Black Slavery in America

fuji

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Italians were only allowed too get jobs in construction, they are the blame for all concrete and asphalt in Toronto. You don't hear them complaining!
First off, you are exagerrating the plight of Italians in Toronto. Second off, as I understand it, they came to Canada willingly, proudly took those jobs, and got paid for their work.

I think you are completely off your rocker if you think that is anything, anything at all, like the systematic, institutionalized enslavement and popular persecution of blacks. Not only were they denied all of the basic rights which even Italians got upon obtaining citizenship in either Canada or the US, but there was an entire institutionalized media campaign to portray them as an inferior race--a campaign which many blacks wound up internalizing.

The treatment of blacks in the United States was a centuries long crime against humanity the scale of which has seldom been seen elsewhere in the modern world.
 

good to go

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I drove to Memphis and visited the Human Rights Musuem and read the exhibits and have seen the pictures on display there. It has been less than 40 years for some states where they treated their black americans like slaves. I felt terrible for all of those who were killed and tortured by their own countrymen.
 

fuji

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There is also gun violence in Toronto and Canada never had Black slavery. In fact, Blacks in Canada in the 1800's were treated better than Irish Catholics.
That is a load of nonsense, blacks were never treated better than Irish catholics, and many of the blacks in Canada are in fact the children of escaped slaves from the United States, which means they brought with them the internalized cultural damage inflicted by slavery and persecution. Canada was also subject to the massive American media campaign to depict blacks as inferior.
 

fuji

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My Grandfather had too change his name to an Aglo sounding one, my father wore nice suits eveybody called him Don or Mifiosa because he was lucky enough too work in a office.
Oh boo hoo, had to anglocize your name, gee whiz that MUST have been rough. So did you family choose the name for themselves? Or did they take the name of their slavemasters? And how many of them were lynched? Were they routinely whipped if they stepped out of line? And it must have been tough having the family sold off, the kids going to different owners and all that.

It is incredible that you think the trivialities your ancestors face measure up the depth and scale to which african Americans were persecuted by the entire apparatus of the US government and society.
 

fuji

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Slavery was awful yes but we had a civil war and ended it.
It took you until the 1960's to have a civil rights movement that finally enfranchised blacks in any meaningful way, and you guys STILL think that the civil rights movement was controversial.
 

Petzel

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If you were Italian in the 50s, you could get arrested or in shit with the cops for walking on the 'wrong side of the street'. My dad was called a 'DP'. They did face discrimination, but worse was during the war where many were put into internment camps like the Japanese. Some Who's Who of Canada members changed their names from those earlier times, even though they have built this city and contributed immensely to the community (I know of some that were even in the Canadian forces during WWII).

Nothing like slavery though and what I saw in Django myself on Friday was pretty bad. The movie though had its amusing moments and characters.

DP=displaced person, as were many after WW2.
 

blackrock13

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Fool. Slavery never began in 1776. So where's the outrage at slavery until then?

Oh wait this isn't really about Slavery is it? (Horrible as it was) It's about taking another shot at the Superpower.

Big surprise there. You show me any other country anywhere that has owned up to Slavery horrors like the U.S. has.

Most recently it was Spielberg's Lincoln but don't forget Mississippi Burning/Ghosts Of Mississippi/ X The little rock 9 and several others.

Do racist assholes still exist in the U.S.? Unfortunately yes but they are shunned by good honest people. (They should be prayed for actually)

So get off your high horse Canada. You're not the innocent goody two-shoes you think you are.
It's when it ended in the US that is the real shame.
 

fuji

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Fool. Slavery never began in 1776. So where's the outrage at slavery until then?
Who said anything about 1776? You enslaved and persecuted blacks before and after that date. In terms of the lot of the average black American, 1776 meant absolutely fucking nothing.

You continued on with blacks having inferior schools, separate places to sit on busses, different washrooms, different doors to enter buildings--a system of virtual apartheid if you're honest--right up into the 1960's, and even today it is not hard to find fundamentally racist people continuing the persecution, though from the 1980's onwards it's finally gotten a little better.

Oh wait this isn't really about Slavery is it? (Horrible as it was) It's about taking another shot at the Superpower.
Oh wait if you could get off your "America versus the world" hobby horse you might actually re-read the thread and find out the topic was why does the US have more crime than other industrialized nations. You guys have third world levels of crime, despite having a strong economy and overall good opportunities. Why is that?

Everyone, and I mean everyone, knows that your crime is fundamentally linked to the problems with your african American communities. On another thread the local black-defenders, frankcastle, toke, and so on, were ganging up on me for having the nerve to suggest that blacks were responsible for a lot of the crime. Well, everybody knows they are.

But why?

My premise here, and I think it's bloody hard to dispute, is that it's the lingering effects of the absolute atrocity inflicted on the african american community by a regime which--let's put it in terms that are actually honest--by a slaving nation that was racist to the core, which institutionalized discrimination, popularized it, and persecuted blacks not only physically through beatings, not only by forcibly separating and breaking familes, but through a massive media propaganda campaign to convince absolutely everyone--blacks most of all--that they were inferior to everybody else.

Sure, for the last forty years or so you've been trying hard to undo the damage. You've done good things like implement affirmative action programs and launch campaigns to convince people they oops, hey sorry, blacks are OK. And you've elected a half black President, which is wonderful.

But considering the scope and the scale of the hundreds of years long human rights crimes that you perpetrated on your black citizens--well it's not surprising it's taking longer than 40 years to put humpty dumpty back together again. You don't commit atrocity on that scale and for that many hundreds of years without creating deep, fundamental, generations long problems.

The crime you have today, that's the chickens coming home to roost. It's a difficult, horrible problem, which involves recognizing two things nobody likes to recognize:

-- Institutionalized racism in the United States has created on hell of a monster of a problem, and

-- The problem has a racial component, there is a broken community, that is producing broken people as a result of it

Some people squirm about the idea of affirmative action and call it reverse descrimination. OK. Let's talk reparations. The benefits of the various equity programs designed to mitigate the damage you inflicted is really a drop in the bucket compared to the scale of atrocity perpetrated.

Big surprise there. You show me any other country anywhere that has owned up to Slavery horrors like the U.S. has.
The US was one of the *last* Western countries to practice slavery, everybody else got out of it much earlier. The reason nobody else has had to own up to it is that nobody else practiced it quite so long, quote so thoroughly, or quite so viciously as the United States. Nobody else in the West anyway.
 

GPIDEAL

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Oh boo hoo, had to anglocize your name, gee whiz that MUST have been rough. So did you family choose the name for themselves? Or did they take the name of their slavemasters? And how many of them were lynched? Were they routinely whipped if they stepped out of line? And it must have been tough having the family sold off, the kids going to different owners and all that.

It is incredible that you think the trivialities your ancestors face measure up the depth and scale to which african Americans were persecuted by the entire apparatus of the US government and society.

He's not comparing it to slavery! He's just making a side comment like others did.

Name changes were necessary to avoid discrimination or persecution which isn't tolerable in any shape or form.
 

Petzel

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Thomas Jefferson and Andrew Jackson all owned slaves too. It was the times they lived in and slavery was a very old institution dating back over many centuries. Even the Jews were enslaved in Babylon.
On a tour of an old plantation in South Carolina, the slave quarter huts were still standing. No doors or real windows to speak of and mud floors in a hut that was approx. 12 X 6 which housed up to 12 people. Only 1 in 6 slaves made it past the age 5 and most died by 45 years old from disease, poor nutrition and rotten teeth that abscessed and caused fatal infection. They also labored from dawn to sundown which in the summer could be as long as 14 hours.
Ken Burns the Civil War said there were approx. 11 million people in all the southern states and 4 million of those were slaves.
 

GPIDEAL

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First off, you are exagerrating the plight of Italians in Toronto. Second off, as I understand it, they came to Canada willingly, proudly took those jobs, and got paid for their work.

I think you are completely off your rocker if you think that is anything, anything at all, like the systematic, institutionalized enslavement and popular persecution of blacks. Not only were they denied all of the basic rights which even Italians got upon obtaining citizenship in either Canada or the US, but there was an entire institutionalized media campaign to portray them as an inferior race--a campaign which many blacks wound up internalizing.

The treatment of blacks in the United States was a centuries long crime against humanity the scale of which has seldom been seen elsewhere in the modern world.

FFS Fuji, I doubt he's comparing the plight of Italians to slavery but only making a side comment when the topic of reparations was brought up. In fact, the Japanese and Italians were interned prior to and during WWII in certain camps and those respective communities sought reparations from the Canadian government (the National Congress of Italian Canadians sought reparations as did the Japanese before them who probably had it worse).

The reason why Italians got into construction because it was basically cheap, hard labour - the only jobs farmers and peasants or uneducated immigrants could get yet they were proud people but I don't think it was their preference to take these jobs (my dad told me about a job working for well, I won't say, but once his boss told him "From sunrise to sunset, this is all you get", so he told him to fuck off. Eventually he started his own contracting business and the rest is history). It was only the revolts during the 50s with Italians dying in the subway projects that motivated the union movement.
 

GPIDEAL

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Thomas Jefferson and Andrew Jackson all owned slaves too. It was the times they lived in and slavery was a very old institution dating back over many centuries. Even the Jews were enslaved in Babylon.
On a tour of an old plantation in South Carolina, the slave quarter huts were still standing. No doors or real windows to speak of and mud floors in a hut that was approx. 12 X 6 which housed up to 12 people. Only 1 in 6 slaves made it past the age 5 and most died by 45 years old from disease, poor nutrition and rotten teeth that abscessed and caused fatal infection. They also labored from dawn to sundown which in the summer could be as long as 14 hours.
Ken Burns the Civil War said there were approx. 11 million people in all the southern states and 4 million of those were slaves.
There are a few African Americans with Jefferson's DNA (these guys bedded their slave women, and I many African American slave women were raped).
 

Toke

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Oct 14, 2002
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First off, you are exagerrating the plight of Italians in Toronto. Second off, as I understand it, they came to Canada willingly, proudly took those jobs, and got paid for their work.

I think you are completely off your rocker if you think that is anything, anything at all, like the systematic, institutionalized enslavement and popular persecution of blacks. Not only were they denied all of the basic rights which even Italians got upon obtaining citizenship in either Canada or the US, but there was an entire institutionalized media campaign to portray them as an inferior race--a campaign which many blacks wound up internalizing.

The treatment of blacks in the United States was a centuries long crime against humanity the scale of which has seldom been seen elsewhere in the modern world.
Not that I am complaining, but I am begining to really wonder who this is using fuji's account. It's getting odder and odder.... :D But I like it.
 

eldoguy

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Oh boo hoo, had to anglocize your name, gee whiz that MUST have been rough. So did you family choose the name for themselves? Or did they take the name of their slavemasters? And how many of them were lynched? Were they routinely whipped if they stepped out of line? And it must have been tough having the family sold off, the kids going to different owners and all that.

It is incredible that you think the trivialities your ancestors face measure up the depth and scale to whicAfricanan Americans were persecuted by the entire apparatus of the US government and society.


Eastern slave traders, made deals with the head of the tribes in Africa to rid the people and the generations of people of laws that were broken! Point being there own people sold them out too slavery, so share the blame.
 

Rockslinger

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Apr 24, 2005
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Lincoln should have let the 7-11-13 Southern states go ("let the erring sisters go in peace"). Instead he got the U.S. into a civil war that killed almost 700,000 Americans and now all 50 states have to wear the sins of the South. In short time, slavery would have been resolved in the South like it has in the rest of the Americas. BTW: It was sugar and not cotton that brought the first slaves to the Americas.
 

Rockslinger

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But one can argue that the benfits reaped from slavery are still enjoyed by the ancestors.
The Civil War destroyed the great plantations and the economy of the South. You can't get blood from a stone although the "Carpetbaggers" tried.
 
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