Gunfire on Parliament Hill another soldier shot

james t kirk

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Aug 17, 2001
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Fully automatics are Class III firearms in the United States and HEAVILY regulated. I wish people would do more research before speaking out of their asses.
"Heavily Regulated"

Make me laugh.

I would counter that if the conservatives had not eliminated the long gun registry leg (which every police force in the country of Canada wanted) then the madman would not have been able to get his hands on the rifle he did have. Or if he did, it would have been registered.
 

GPIDEAL

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Jun 27, 2010
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No certainly no musket. Winchester lever-action is however a late 1800's design.

Terrifyingly effective though - it was designed as a rapid-fire (for a manual action) combat rifle and fires a massive high velocity bullet. No body armour in current use save perhaps that prototype dragon-skin stuff, or if you were very lucky the heavy ceramic plate inserts, would have any chance of stopping a 30.30 round. Big tube magazine holds usually 10-15 rounds depending on the model and if you know what you're doing you can throw the whole load down range in under a minute.

Historically, military forces moved away from the lever action only because the bolt action offered the ability to be efficiently operated while lying prone, and the option for detachable box magazines. Comparable rate of fire in a battle-caliber rifle did not see the field again until the semi-auto M1 Garand, although some of the Brits trained to be almost comparably fast with their Enfields. The Winchester is an old ass gun, but not something to be laughed at for sure. In the hands of a competent shooter, I'd be much more terrified to shoot it out against this rifle than a cheap toy lead-hose like the uzi or mac 11 etc type machine pistol. I would certainly not care to fight the guy with my pistol. Hat is off to Kevin Vickers for getting right up close and personal against a guy carrying this cowboy cannon and putting him down with a handgun.
(I was being facetious about the musket but you figured that one out).


Well, like you say, a 30.30 round certainly packs a wallop.

I recall in the 70s when they came out with the bicentennial? edition of the classic Winchester (it may have had gold-plated accents). I certainly would've loved to have owned one. I've even seen Winchester rifles with scopes.

BTW, what's the range of Vickers' pistol? Wasn't it a semi-automatic? Beretta?
 

cunning linguist

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Oct 13, 2009
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"Heavily Regulated"

Make me laugh.

I would counter that if the conservatives had not eliminated the long gun registry leg (which every police force in the country of Canada wanted) then the madman would not have been able to get his hands on the rifle he did have. Or if he did, it would have been registered.
Yeah, full autos require registration with the ATF, a $200 tax stamp and tons of waiting in the United States. As for our thankfully defunct long gun registry, please explain how you think it works and I'll explain why you're wrong.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Firearms_Act

The shooter already had a criminal history, he would never have been licensed and legally allowed to purchase firearms in the first place. Remember the Dawson school shooting? That was done with a registered gun. Guess a piece of paper doesn't prevent a gun from firing, much like a registry doesn't prevent a car from running someone over or a dog from biting someone, it's just a piece of paper after all.
 

GPIDEAL

Prolific User
Jun 27, 2010
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"Heavily Regulated"

Make me laugh.

I would counter that if the conservatives had not eliminated the long gun registry leg (which every police force in the country of Canada wanted) then the madman would not have been able to get his hands on the rifle he did have. Or if he did, it would have been registered.

I don't know about 'heavily regulared' or what that means [edit: subsequently answered by Cunning Linguist], but I understand that most of those mass shootings in the States involved semi-automatics BUT with large magazines or clips, NOT automatics or assault rifles in which the automatic setting was enabled.
 
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GPIDEAL

Prolific User
Jun 27, 2010
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Yeah, full autos require registration with the ATF, a $200 tax stamp and tons of waiting in the United States. As for our thankfully defunct long gun registry, please explain how you think it works and I'll explain why you're wrong.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Firearms_Act

The shooter already had a criminal history, he would never have been licensed and legally allowed to purchase firearms in the first place. Remember the Dawson school shooting? That was done with a registered gun. Guess a piece of paper doesn't prevent a gun from firing, much like a registry doesn't prevent a car from running someone over or a dog from biting someone, it's just a piece of paper after all.

Yes, he might never have registered the rifle, or he may have stolen someone else's rifle which was registered, but unless they know who the thief is, it couldn't have been prevented.
 

cunning linguist

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Oct 13, 2009
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I don't know about 'heavily regulared' or what that means, but I understand that most of those mass shootings in the States involved semi-automatics BUT with large magazines or clips, NOT automatics or assault rifles in which the automatic setting was enabled.
Virginia Tech was done with compliant, reduced capacity magazines, reloads can be measured in single digit seconds. Capacity doesn't matter when no one's shooting back.
 

GPIDEAL

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Jun 27, 2010
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Virginia Tech was done with compliant, reduced capacity magazines, reloads can be measured in single digit seconds. Capacity doesn't matter when no one's shooting back.
True, especially with previously loaded spare clips.

What's the capacity of a compliant, reduced magazine? 4 rounds or more?
 

cunning linguist

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Oct 13, 2009
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True, especially with previously loaded spare clips.

What's the capacity of a compliant, reduced magazine? 4 rounds or more?
In Canada? 5 in a semi-auto, centrefire rifle or shotgun. 10 in a handgun. In the shitty US states, 10 rounds except for NY which had their idiotic 7 round capacity.
 

GPIDEAL

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Jun 27, 2010
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In Canada? 5 in a semi-auto, centrefire rifle or shotgun. 10 in a handgun. In the shitty US states, 10 rounds except for NY which had their idiotic 7 round capacity.
CL, I inherited my dad's 12 gauge Browning semi-auto shotgun (previously registered under my name when I had the Possession Only license under the former, regulatory regime).

It has a 5 shot capacity, but I was told by a hunter in my office that it should be plugged to reduce the capacity to 3. I see you say 5. Which is it? Or does it depend if I live in Ontario vs. say, Alberta?
 

cunning linguist

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Oct 13, 2009
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CL, I inherited my dad's 12 gauge Browning semi-auto shotgun (previously registered under my name when I had the Possession Only license under the former, regulatory regime).

It has a 5 shot capacity, but I was told by a hunter in my office that it should be plugged to reduce the capacity to 3. I see you say 5. Which is it? Or does it depend if I live in Ontario vs. say, Alberta?
3 is a hunting regulation, when you're not hunting, you can remove the plug and load 5.
 

Master Baiter

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Dec 20, 2001
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RIP Corporal Nathan Cirillo. Thank you for your service.

BTW, what's the range of Vickers' pistol? Wasn't it a semi-automatic? Beretta?
Word it is that it is his old RCMP issued S&W 5946 9mm pistol. Effective range, well, you can still hit a target 200yrds away and still do some damage but you will be aiming about 3 feet above the target's head and probably hit the target in the stomach area, provided you have the marksmanship skills to do so. You'll probably lose some velocity seeing that the S&W 5946 has a shorter 4" barrel.
 
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