really old people in the US and Canada that hold your extremist views blaming the victims of apartheid settler colonialism for the occupation.

IJV is one of several groups and is part of a large movement.
BDS is now aligned with BLM and Israel represents settler colonialism.

Same in the UK.

You've known this is coming for decades.
 

basketcase

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No, that boat left years ago.
...
Yes, your attempts to justify indiscriminate Gaza rockets got destroyed years ago by your often quoted rights groups yet you still try and justify them. BDS is NOT for peace and no Palestinians leaders endorse the One State farce you want Palestinians forced into (or Two State for that matter). You can't argue either of those facts.

But in your crusade, you refuse to hold Palestinian leadership accountable when their actions fly in the face of your stated values and instead just spam about whatever tweets you think will distract from your racist double standard.
 

Frankfooter

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Yes, your attempts to justify indiscriminate Gaza rockets got destroyed years ago by your often quoted rights groups yet you still try and justify them. BDS is NOT for peace and no Palestinians leaders endorse the One State farce you want Palestinians forced into (or Two State for that matter). You can't argue either of those facts.

But in your crusade, you refuse to hold Palestinian leadership accountable when their actions fly in the face of your stated values and instead just spam about whatever tweets you think will distract from your racist double standard.
I hope the bile was easy to wipe off your keyboard after writing that one.

Your crusade is to colonize more of what could have been Palestine, force Palestinians out of their homes, force them to live under apartheid and shoot them if they protest.
And you accuse me of being against peace?

This is intentionally targeting civilians, what you call 'terrorism'.
18 years of weekly protests at this one village and Israel's only answer is to keep shooting civilians.
 

basketcase

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I hope the bile was easy to wipe off your keyboard after writing that one.
...
It is pretty disgusting when yours comes through the screen.

Of course you have to try and change the topic because despite you claims of backing peace , you back BDS who doesn't promote peace and continually make excuses for a fundamentalist religious group that rejects any permanent peace that involves Jews remaining. Even Abbas' speech responding to Israel promoting a Two State peace was focussed on claiming that Israel's whole existence is illegitimate instead of embracing the chance of peace.

You claim to support human rights but ignore what your own groups say when you make excuses for Gaza groups firing war crime rockets and for militants who attack Jews who happen to be in the West Bank.

Similarly you claim to care about Palestinians but demand they get pushed into an outcome their leadership hates and the people overwhelmingly reject.


Why are you continually pushing for a genocidal war?
 

Frankfooter

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It is pretty disgusting when yours comes through the screen.

Of course you have to try and change the topic because despite you claims of backing peace , you back BDS who doesn't promote peace and continually make excuses for a fundamentalist religious group that rejects any permanent peace that involves Jews remaining. Even Abbas' speech responding to Israel promoting a Two State peace was focussed on claiming that Israel's whole existence is illegitimate instead of embracing the chance of peace.
Fundamentalist?
The 'settlers' tend to be way more fundamentalist than even Hamas. Orthodox are at least as extremist.

Stop backing your flavour of extremism, your personal choice of racial supremacy and learn to share Canadian values of equal rights.
People are people and all people deserve equal rights.
Stop trying to deny people basic human rights because of their religion.

Why are you continually pushing for a genocidal war?
This is hate speech, claiming that Palestinians are genocidal.
Not to mention backing BDS is the opposite of pushing for war, its pushing for sanctions and a peaceful resolution.
BDS is the very opposite of genocide.

 

basketcase

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Fundamentalist?
...
Yes, Hamas are fundamentalists. They are 100% clear that their goal is an Islamic Caliphate in what was Mandate Palestine. Your whataboutism about the settlers doesn't change the fact you keep excusing a religious fundamentalist group that rejects peace and uses indiscriminate violence. To go further, I have repeatedly condemned the settler movement as being counter to a peace deal and have called out the settler militants as the terrorists they are. You on the other hand refuse to criticize Hamas for their fundamentalist control, their abuses of human rights in Gaza, or even admit they are terrorists for all their attacks targeting Jews.


And no matter how much you try to dissemble, BDS does not endorse any peace plan.


Why do you keep pushing for a genocidal war against Israeli Jews (and you seem fine throwing out your stupid accusations about me wanting war against Iran so you might was well be held to your own standard)?
 

Frankfooter

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Why do you keep pushing for a genocidal war against Israeli Jews (and you seem fine throwing out your stupid accusations about me wanting war against Iran so you might was well be held to your own standard)?
This is an incredibly offensive lie.
Retract this bullshit or I'll report it to the mods.

Supporting sanctions to end apartheid is the polar opposite of genocide.
 

basketcase

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This is an incredibly offensive lie.
Retract this bullshit or I'll report it to the mods.
...
Go for it. You keep making stupid claims that my one thread and few dozen posts complaining about Iran's nuclear program is war mongering. If that is the case then your thousands of obsessive posts complaining about Israel and excusing attacks from anti-Israel groups should be held to the same standard.


BDS is not for peace. Palestinian leaders oppose a One State peace and the vast majority object to a Two State peace. Hamas is a fundamentalist religious group that Canada considers a terrorist entity. Attacks by Palestinian militants targeting civilians and indiscriminate rockets can not be justified as self defence (as per the rights groups you continually claim to support).

You can't dispute any of those statements so instead you just spam the same shit.


p.s. A major Israeli party is campaigning on the idea of a Two State peace. At the same time, Gaza's government is threatening violence because Jews are visiting Judaism's holiest site.
 

Frankfooter

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Go for it. You keep making stupid claims that my one thread and few dozen posts complaining about Iran's nuclear program is war mongering. If that is the case then your thousands of obsessive posts complaining about Israel and excusing attacks from anti-Israel groups should be held to the same standard.


BDS is not for peace. Palestinian leaders oppose a One State peace and the vast majority object to a Two State peace. Hamas is a fundamentalist religious group that Canada considers a terrorist entity. Attacks by Palestinian militants targeting civilians and indiscriminate rockets can not be justified as self defence (as per the rights groups you continually claim to support).

You can't dispute any of those statements so instead you just spam the same shit.


p.s. A major Israeli party is campaigning on the idea of a Two State peace. At the same time, Gaza's government is threatening violence because Jews are visiting Judaism's holiest site.
Arguing the Israeli position against Iran signing a nuclear treaty is warmongering. Period.
If you want peace you sign treaties.

BDS is for peace. Period.
Ending apartheid will deescalate.

Your attempts to conflate every Palestinian with 'Hamas' and therefore 'terrorism' is Islamaphobic.
Apartheid Israeli is just as racist as Hamas, only they are more violent as they have an army and Hamas doesn't.

Israel is not for peace.
They are for settler colonialism, 19th century racism and the crime of apartheid.
That is not peace nor is democracy.

Support democracy and equal rights.
Support peace.
End apartheid.



 

canada-man

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next on anti-jewish terrorism files.....




Berkeley is slammed for allowing NINE student groups to create 'Jew-free zones' that prevent speakers who support Israel or Zionism from being allowed on campus
  • Berkeley Law Students for Justice in Palestine (LSJP) adopted a bylaw prohibiting pro-Israel speakers at events
  • The bylaw is meant to ensure 'the safety and welfare of Palestinian students'
  • Erwin Chemerinsky, Berkeley Law dean, identifies as a 'progressive Zionist' and would technically be banned as a result of the bylaw
  • Several student and national groups have condemned the bylaw as 'anti-Semitic' and 'a very ugly road'
Berkeley is slammed for being anti-Semitic after NINE student groups create 'Jewish-free zones' | Daily Mail Online


Several student groups at the University of California, Berkeley, law school have adopted a bylaw prohibiting pro-Israel speakers at events.

Written by Berkeley Law Students for Justice in Palestine (LSJP), the bylaw is meant to ensure 'the safety and welfare of Palestinian students on campus.' It added that the organization will hold 'Palestine 101' training courses.

At least nine groups have adopted the rule so far, including the Berkeley Law Muslim Student Association, Middle Eastern and North African Law Students Association, Womxn of Color Collective, Asian Pacific American Law Students Association, Queer Caucus, Community Defense Project, Women of Berkeley Law and Law Students of African Descent.


Erwin Chemerinsky, the law school's dean since 2017, identifies as Jewish and recognizes that under this new bylaw he would not be able to speak.

'It is troubling to broadly exclude a particular viewpoint from being expressed,' he told The Jewish News of Northern California. 'Indeed, taken literally, this would mean that I could not be invited to speak because I support the existence of Israel, though I condemn many of its policies.'

Some Jewish organizations have criticized Chemerinsky's response, indicating he has allowed for an anti-Semitic environment at the school.


Head of the Louis D. Brandeis Center for Human Rights Under Law and Berkeley law alumnus Kenneth L. Marcus said that students involved 'are taking a step down a very ugly road.'

'Berkeley Law wouldn't be Berkeley Law if students didn't engage in a certain amount of wrongheaded political nonsense,' he said.

'This is different, because it's not just a political stunt. It is tinged with antisemitism and anti-Israel national origin discrimination.'

The Jewish Students Association at Berkeley Law wrote in response to the byline that they were 'saddened' and 'concerned' that groups will 'silence Jewish voices on campus' while alienating 'many Jewish students from certain groups on campus.'

'Students can advocate for Palestinians and criticize Israeli policies without denying Israel the right to exist or attacking the identity of other students,' the statement, co-written by five members, says.

'We are troubled that this bylaw creates an environment in which only one viewpoint is acceptable.'

The campus's larger group, the Jewish Students Association, complemented this opinion.

'When an affinity group adopts this by-law or conditions speaking privileges on denouncing Israel, many Jewish people are put in a position all too familiar: deny or denigrate a part of their identity or be excluded from community groups,' the group wrote.

The university, in addition to the aforementioned groups, did not immediately respond to inquiries by DailyMail.com.

Berkeley is slammed for being anti-Semitic after NINE student groups create 'Jewish-free zones' | Daily Mail Online
 

basketcase

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Arguing the Israeli position against Iran signing a nuclear treaty is warmongering. Period.
If you want peace you sign treaties.

BDS is for peace. Period.
Ending apartheid will deescalate.

Your attempts to conflate every Palestinian with 'Hamas' and therefore 'terrorism' is Islamaphobic.
Apartheid Israeli is just as racist as Hamas, only they are more violent as they have an army and Hamas doesn't.

Israel is not for peace.
They are for settler colonialism, 19th century racism and the crime of apartheid.
That is not peace nor is democracy.

Support democracy and equal rights.
Support peace.
End apartheid.



What a pile of steaming garbage.

1) Your continual excuses for Iran is part or your obsessive war mongering against Israel existing.
2) BDS is not for peace. You can not show a single quote from them showing they endorsee any peace plan. The only thing they endorse is the elimination of Israel.
3) You pathetically scream racism simply because you can't defend them but your crusade has you wanting to. Hamas is a designated terrorist entity according to Canada because they plan, praise, and commit acts of terror.
4) One of Israel's leading parties is campaigning on the idea of a two State peace. Meanwhile Abbas was just whining at the UN about the Balfour Declaration and Hamas is 100% clear that they will never accept a permanent peace deal that includes Israel continuing to exist.

All you have are insanely biased tweets and an innate sense of elitism that has you demanding Palestinians do what you want against their will and refusing to actually hold them accountable for their choices.
 
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