Bibi Wins, Two State Solution Dies?

[Moviefan-2]

Netanyahu promised he wouldn't support a Palestinian state or allow the two state solution to come to pass as long as he was in office, and promised also that he would never give up security control of the Jordan Valley and West Bank, which means he will never support a sovereign Palestinian state.

It's funny how your analyses of Netanyahu's statements always miss the point.

What Netanyahu was saying was that he doesn't want another situation like what occurred in Gaza -- Israel ended its occupation, and the Palestinians responded by escalating their terrorist attacks against Israel.

His position is entirely reasonable.

Despite your attempts to distort the context, Netanyahu's position has been clear. He is opposed to creating a Palestinian state that is focused on destroying Israel.

If the Palestinians accept the existence of a Jewish nation and renounce terrorism, Netanyahu has stated that he will support the creation of a Palestinian state.

The issue is the Palestinians, not Netanyahu. It is the Palestinians' fixation on killing Jews that is preventing them from making any progress.

 

[Frankfooter]

No you fucking liar he never said that. YOU added the word "support" because you are lying clown. You can't just keep rewording what people say in order to change their meaning to fit your lying.

He promised that a state would not be established while he was in office, not all the other shit you are spewing about not supporting one.

Reality actually exists you know, you can't change it by trying to reword things.

In the final days of the hotly contested campaign, Netanyahu said he would not support the creation of an independent Palestinian state. That position flew in the face of that traditionally taken by the U.S., Europe and Canada.

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/c...o-state-solution-for-israelis-and-paletinians

That's from the Post.
Did they lie?

Promising to not allow a Palestinian state to be created is clearly not supporting the two state solution.
Only an idiot would try to argue otherwise.

 

[Frankfooter]

His position is entirely reasonable.

That's funny, I thought you said you supported the two state solution.

 

[Moviefan-2]

That's funny, I thought you said you supported the two state solution.

I do. I didn't post anything that called that into question.

 

[fuji]

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/c...o-state-solution-for-israelis-and-paletinians

That's from the Post.
Did they lie?

Promising to not allow a Palestinian state to be created is clearly not supporting the two state solution.
Only an idiot would try to argue otherwise.

You have been proven wrong on this dozens of times, you are just a lying sack of shit. His actual statement was that he would not allow a Palestinian state to be established while he was in office. He has CLEARLY stated that he supports a Palestinian state.

You are really a pathetic lying clown.

 

[Frankfooter]

You have been proven wrong on this dozens of times, you are just a lying sack of shit. His actual statement was that he would not allow a Palestinian state to be established while he was in office. He has CLEARLY stated that he supports a Palestinian state.

No, he clearly doesn't support a Palestinian state, in fact he promised he would stop one from being created while he is in office.



We all accept that the world and the UN recognize Palestine as a state.
The question is what does Israel call it.

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has urged the International Criminal Court (ICC) to reject the Palestinians' request for a membership because they did not rank as a state.
"We expect the ICC to reject the hypocritical request by the Palestinian Authority, which is not a state but an entity linked to a terrorist organisation," he said in a statement on Thursday, referring to Hamas.

On Gaza:

“The root cause of the violence that burst from Gaza is not Israel’s occupation in Gaza, for a simple reason: Israel doesn’t occupy Gaza,” Netanyahu said.

http://www.jpost.com/Arab-Israeli-Conflict/Netanyahu-to-Ban-Gaza-is-not-occupied-378807

On ending the occupation.

Amid the current conflict, he elaborated, “I think the Israeli people understand now what I always say: that there cannot be a situation, under any agreement, in which we relinquish security control of the territory west of the River Jordan” — a reference to the Jordan Valley and the West Bank — as Kerry had urged during a US-led peace effort that collapsed in April.

http://www.timesofisrael.com/netany...-israel-cant-relinquish-control-of-west-bank/

On the occupation.

Netanyahu-appointed panel: Israel isn't an occupying force in West Bank

http://www.haaretz.com/news/diploma...sn-t-an-occupying-force-in-west-bank-1.449895

Not only does Netanyahu not support a Palestinian state, he refuses to even admit that Palestine is recognized already as a state.
Instead he says its not a state, not occupied and promises to never give up security control of the West Bank and Jordan.
Only an idiot thinks that is supporting a Palestinian state.

 

[Moviefan-2]

We all accept that the world and the UN recognize Palestine as a state.

Let's see if I have this straight.

- You say Palestine is a state.

- GoWest says the Palestinians are living in the state of Israel.

- Israel says the areas in question are disputed territories.

- The United Nations says Palestine is essentially an ex-officio state, or what it calls a non-member observer state.

- The UN Security Council voted last December against the establishment of a Palestinian state.

- Most people refer to the West Bank as an occupied territory.

I don't think I would be throwing insults at people who hold one view or another. It seems to me there is a need for some clarity on this matter.

 

[fuji]

No, he clearly doesn't support a Palestinian state, in fact he promised he would stop one from being created while he is in office.

He has said he supports a Palestinian state you lying sack of shit.

 

[Frankfooter]

He has said he supports a Palestinian state you lying sack of shit.

Speaking of lying.

The French president, Nicolas Sarkozy, described the Israeli prime minister, Binyamin Netanyahu, as a "liar" in a private exchange with Barack Obama at last week's G20 summit in Cannes that was inadvertently broadcast to journalists.

"I cannot stand him. He's a liar," Sarkozy told Obama. The US president responded by saying: "You're fed up with him? I have to deal with him every day."

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/nov/08/sarkozy-obama-netanyahu-gaffe-microphone

And how about a quote from Netanyahu's Likud party charter?

c. “The Government of Israel flatly rejects the establishment of a Palestinian Arab state west of the Jordan river.”

d. “The Jewish communities in Judea, Samaria and Gaza are the realization of Zionist values. Settlement of the land is a clear expression of the unassailable right of the Jewish people to the Land of Israel and constitutes an important asset in the defense of the vital interests of the State of Israel. The Likud will continue to strengthen and develop these communities and will prevent their uprooting.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Likud#Ideological_positions

Yet another false accusation you need to apologize for.
Have you no shame?

 

[fuji]

He has said he supports a Palestinian state you lying sack of shit.

 

[Frankfooter]

He has said he supports a Palestinian state you lying sack of shit.

Sure, but Sarkozy called him a liar.

He also said he'd:
a) block the establishment of a Palestinian state as long as he's PM
b) never cede control of the West Bank and Jordan Valley
and
c) his party charter calls for taking over the West Bank and Jordan Valley.

So you are claiming that he lied multiple times and the only time he didn't lie was when he said he supported the two state solution?

How about what his father had to say about Netanyahu:

The two-state solution doesn’t exist. There are no two peoples here. There is a Jewish people and an Arab population… There is no Palestinian people, so you don’t create a state for an imaginary nation… They only call themselves a people in order to fight the Jews.

...
Bibi might aim for the same goals as mine, but he keeps to himself the ways to achieve them, because if he gave expression to them, he would expose his goals.

Because he is smart. Because he is very careful. Because he has his ways of handling himself. I am talking about tactics regarding the revealing of theories that people with a different ideology might not accept. That’s why he doesn’t expose them - because of the reaction from his enemies as well as from the people whose support he seeks. It’s an assumption, but it might be correct.

http://972mag.com/the-late-benzion-netanyahus-appalling-views-on-arabs/44215/

Do you think his father was lying as well?

 

[fuji]

He has said he supports a Palestinian state you lying sack of shit. You can keep on jibbering, that fact won't change.

 

[fuji]

so do you agree that Israel isn't a modern western egalitarian democracy but one apartheid state ?

Getting a blatant liar to agree with your ludicrous hate fantasy... classy.

 

[fuji]

Whatever you two jibbering ninnies blither on about, Israel is in fact a modern Western democracy, all its citizens, Arab and Jew alike have full democratic rights and freedoms.

The Palestinians outside Israel in the west bank are outside Israel. The Palestinians inside Israel are full citizens.

West Bank recognized as occupied by the UN, EU, Arab League, US, Canada, ICJ, but hey two jibbering ninnies on terb have decided to ignore the facts and make their own declaration!

 

[fuji]

Once you are able to define where are Israel border, then we can discuss who lives inside Israel and who lives outside.

Since you are not the world government I guess it is not up to you to decide. Israel, on the other hand, does have a say in what territory winds up being part of Israel, and certainly cannot be forced to annex territory it does not want.

And what would be ludicrous is claiming that if even one inch of the West Bank gets included in Israel, then the entire area must be included in Israel. Clearly annexing 8-9% of the territory does not imply annexing 100% of the territory. The security wall encloses what--9%? Less? Yet you claim that means the other 91% must also be inside Israel--an absolutely ridiculously stupid claim.

What you're doing is just cherry picking to argue that the jewish areas (Area C) are part of Israel and the arab areas aren't, which is in fact trying to justify apartheid.

I certainly am saying the Jewish areas should be part of Israel, because if they wind up being part of Palestine, they will be slaughtered by Hamas. In fact, that means that those two areas can't ever end up in the same country -- not in the same country in a two-state solution, and certainly that also makes a one-state solution utterly impossible. The whole point of separating Israel and Palestine into two separate countries is today exactly what it was in 1947: It is the only way to stop Palestinian aggression against Jews.

And no, that is not apartheid--you don't even have the foggiest clue what that word means. Two separate countries is not apartheid. No matter how many times you stamp your feet, and not even if you hold your breath until you turn blue in the face. It just isn't.

 

[fuji]

Area C where jewish settlements are allowed covers 60% of west bank not 10%. Palestinians aren't allowed any land use in area C, jews are allowed to build settlements there.

Outrageous dishonesty. The security wall containing the settlements encloses only 9.4% of the west bank. They are only a small part of area C, Israel would not annex the rest of area C and there are no settlements on most of area C.

 

[Frankfooter]

Clearly annexing 8-9% of the territory does not imply annexing 100% of the territory.

...

I certainly am saying the Jewish areas should be part of Israel

So you are for annexing the West Bank, bit by bit, as settlements continue?
Its a slow motion ethnic cleansing you are supporting.

 

[Moviefan-2]

So you are for annexing the West Bank, bit by bit, as settlements continue?
Its a slow motion ethnic cleansing you are supporting.

Yes, and of course it's easy to see how the three offers of independent Palestinian statehood fit into that master strategy.

 

[fuji]

So you are for annexing the West Bank, bit by bit, as settlements continue?
Its a slow motion ethnic cleansing you are supporting.

I support a change in the location of the border to increase security for Israel, eliminating the Tel Aviv "wasp waist", ensuring water sources cannot be cut off by Palestinians, and ensuring that IDF controls militarily strategic strong points in that area and along the Jordan valley.

This SHOULD be achieved through negotiations with the Palestinians, through equitable land swaps exchanging militarily strategic land for equally good land in a less strategic areas.

Since the Palestinians have refused to agree to peace, and since the actual location of the border has NEVER been agreed (the green line is not the border) it seems perfectly reasonable for Israel to act unilaterally to ensure its long term security. Building settlements in strategic locations and surrounding them with a security wall along Israel's preferred border does that.

If you ask why Israel is entitled to control the militarily important strong points and land with high strategic value the answer is that Israel has been the victim of numerous Arab wars of aggression and any final agreement has to resolve concerns that the Arabs will just attack once again after rearming. Keeping militarily strategic ground under Israeli control reduces the probability of another war.

 

[basketcase]

Israel wants to annex the land without its arab population. ...

You can't just make up bullshit and call it fact. You lie all you want but the Israeli government and Israeli people are strongly opposed to annexing the West Bank.

Then again, you're the guy who continued claiming that Palestinians wanted a One State solution after being showed decades of polling showing they were massively opposed to the idea so I don't expect reality in your posts.