Canada Land of the Pussies

[slowandeasy]

Oh, isn't that sweet. After years of propping up brutal regimes and dictators, America has decided that it wants to free the world of tyranny. Excuse me while I puke.

Your hypocrisy is stunning.

First we were told it was about WMDs. They didn't pan out. So, then the war became about liberating Iraqis. The Iraqis are telling the Americans not so politely to fcuk off. They don't want your "liberation". As a result of which tens if not hundreds of thousands of Iraqis have been killed, imprisoned or tortured.

America has made the world a much more dangerous place. Iraq has become a breeding and training ground for these terrorists. They are learning new techniques in urban and guerilla warfare. Iraq has become one huge training camp for these people. And guess who they are after now? YOU.

And you have the gall to come here and call Canada a land of pussies? You really are a typical ugly American.

P.S. when are you going to the enlistment centre? Or you only show your braveness on an anonymous discussion board?

Just a few points:

1.The "propping up the brutal regimes" argument is worn out its shelf life.
Give it a rest.. it does not apply carte blanche

2. Hypocrisy is rampant in the world... get used to it

3. Iraqi's don't want "liberation"..... does this mean they do not want to
be free from tyrants and dictators? They would rather be ruled by
a bunch of warlords that control parts of the country? They would rather
deal with the terrorists who kidnap and kill aid workers (Aid workers that
are in Iraq risking their lives to help Iraqis). Tell that to the numerous
Iraqi's that I have spoken to.. they might just suicide bomb your ass right
here in Canada.

4. "America has made the world a much more dangerous place etc..."
What are we talking about here 0.0002%, 0.0005%? I tend to
agree with you that the invasion of Iraq has created a supercharged
atmosphere and made the world more dangerous... but do you really
think that by hiding behind the snowbanks here in Canada the world
was not going to get more dangerous???
Do you really think that the Terrorists see Canada as the "really nice
harmless people" next to the evil Americans... and that we will
be spared?

5. For all the guys who ask the question "when are you going to enlist, or
your children going to enlist"... how about going over to Iraq or the ME
to rally the cause for peace etc...

TWO BIG QUESTION FOR ALL THE ANTI AMERICANS/PULL OUT OF IRAQ NOW!!
(please deal with the questions below, not the right or wrong of the US being over there, any left vs. right nonsense, other moral posturing)
1. How do you justify leaving the country now, given the intensity of the
terrorist activity over there right now??
2. How can you allow terrorist who will kidnap and execute aid workers, and
other altruistic volunteers who are there to help the people of Iraq run free
If the killers of aid workers are representative of the type of terrorists
who occupy parts of Iraq, I believe that they are a bigger threat than OBL,
and should be eridicated..

 

[Asterix]

1. You don't. I don't think any sensible person is suggesting we simply pack up and leave. Jefferson referred to it as holding a wolf by the ears, you didn't like it but you didn't dare let go. That it's going to be difficult getting out in no way justifies the decision to go in.

2. The terrorists are there now because we are there, giving them a perfect training ground for new recruits. Read the CIA's own report on this if you don't believe me.

 

[slowandeasy]

1. You don't. I don't think any sensible person is suggesting we simply pack up and leave. Jefferson referred to it as holding a wolf by the ears, you didn't like it but you didn't dare let go. That it's going to be difficult getting out in no way justifies the decision to go in.

2. The terrorists are there now because we are there, giving them a perfect training ground for new recruits. Read the CIA's own report on this if you don't believe me.

There are lots of people on this board who seem to think that a viable option is to pull out of Iraq immediately...

I believe you about the terrorists being there because we are there.. It seems to be a rallying point for them... they seem to realize that if they allow democracy in Iraq, their money making ventures will be in jeopardy...

 

[Asterix]

I believe you about the terrorists being there because we are there.. It seems to be a rallying point for them... they seem to realize that if they allow democracy in Iraq, their money making ventures will be in jeopardy...

It goes beyond that. The CIA report suggests that our presence in Iraq has given terrorist organizations such a boost, as to allow them a base for future attacks in other countries for years. Our venture into Iraq has made them stronger. Careful what you wish for.

 

[lustyhombre]

Obviously, many Americans have come around to realizing that the invasion of Iraq was dead wrong - as the Europeans and Canadians have said all along ( even the majority of the Brits agreed , inspite of Blair's eloquent appeals to the contrary ) .

What should deeply trouble us all is : How was it possible for the entire US media ( never mind FOX , but the Washington Post and the NY Times ???) to be swept up in patriotic sentiment and blindly and unquestioningly accept and repeat Bush's claims equating Saddam's regime with international terrorism ?

 

[lickrolaine]

We learned years ago wars do not change anything,now we are learning that retaliation works even worse then wars.

Yes there have been wars that did make a difference,but mostly the ones we were drawn into to defend the deaths of many,many inoccent people.

We have been labeled as piece keepers,and with this comes a certain amount of controversy.But as piece keepers,it is expected.

The truth is we live in a very stable country,which is in a very unstable world.Nothing has changed in the past,present and in most likelyhood the future.This unstability has been around since time began,and will continue forever.

Pussie's,maybe yes, maybe no,but it takes someone to call someone names,this is to be expected.A lot of people envy our Country,because we were able to be here without having to exterminate the aboriginals,not the case for most other industrialized countries.We have our own unique problems because we allow democracy to exist.

In the USA there seems to be a movement,whereas,the political parties are aligning themselves with religous groups.Not good,considering there is only 2 parties,there will be a lot of people left out,or right out,,,,,,,

They have numbers,and live by the sword,we are small and choose the pen,is there really any chance of anyone winning completely,I doubt it very much.
imop

 

[happygrump]

We have been labeled as piece keepers

Actually, it's "peace keepers", but if you're referring to the gorgeous Canadian babes, then maybe "piece keepers" works too.

 

[happygrump]

TWO BIG QUESTION FOR ALL THE ANTI AMERICANS/PULL OUT OF IRAQ NOW!!
(please deal with the questions below, not the right or wrong of the US being over there, any left vs. right nonsense, other moral posturing)
1. How do you justify leaving the country now, given the intensity of the
terrorist activity over there right now??
2. How can you allow terrorist who will kidnap and execute aid workers, and
other altruistic volunteers who are there to help the people of Iraq run free
If the killers of aid workers are representative of the type of terrorists
who occupy parts of Iraq, I believe that they are a bigger threat than OBL,
and should be eridicated..

Good, thoughtful questions deserve a response.
1. The intensity of the terror action seems to be in direct proportion to the presence of the occupying forces. (I know full well that the current coalition in Iraq does not consider itself an occupying force, but that's how it's perceived among the people and insurgents in Iraq.) Remove the force and the reason for the terror is <mostly> gone. There will continue to be assassinations and bombings, undoubtedly, just like there are in other unstable countries, but the presence of coalition forces is clearly causing more trouble than it is solving.

2. Removing coalition forces from Iraq does not, in any way, abrogate the responsibility of the new Iraqi government, police and army to let terrorists run free. With the support of the Iraqi people (which will undoubtedly strengthen after the coalition leaves) the police and army will be in a better position to hunt down, capture, and deliver the terrorists to justice.

The only - and I do mean only - reason coalition forces are still in Iraq is the vanity and pride of GWB, who does not want to be seen as a President who lost the Iraq war.

As to whether or not they're more of a threat than OBL, we'll have to let history be the judge of that. But it's time to let the current government of Iraq manage their own issues (with support, certainly, in the way of intelligence mostly) and allow coalition forces to go after OBL, which was the whole purpose in the first place.

 

[slowandeasy]

Good, thoughtful questions deserve a response.
1. The intensity of the terror action seems to be in direct proportion to the presence of the occupying forces. (I know full well that the current coalition in Iraq does not consider itself an occupying force, but that's how it's perceived among the people and insurgents in Iraq.) Remove the force and the reason for the terror is <mostly> gone. There will continue to be assassinations and bombings, undoubtedly, just like there are in other unstable countries, but the presence of coalition forces is clearly causing more trouble than it is solving.

2. Removing coalition forces from Iraq does not, in any way, abrogate the responsibility of the new Iraqi government, police and army to let terrorists run free. With the support of the Iraqi people (which will undoubtedly strengthen after the coalition leaves) the police and army will be in a better position to hunt down, capture, and deliver the terrorists to justice.

The only - and I do mean only - reason coalition forces are still in Iraq is the vanity and pride of GWB, who does not want to be seen as a President who lost the Iraq war.

As to whether or not they're more of a threat than OBL, we'll have to let history be the judge of that. But it's time to let the current government of Iraq manage their own issues (with support, certainly, in the way of intelligence mostly) and allow coalition forces to go after OBL, which was the whole purpose in the first place.

Happy.. thanks for the excellent response... you almost won me over... but unfortunately, like a little kid (GWB perhaps), once I have the prize in my hand, I cannot seem to let it go.. IT'S MINE, IT'S MINE I TELL YOU...

Thanks for the valiant attempt!!!

 

[solitaria]

But, isn't my post true!! Haven't Canadians benefited greatly
by sharing a common border and in the vast majority of instances
had the benefit of a common bond?

No it's not true. When you say that one "shouldn't bite the hand that feeds you" the implication is that the USA isn't getting anything in return from the arrangement and that you feed us like you would a dog out of a sense of ownership and kindness. That's not the reason the States does business with us; it's because the USA benefits from the deal economically or else you wouldn't do it.

 

[feminista]

LUsty:

What should deeply trouble us all is : How was it possible for the entire US media ( never mind FOX , but the Washington Post and the NY Times ???) to be swept up in patriotic sentiment and blindly and unquestioningly accept and repeat Bush's claims equating Saddam's regime with international terrorism ?

so true.

The US media has decided to abandon truth in favour of patriotism. the tragedy of 911 is that objectivity was lost -longterm. Some senators and congressmen still claim saddam was involved with 911. Americans are now tolerating blatent lies, unjust military agression, torture etc. They don't recognize truth anymore. The american people have been fattened up & dumbed down and so has the media -all lead by their simple minded puppet of a leader. The american civilization is in decline.

 

[zzbottom]

My only explanation is that we badly needed to punch someone for getting
cold-cocked. Someone was going to get their asses kicked and Saddam's
was the weakest regime in the Middle East. Our furor and venom allowed
POTUS43 to exploit the situation. Saddam had been embargoed and had
both British and American aircraft on dayly overflights. He was the perfect
target.

What better target than Saddam; what better war trophy than the oil reserves
in Iraq. He was the perfect target. Just like the perfect storm, the results
have been a monumental disaster. The media wasn't about to fight back.
They caved in as did the US Senate, and the American people were played
the propaganda sonata to the hilt. The perfect war - and what a disaster.

Don

Sorry Don, don't mean to pick on you specifically given the fact that your posts are for the most part well thought out and intelligent. However, your stance on the issue at hand is somewhat confusing. On the one hand you say that you agree with Canada's position on the war, on the other you accuse us of being whiney and ungrateful by biting the hand that feeds us. Sorry but there are a whole lot of negative implications there for me to read into. What is that you are trying to say exactly? That we should remain silent in the event that someone calls us out as pussies for the sake of mutually benificial economic reasons? Seems like an oxymoron to me....holding back your beliefs and convictions when being called out seems well...like a pussy kind of thing to do. Canada has never been afraid to go to war when it feels the reasons for war are justified, so yes, as a Canadian I am going to take offense when someone accuses us of being whiney or classless or being a "pussy" for not going to war. More so given the fact that many Americans themselves are not in favour of this war. Again, not trying to start an argument but looking at your original post and reading your subsequent posts leaves me somewhat confused as to where you stand on the topic as whole.

 

[onthebottom]

A point that has been made before:

https://terb.cc/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=71919&page=3&pp=9&highlight=pussy

A silly statement (develop our own nuke program) followed by a unsubstantiated logical leap (since we can`t develop a proper ground force without bankrupting Canada). Why then are you ranked 39th for peacekeeping forces but have the 8th largest economy. You`re spoiled pussies that`s all (tough firmly in cheek).

My favorite mag cover ever: http://www.nationalreview.com/magazine/fullsize11-25-02.html

OTB

 

[Mcluhan]

A point that has been made before:

https://terb.cc/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=71919&page=3&pp=9&highlight=pussy

Canada definitely needs more DND budget allocation to shape up our military, but not with a ground war in mind. I don`t think the Chinese are hitting Vancouver Island any time soon. Unfortuantely, we are sitting ducks for any terrorist organisation that wants to set up a base operation here, with the US as a target. Intel, and infrastructure security needs to be the main focus. Our nuclear plants are a prime target. Our coast guard is a joke. Security at our military bases is also a joke...I wont say more on this, because who knows who reads this board, but if you know about this subject, you are shuddering.

The way to deal with terrorism in my opinion is get them before they get you. This requires a united front between governments. The US should have taken out bin laden well before 9/11. Hindsight is 20/20. The absolute worst way to deal with terrorism is to promote its spread by politicising it. An example would be attacking Iraq in the name of fighting terrorism and destroying the country. Another example is Bush hugging Ariel Sharon and making moronic statements in Wastington about supporting Israel`s annexation of the West Bank areas, a situation he neither understands or has any rightful place of involvement.

Ground wars belong to the last century. In this century we need develop a global spirit of cooperation to secure our boarders. Such weak points as shipping container movements would be a great place to start getting a handle on the weaknesses.

My personal fear, and you may call me radical is that bin laden will attack simultaneously, five or more deep sea container ports. The just-in-time inventory system upset, would have north america on it`s knees for a year.

our day-to-day lives are all very vulnerable these days, and ground wars have nothing to do with it. In my view it`s just like the london bombing...not a case of `if` but a case of `when`. The next one will be bigger than the last. It`s their trademark.

 

[Jade4u]

I have not read a word of this thread. Only the title and all I have to say is.

meeeeeeooooooowwwwwww meooooooooowwwwwwww mew mew mew.

OK I lied I read the very first post only.

spank me.

 

[MrLuvr]

LUsty:

so true.

The US media has decided to abandon truth in favour of patriotism. the tragedy of 911 is that objectivity was lost -longterm. Some senators and congressmen still claim saddam was involved with 911. Americans are now tolerating blatent lies, unjust military agression, torture etc. They don't recognize truth anymore. The american people have been fattened up & dumbed down and so has the media -all lead by their simple minded puppet of a leader. The american civilization is in decline.

I love it when you talk dirty...

 

[cyrus]

I have not read a word of this thread. Only the title and all I have to say is.

meeeeeeooooooowwwwwww meooooooooowwwwwwww mew mew mew.

OK I lied I read the very first post only.

spank me.

No babe, I guess they got you fooled in with the title just like they did with me, ha!
Unfortunately this is suppose to be a serious political discussion forum for some silly pussy Neo-con Bush ass kissers! j/k

 

[happygrump]

It appears Canadians can lash out against the US. But when a responsive salvo is fired in return it is rejected out of hand.

Most often that's because some - not you - resort to name calling and other idiotic comebacks. Those are the responses rejected out of hand.

Are you saying I don't have the right to return fire?

Of course you have the right to defend your beliefs. But simply saying so does not make it so. So make an argument, supported by facts and observations, and take the emotion out of the argument. Getting all emotional and illogical in an argument is the wimmen's job.

ducks and runs for cover

 

[slowandeasy]

LUsty:

so true.

The US media has decided to abandon truth in favour of patriotism. the tragedy of 911 is that objectivity was lost -longterm. Some senators and congressmen still claim saddam was involved with 911. Americans are now tolerating blatent lies, unjust military agression, torture etc. They don't recognize truth anymore. The american people have been fattened up & dumbed down and so has the media -all lead by their simple minded puppet of a leader. The american civilization is in decline.

"Holy Chicken Little Batman.... do you think that the Joker and Penguin are involved!!!!!" (From the original Batman series not the movies)...

My mouth is agape with the simplicity that you have chosen to describe a infinitely complex model.....
.
.
.
.

I can hardly wait for your solution for travelling as the speed of light or faster... I bet it will be something as simple as using a very large rubberband

 

[Mcluhan]

Please read my post above. I though I raised issues that were historically
accurate and logical.

I'll let it go at that!

Don

Don, bashing Canada is a sport here in Canada that we Canadians are very practiced at. It's a national pastime. Few here will take offense to the fact that you want to join in the sport. There are rules however which must be observed. The prime rule would be never mention any benefit that Canada derives from its association with the US (bad form). As for Britian, you would be very hard pressed to find any benefits from our association over the past Century, other than the mass immmigration of skilled trades people in the 50's. On the other hand, we 'immediately' stood up sending thousands of troops to defend her during two world wars. France is littered with Canadian graves in consequence.

There are lots of better ways to rip into Canada. Our soft dough-headed stance on having our country natural resources plundered by foreign interests would be a good place to start. The inequities in the FTA another.

Yes, there are a few things that Canada has contibuted to the well being of Americans on a day-to-day living basis other than water, softwood, oil & gas, and electrical power... insulin comes to mind...the Telephone...etc.

Bash away, have fun, as long as you don't attack our national sport, no one will seriously mind, or for that matter pay much attention