and the results for those top 8 HR hitters who didn't participate are what? Something makes me think their results are much the same or you would have posted them. Let's also remember the the second half was shorter.
Blue Jays, 2013 edition
- Thread starter Perry Mason
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and the results for those top 8 HR hitters who didn't participate are what? Something makes me think their results are much the same or you would have posted them. Let's also remember the the second half was shorter.
Dusty Baker was fired by the Cincinnati Reds for making the playoffs and then left the party too early. The Jays probably would give Gibbons a new 5 years contract if he brings his team to the playoffs next year.
Check post #2748, after the thread had been dead for a month, RS opens it up again with a half ass try at making his position valid.
Now we are watching young pitchers like Wacha shine in post season....and we stick with the former 12th man on a mediocre blue jay pitching staff to develop our young arms. The comments people have been made about poor player development of the jays really resonate when you look at the younger players now performing in the playoffs.
At the very least, make Hentgen the pitching coach...he has a track record. And how about getting one of the senior coaches from one of them successful teams..to manage the jays....hell they might even stand and look interested during games, instead of sitting like a lump on his corner of the bench like Gibbons
At the very least, make Hentgen the pitching coach...he has a track record. And how about getting one of the senior coaches from one of them successful teams..to manage the jays....hell they might even stand and look interested during games, instead of sitting like a lump on his corner of the bench like Gibbons
There is very little correlation between success as a player and ability to teach/success as a coach in most sports.
Case in point, look at the playing and coaching careers of Scotty Bowman and Wayne Gretzky.
Hentgen's track record as a coach is almost zero.
Generally, I agree...but how can you stick with Pete Walker as pitching coach given last year's performances? If they let him go, do you think any other major league team will want him as pitching coach? Generally my lament is watching a lot of very good young players doing well in the playoffs...while we had a 74-88 season.
Relief pitching was very good until they started to tire from over use, while starting pitching left a lot to be desired. Walker was/is responsible for the pitchers so while his starters were dismal his relievers were decent. Not a Walker fan but I understand why he hasn't been released. Once the world series is over they may look to see who is available.
Hentgen may not want the job. My understanding was he was reluctant to take the bullpen job and as Shack says his track record is negligible.
Do the relief pitchers in the play offs look tired from over use? Many have been pitching all season in meaningful games. I am suggesting we have systemic and coaching problems in the organization. If this kid Wacha can pitch back to back one hitters.......why do we have a Marcus Stroman who isn't ready (for example)?
That sentiment is much different than saying Walker is no good because of his playing history or that Hentgen would be an upgrade because of his Cy. I believe this is not the first time you've expressed this sentiment.
As to how good of a coach Walker is, most likely, we as outsiders looking in and never being part of a major league team in any capacity, probably are not in a great position to know how well he is doing his job. The starters did poorly yet the bullpen was quite good. How does that translate back to Walker? He knows how to coach relievers but not starters?
Back to including a coach's playing resume as part of his credentials, what did Sparky Anderson or Tony LaRussa do as players. Not sure if Spark ever made it out of AAA (I saw him play for the Leafs in the 60's). Don't recall Tony's major league career.
Most likely they are not tired because the starters logged more innings.
Does the bullpen pitching 2 innings in a meaningful game as draining as a bullpen pitching 5 innings in a non-meaningful game? Probably not.
We had 8 guys in the bullpen, 4 of them lefties. How many times did guys pitch back to back (it is actually a Gibbons plus in how he manages bullpen innings)? But hey I can be as full of crap as anybody. Any way, my underlying question or theory - is that the blue jay problems are related to coaching, leadership and player development. Why do Oakland and Tampa pop up in the play offs frequently and we don't (or the Angels for that matter)?
It just seems to me there has got to be a better pitching coach around somewhere and a better manager. And I do think pitching under pressure can be draining - but winners thrive on pressure.
It just seems to me there has got to be a better pitching coach around somewhere and a better manager. And I do think pitching under pressure can be draining - but winners thrive on pressure.
If J.Farrell is going to win the World Series this year,he should send half of the ring to AA!
Moreso the reason to give Hentgen every bit of his due. The Bullpen coach is in charge of the relievers. That's his primary role within the organization. The pitching coach's (in this case Walker) primary role is the five starters. Of course, if need be, the Bullpen coach will defer to the Pitching coach but that is often not the case. It's usually the other way around as the Bullpen coach is much more familiar with the day-to-day nuances of the relievers. A lot of things went wrong this season for the Birds but the Bullpen was actually one of the better points. All due to Hentgen's influence and coaching.
Hentgen is a home grown, true blue (jay) from the farm system pitcher who started as a reliever and became a Cy Young winning starter with World Series experience and success.
You'd have to search far and wide for a Blue Jay pitching coach with better credentials than that.
Although I agree with everything you said prior, this is a silly comment.
And how does that mean that he has the skills to communicate what he did so that other pitchers can benefit from his knowledge. Some people have the skill to perform. Some have the skill to impart knowledge. The two are not necessarily linked.
I'm not saying Pat would not be a good coach (I'm an admirer of his as a player and person), but there is no way that anybody in our positions on the outside can definitively say that he knows how to "coach".
