Canada V Russia

Goober Mcfly

Retired. -ish
Oct 26, 2001
10,125
11
38
NE
Heh.

I agree that the final score is the only determinate statistic in which team wins. Duh. But we were discussing how the teams were playing (outplaying) before you started arguing about this with me.

It's two different things.

*Goober watches the little red and white bobber disappear below the surface*
 

Ranger68

New member
Mar 17, 2003
3,664
0
0
LOL
I'm not sure why you think you're "sucking me in" or something.
LOL
It's FUN to destroy such bad logic. :) I welcome the opportunity.

Well, what you said earlier was patently false - read back and see.

Anyway, how well were the teams playing? Our skaters were badly outshooting theirs, but their goaltender was making a ton of saves and we weren't converting our chances well at all.
How's that analysis?
LOL

*Ranger capsizes the boat one more time*
 

Goober Mcfly

Retired. -ish
Oct 26, 2001
10,125
11
38
NE
So that's why you see alot of defensewomen attempting to block shots with their pelvic region...
 

Ranger68

New member
Mar 17, 2003
3,664
0
0
yychobbyist said:
Man, if we're spending this much time talking about junior hockey I guess it means there's just not enough hockey to talk about. It'll be pretty bleak around February or March when we're reduced to discussing the meaning of statistics in women's hockey.
Many would argue - including me - that the calibre of hockey in the Junior tournament is WORLDS better than that in the typical NHL game.
:)
 

Ranger68

New member
Mar 17, 2003
3,664
0
0
The World Juniors are mostly more interesting and exciting than the Stanley Cup.
It's only fair they get more discussion than the NHL.
:)
Even if Goober has to jump in ........
 

shack

Nitpicker Extraordinaire
Oct 2, 2001
51,493
10,010
113
Toronto
Ranger68 said:
Many would argue - including me - that the calibre of hockey in the Junior tournament is WORLDS better than that in the typical NHL game.
:)
I wouldn't say the calibre is better. The NHL'ers, for the most part, possess more skill. To say the calibre is better implies that players reach their maximum skill level in their teens.

What's better is the entertainment level, as yyc has pointed out. This is due to the unbridled enthusiasm of youth, a better flow to the game and the fact these players do not have the security of long term multi-million dollar contracts that they must protect. They're doing their darndest to get those contracts. Once they do get the megabucks, their mindset changes and understandably so.

The biggest problem with the NHL, aside from diluted talent and partly because of it, is the coaching. The coaches coach to not lose as opposed to coaching to win. It's more important for the players to not make a defensive mistake than it is to create an imaginitive offensive play. The players are not allowed to take chances on offense for fear of missing a defensive assignment. Dull, boring, clutch and grab, neutral zone trap hockey. That's what we get.

How to correct it is a problem because in theory the coaches are correct that this is the best way for their teams to succeed. It just makes for crappy entertainment. Minor tweaking like fat blue lines, shootouts, no touch icing (a good rule nonetheless), no red line etc. will not have a significant impact as long as the coaches don't let the players be creative. Watching some of the classic games from the 70's emphasized that for me. The skill level of the players wasn't any better, but the game was played with flair and with an emphasis on skating, passing and scoring. It also emphasized how ridiculous goalie equipment is today. Shrinking the equipment (which I agree with) will probably produce more goals but will not improve the flow of the game. What's the sense of watching 4 on 4 for 5 minutes when the first 60 minutes are like watching paint dry. Watching shootouts will become so routine that they will be just as boring once the novelty wears off and again, it does nothing to improve the first 60 minutes.

What will change the dynamic of the game is that hopefully a team that plays wide open firewagon hockey (a la 80's Oilers and 70's Habs) will enjoy an extended period of unbridled success. (I think Tampa was on the right road.) As history has shown in all sports is that others will try to copycat techniques that provide success for others. More teams will go for the offense and the game will be played as it should be. I only shudder to think how long we'll have to wait for that.
 
Aug 1, 2002
2,183
0
0
Toronto
I was hoping for a Canada and USA final. That way Canada could have avenged last years loss to the USA, and we would also do it on their home ice.

Oh well, it looks like Canada will meet the Russian's for the 3rd time in 4 years. Just this time Canada will end up with their first gold medal at the juniors since 1997.

Ciao,

VT
 

21pro

Crotch Sniffer
Oct 22, 2003
7,830
1
0
Caledon East
I too, would have liked to see Canada - USA but, kudos to the russkies for finishing of USA like that on their home ice!

it's sad to see the americans with all their talent really fail once again in international competition. it seems they usually do very well and win it all when they are focused or on the other hand, they completely flop with stupid plays, childish penalties and all that other garbage. (USA in Nagano, Dream Team USA Basketball, etc.)

let's hope no hotel rooms get trashed!
 

new2game

New member
Feb 15, 2004
1,119
0
0
my 2 cents or so

1st ..to Pro21....the Americans were the defending champs...but were not the odds on favorite to repeat...they didn't have the talent of last yrs team...If you had been watching any Canadian TV over the last two months..the hype on this Canadian team was incredible..I give them a lot of credit for delivering up to this point...but they MUST deliver tomorrow night....I think they will...

2nd..to Ranger...please,please,please don't spoil the winning moment tomorrow night with your analysis...we get the point....THE SCOREBOARD THE SCOREBOARD THE SCOREBOARD is your God...lol...

Lets all hope we are all back here tomorrow night talking about how Canada handled the Russians, like they handled every other opponent in this tournament

New2game
 

Ranger68

New member
Mar 17, 2003
3,664
0
0
shack said:
I wouldn't say the calibre is better. The NHL'ers, for the most part, possess more skill. To say the calibre is better implies that players reach their maximum skill level in their teens.

What's better is the entertainment level, as yyc has pointed out. This is due to the unbridled enthusiasm of youth, a better flow to the game and the fact these players do not have the security of long term multi-million dollar contracts that they must protect. They're doing their darndest to get those contracts. Once they do get the megabucks, their mindset changes and understandably so.

The biggest problem with the NHL, aside from diluted talent and partly because of it, is the coaching. The coaches coach to not lose as opposed to coaching to win. It's more important for the players to not make a defensive mistake than it is to create an imaginitive offensive play. The players are not allowed to take chances on offense for fear of missing a defensive assignment. Dull, boring, clutch and grab, neutral zone trap hockey. That's what we get.

How to correct it is a problem because in theory the coaches are correct that this is the best way for their teams to succeed. It just makes for crappy entertainment. Minor tweaking like fat blue lines, shootouts, no touch icing (a good rule nonetheless), no red line etc. will not have a significant impact as long as the coaches don't let the players be creative. Watching some of the classic games from the 70's emphasized that for me. The skill level of the players wasn't any better, but the game was played with flair and with an emphasis on skating, passing and scoring. It also emphasized how ridiculous goalie equipment is today. Shrinking the equipment (which I agree with) will probably produce more goals but will not improve the flow of the game. What's the sense of watching 4 on 4 for 5 minutes when the first 60 minutes are like watching paint dry. Watching shootouts will become so routine that they will be just as boring once the novelty wears off and again, it does nothing to improve the first 60 minutes.

What will change the dynamic of the game is that hopefully a team that plays wide open firewagon hockey (a la 80's Oilers and 70's Habs) will enjoy an extended period of unbridled success. (I think Tampa was on the right road.) As history has shown in all sports is that others will try to copycat techniques that provide success for others. More teams will go for the offense and the game will be played as it should be. I only shudder to think how long we'll have to wait for that.
Well, I think the calibre of the Junior tournament hockey IS better than the typical NHL game, as the skill of most of the players is practically NHL level as it is. And the skill is much more in evidence than an NHL game. I hear what you're saying, though.

I agree with your statements about the problems with the NHL.
One solution I'd implement would be for the referees to call *everything* in the penalty book - every time you lay a stick on an opposition player, that's a penalty. They don't call the book now, they make judgment calls about what the score is and how many penalties they've called and the flow of the game - they allow FAR too much.

Fewer teams, no-touch icing, stiffer infractions for stick-work, removal of the instigator rule - all would be in my NHL. :)
 

scubadoo

Exile on Main Street
Sep 21, 2002
1,059
0
0
75-45
GO CANADA GO
 

slowandeasy

Why am I here?
May 4, 2003
7,231
0
36
GTA
Good Luck to our boys

This is one of my favorite hockey games of the year. Canada vs. Russia or Canada vs. The USA at the World Junior Tournament.

The Russians are looking pretty powerful, and it looks like
Olvechkin is peaking at the right time.
 

Ranger68

New member
Mar 17, 2003
3,664
0
0
I concur, the.

(Was that sentence grammatically correct?)

Russians just don't have the defense to match up with ours. Ovechkin and Malkin are going to be eating some board tonight, thanks for Phaneuf and co.
 
Aug 1, 2002
2,183
0
0
Toronto
I know a few Russian guys and girls and I must admit the girls are slightly smarter then the guys. We can out smart these morons and that Ovechkin looks like one dumb mofo.

Even though they beat the American's, the Russia and Canada rivalry isn't what it once was. A more popular rival over the past 10 years has been the American's and the Russians normally under-perfrom at the professional level and they complain too much at the garbage Russian Hockey Federation.

All of the American hockey fans are rooting for Canada, especially after Ovechkin and Malkin taunted Team USA after each of their empty net goals.

We should regulate these goofs to the 2nd world country status they are. GO CANADA GO!!!

Ciao,

VT
 

shack

Nitpicker Extraordinaire
Oct 2, 2001
51,493
10,010
113
Toronto
The games barely 1/2 over but in reality it is over. 6-1 Canada and a major penalty to the Pussyans.

I loved that goal set up when Phaneuf took out two of their guys with one check.
 

Ranger68

New member
Mar 17, 2003
3,664
0
0
I think what Stacy meant was the Russians' better skill at sucking out and using their sticks in frustration.
Or was it their better skill at being totally poor sports whether they win or lose?
You were right, darling.
:)
Unfortunately, you were wrong about the *hockey* skill. We're DEMOLISHING them.

GO CANADA!
 

Mack Bolan

Active member
Sep 24, 2001
976
32
28
Some where in Cyber Space
Canada does it!

It Offical: Canada Wins! 6 - 1 Russia!

Now only if those *(%^E^ the NHL owner and Player and get their act together and give us back our HOCKEY.

HOCKEY, HOCKEY, HOCKEY, BEER, HOCKEY!

Go LEAFS Go!

Mack
 
Toronto Escorts