Doug Ford starts privatizing health care

[danmand]

Bottom line, to build a productive, stable and upwardly mobile society, full, and universal , healthcare and education should be provided, no questions asked. Many disagree because they are brainwashed, apathetic towards anyone but themselves and outside of their circle, are selfish, and driven by greed.

Agree 100%. Canada is held back by the stupid, privileged people who want health care and education (and public transportation) to be only for the rich.
They are stupid, because they do not understand that it also benefits them when society becomes stronger. All boats rises when the tide comes in.

 

[Frankfooter]

A two-tier system doesn't have to do that.
Most of the best systems in the world are two-tiered.
But they have severe controls and structures in place to make it not spin into the kind of problem you are talking about.

The people who push two-tier in Canada almost always want something more like the American system and intend two-tier as a way to undercut the public system and ditch it.
This is the problem. There is room for a real discussion of a different structure in Canada but the people most pushing for it aren't talking in good faith, which means people who want good access and treatment mostly just refuse to have the discussion at all because (quite rationally) they view it as opening the door for people who want to wreck the system, not improve it.

We already have that with Doug. Private hernia clinics take the easy cases and refuse the hard ones but charge the same rate.
So they get easy cases for the same money that the hospitals get for taking the cases that require more surgery or recuperation time.

 

[purpleshaft]

First, Ford's government knew its own bill 124 was making health care worse for Ontario and driving out nurses.

Ford government documents admit low wages, Bill 124 worsening health staffing issues

Then Ford started cutting telehealth and replacing its services with those by Loblaw's owners and big party supporters.

‘Canada Proud’ Donor’s For-Profit ‘Virtual Health’ Service is Lobbying Doug Ford For a COVID-19 Contract

Lobbyist records show private ‘virtual’ healthcare company signed up to lobby Doug Ford’s office about securing a COVID-19 contract

pressprogress.ca

Now he wants to privatize more surgeries.

Doug Ford’s private surgery centre proposal will hurt hospitals, doctors’ college warns

Concerns over loss of staff and waits times for urgent care will grow if the premier goes through with his plan to help clear a backlog from the COVID-19 pandemic, warns the regulatory body for Ontario’s doctors.

www.thestar.com

Ford's donors will get rich and Ontario gets 18 waits for telehealth, overcrowded hospitals and surgeries for profit.

What a piece of shit.

 

[escortsxxx]

I personally support a 2 tier system. Specialist wait times are nuts and the quality of health care in Canada is absurd compared to the US.

So a 2 tier system would ensure quick access for people who are willing to pay and OHIP would stay for everyone. I also think OHIP should be expanded to include dental coverage.

But of course we need more doctors. Maybe incentivize doctors to immigrate.

This only works If you force private doctors to work 4 days a week in the public System otherwise there will be no good doctors in the public system. Who is doctor who at work 3 days a week probably up to them

And yes private care will take all the easy cases Gracie the average cost of car per tax payer.
They will also raise the wages of medical stuff across the bord. Nurses are quitting only because US will pay much more than we will For their services. Without relocation from another country Holding them back They will switch to the Private system in large numbers.

 

[Ref]

Agreed. Health care needs to be more mixed like in Europe which has better and cheaper care. The problem is Ford fucks everything up that he touches so you know this won't go well.

At least it is a start and once the ball is rolling then subsequent governments can fine tune it.

As mentioned by others, we are in the middle of the pack "best care anywhere" wise so we need to look at models that more efficient than the one we are using, And finally, we need quit comparing ourselves to the USA.

 

[Resetset]

MAID is end stage canadian healthcare. Disgusting.

 

[bazokajoe]

Well Dougie announced his plan today and it seems the fear mongering is unfounded. Lots of executives who work in the medical field don't seem to have a problem with it.

Here's what doctors and hospital officials are saying about Doug Ford's plan to expand surgery to community clinics

A number of doctors, hospital and health care executives have given Premier Doug Ford's plan to expand surgery access their strong support.

torontosun.com

 

[basketcase]

...

Bottom line, to build a productive, stable and upwardly mobile society, ...

Problem with that argument is most people arguing in favour of privatization are only interested in how it impacts them. They have no interest in helping others and no ability to see the less overt ways that other people's poverty and suffering affects them.

 

[poker]

 

[Frankfooter]

Nurses associations and doctors are coming out against this plan.
Ford can't argue he's trying to fix the system while he's still fighting nurses with bill 124.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1615091410608300038

It doesn't work.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1615000781228228608

 

[danmand]

Lots of executives who work in the medical field don't seem to have a problem with it

Quelle surprise. They are looking forward to a quadrupling of their salaries.

 

[Frankfooter]

Quelle surprise. They are looking forward to a quadrupling of their salaries.

Once they aren't government employees they can really paying themselves well.

 

[bazokajoe]

There have been private clinics for hernia procedures, vasectomy's, plastic surgery for many years and nobody has complained before. Now it's a big issue. Relax people.
If the nurses don't like working in public health care, go work in the private sector.

 

[Frankfooter]

There have been private clinics for hernia procedures, vasectomy's, plastic surgery for many years and nobody has complained before. Now it's a big issue. Relax people.
If the nurses don't like working in public health care, go work in the private sector.

Exactly, and short staffed hospitals become even more short staffed.
Then Ford argues to stop funding hospitals that aren't working well.
Then you drown it in a bathtub.

 

[bazokajoe]

Exactly, and short staffed hospitals become even more short staffed.
Then Ford argues to stop funding hospitals that aren't working well.
Then you drown it in a bathtub.

Fear mongering .

 

[danmand]

Exactly, and short staffed hospitals become even more short staffed.
Then Ford argues to stop funding hospitals that aren't working well.
Then you drown it in a bathtub.

The Thompson family will skim huge profits from health care.

This has been the wet dream of conservatives forever. They just don't dare say it. They know the people are behind universal health care and will not accept American style health care.

 

[Frankfooter]

Fear mongering .

From the guy who is giving away Ontario place to build a private spa and building a $450 million parking lot?
The same guy building a highway to his donors houses?
The same guy under investigation for his donors buying greenbelt properties just months before he announced you could develop on them?

 

[danmand]

Birgit Uwaila Umaigba



Pay attention Ontarians - Doug Ford is using taxpayers' money to fight nurses in court while planning to privatize surgeries. Things are going according to his plan; starve public healthcare, make it look dysfunctional, and then bring in privatized healthcare.

 

[GameBoy27]

Don't you just love all the fearmongers, who say we'll end up like the UK or the US if the government tries any sort of privatization? There's many other countries who have PPP healthcare that works very well. Our healthcare system has been broken for a very long time. Just throwing more money at a broken system isn't going to fix it. I'm glad the government if finally trying something different.

If you think healthcare is free in Ontario, think again. Depending upon your tax bracket, you just might be paying a lot for healthcare.

Canadians often misunderstand the true cost of our public health care system. This occurs partly because Canadians do not incur direct expenses for their use of health care, and partly because Canadians cannot readily determine the value of their contribution to public health care insurance.

In 2020, preliminary estimates suggest the average payment for public health care insurance ranges from $4,190 to $14,474 for six common Canadian family types, depending on the type of family.

The 10 percent of Canadian families with the lowest incomes will pay an average of about $471 for public health care insurance in 2020. The 10 percent of Canadian families who earn an average income of $65,522 will pay an average of $6,627 for public health care insurance, and the families among the top 10 percent of income earners in Canada will pay $39,731.

 

[danmand]

Don't you just love all the fearmongers, who say we'll end up like the UK or the US if the government tries any sort of privatization? There's many other countries who have PPP healthcare that works very well. Our healthcare system has been broken for a very long time. Just throwing more money at a broken system isn't going to fix it. I'm glad the government if finally trying something different.

If you think healthcare is free in Ontario, think again. Depending upon your tax bracket, you just might be paying a lot for healthcare.

Canadians often misunderstand the true cost of our public health care system. This occurs partly because Canadians do not incur direct expenses for their use of health care, and partly because Canadians cannot readily determine the value of their contribution to public health care insurance.

In 2020, preliminary estimates suggest the average payment for public health care insurance ranges from $4,190 to $14,474 for six common Canadian family types, depending on the type of family.

The 10 percent of Canadian families with the lowest incomes will pay an average of about $471 for public health care insurance in 2020. The 10 percent of Canadian families who earn an average income of $65,522 will pay an average of $6,627 for public health care insurance, and the families among the top 10 percent of income earners in Canada will pay $39,731.

Please leave your nonsense.

Healthcare is paid out of general government funds, just like the military, infrastructure, i.e roads and airtraffic controls and foreign affairs expenses.

Of course, in our "socialist" system, those who have higher incomes pay more in taxes than those with lower income. Deal with it.

Health care cost per Capita is $8,500 in Canada vs $13,000 in USA. Outcomes are better in Canada by all standards.