American's obsession with guns.WTF

John Henry

Active member
Apr 10, 2011
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Some people load up on life insurance; some don't.

As some gunnutz like to say, better to have a gun and not need it than to need a gun and not have it?

But, let's be honest. Gun laws in Canada are so strict that firearms are not practically available as self-defence tools. We have to lock them ten ways to Sunday. If you do happen to be able to access them quickly enough to defend yourself, you'll likely be charged with improper/unsafe storage. Just ask the retired cop whose house was firebombed a few years ago.
Exactly ... The guy was trying to protect his home that he worked for and yet he got charged . What a fucking joke.
 

cunning linguist

Well-known member
Oct 13, 2009
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So much for liberal tolerance and understanding; only tolerant and understanding of views that align with yours. If you want to paint an entire group of people with a broad brush and treat them like criminals based on your idiotic misconceptions, you'll get no sympathy from me when someone else decides to do the same to you.


Pervert.

 

poorboy

Well-known member
Aug 18, 2001
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Total bullshit and misleading. Desperate gun lobbyists use bullshit and misleading figures to try and defy common logic. A token search of Google will uncover the unfathomable leaps of twisted logic the NRA and their merry band of urban paranoid militia will go to sustain gun activity that generates urban casualties that rival some war zones. Since the murder rate is less that 10% of their US cousins, it takes a only a few deaths in an Australian city to represent an increase that in American cities go unnoticed.

Forgetting that by any measure of rational logic, the Australian gun registry was a success, the gun lobby points to an amendment made 250 years ago when police departments rare and an army was in it's infancy. 'A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state..' is the preamble to the right top bear arms - completely outdated.

Change or add an amendment - it seem to work when slavery was abolished, when prohibition was tossed out ... so whats sacred about a concept that now kills the citizens that it set out to protect ? To suggest that regulation (not prohibiting firearms) impedes an amendment that has had it's meaning distorted for the sake of making an extra buck is a ludicrous argument set forth by the NRA. It is interesting that the NRA would rather arm terrorists that put up any 'restrictions' to limit sales to anyone.
You might have had an argument if one of the articles I supplied was written by, or used information provided by the NRA. But since we're talking about the lack of success of AUSTRALIAN gun control, where the National Rifle Association has no influence, you don't have an argument.
 

herbnessman

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Mar 10, 2011
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So much for liberal tolerance and understanding; only tolerant and understanding of views that align with yours. If you want to paint an entire group of people with a broad brush and treat them like criminals based on your idiotic misconceptions, you'll get no sympathy from me when someone else decides to do the same to you.


Pervert.

You are strawmanning the anti-gun position by assuming that everyone is advocating an all-out ban on firearms. I am sure that most are merely suggesting there be restrictions on what can be owned and where it can be openly carried.

Using your same flawed reasoning should I assume you are saying there should be no restrictions at all? Should I be able then to own a machine gun? Tank? Artillery? How much firepower does one need for "protection" against a bear in rural areas or a home invader? Is a high powered extended ammo semi auto rifle necessary?

And your attempt to equate the "unjust misunderstanding" of gun owners to pooners is weak as well. I am sure that while most here would like prostitution to be legal they would also expect it to come with some limits.

No one is advocating we should be able to pay for sex with 15 year olds and do it in Yonge Dundas Square. Why? Because it is anti-social behaviour that is not in the best interest of society at large and that should supersede the interest of consenting adults.

Just like carrying a fucking rifle in an airport.
 

poorboy

Well-known member
Aug 18, 2001
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Guns have one purpose: to hurt, maim or kill.
Did you know there is shooting in the Olympics? Not just the winter Olympics, but also the summer Olympics. I'm pretty sure the Olympics is a sports competition where nobody is hurt, maimed or killed with a firearm.

In fact, there's an entire field called the shooting sports! There's precision rifle shooting, trap, skeet, IPSC, speed steel, multigun, smallbore rifle, cowboy action, etc. That's a lot of people out and about learning to kill according to your narrow view.

In fact, here's an example of someone waiting to hurt, maim or kill with her firearm!

Jessie Duff from Burlington, WA[1] is recognized as one of the most accomplished competitive shooters in the world. She is known to be the first female shooter to achieve the rank of Grand Master (GM) in the United States Practical Shooting Association (USPSA).[2] She achieved the rank of GM in USPSA’s Open, Limited and Single Stack National Champions with her Taurus 1911. In earning this prestigious classification, she must achieve an average of 95% or higher in the classification courses. Duff practices in five different shooting disciplines which include Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun shooting, Action, and 3-Gun. With this, in 2001, She has won more championship tiles in the state, regional, national, and world competitions that any other female shooter.[3]

Career[edit]

Jessie Duff began her shooting career at a young age with her father, also a world champion. Duff’s first World Champion title was earned in the Cowboy Action Shooting competition.[4] She has also earned national and world titles from the prestigious Bianchi Cup, Steel Challenge World Speed Shooting Championships.[5] Duff is part of Team Weatherby as a celebrity spokesperson for the conservation of the sport of shooting and hunting.[6] She is also the Team Captain of Team Taurus[7] where is competes in world and nation championship titles. Other than competing, Duff is also a co-host on the popular Friends of NRA television show on the Outdoor Channel where she helps promote the sport of shooting.
 

basketcase

Well-known member
Dec 29, 2005
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Wanting to be armed, his choice. Not owning a gun, your choice. Live and let...something or other.
Do you have any comment on his need for a 100 round mag?

I get that American laws make open carry legal in many places but I wonder about the psychology of someone who feels the need to carry around a 100 round rifle.
 

basketcase

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Dec 29, 2005
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... You can't legally get a gun unless you have no criminal record....
Not always true in the states. Many states allow private sales or sales at gun shows with essentially or actually no oversight.


As for firearms being a tool, there is no purpose for that tool in a city. If you want a potentially dangerous tool in a city for a hobby then expect regulations. In rural Canada, you pretty much never see Canadians walking around shopping with their guns, just when hunting(ish) or actually dealing with wild animals. I have no problem with that. I generally don't take issue with Canada's gun laws. Hand guns IMO deserve more regulation because they aren't meant for the rural purposes you list. Handguns are meant as a weapon against other people.

My biggest concern with US gun culture is not the existence of guns but rather a culture that sees each other as so dangerous that 100 round magazines are seen as useful.
 

basketcase

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Dec 29, 2005
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So what do you want to do then? Do you think a guy set on killing is going to pause and say "Hmm, the government has limited me to 5 rounds and a bolt action. When I go on a killing spree, I better make sure I follow the law."
...
And is joe airport going to blast 100 rounds at a guy on a killing spree?

As for illegal gun use, people have to get those guns from somewhere. The ATF in the US is basically prohibited from acting on the small number of gun dealers who facilitate straw purchases and one study I saw said the significant majority of guns used in crimes came from them. Stronger US legislation on gun sales would make illegal guns harder to get.
 

cunning linguist

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Oct 13, 2009
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Do you have any comment on his need for a 100 round mag?

I get that American laws make open carry legal in many places but I wonder about the psychology of someone who feels the need to carry around a 100 round rifle.
I don't care if it's belt fed, there are disadvantages and drawbacks to everything. Drum mags are notoriously unreliable, much more expensive, bulky, cumbersome and unwieldy. Why do cops need standard capacity magazines? Why does anyone need a vehicle capable of exceeding 100 km/h?
 

cunning linguist

Well-known member
Oct 13, 2009
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You are strawmanning the anti-gun position by assuming that everyone is advocating an all-out ban on firearms. I am sure that most are merely suggesting there be restrictions on what can be owned and where it can be openly carried.

Using your same flawed reasoning should I assume you are saying there should be no restrictions at all? Should I be able then to own a machine gun? Tank? Artillery? How much firepower does one need for "protection" against a bear in rural areas or a home invader? Is a high powered extended ammo semi auto rifle necessary?

And your attempt to equate the "unjust misunderstanding" of gun owners to pooners is weak as well. I am sure that while most here would like prostitution to be legal they would also expect it to come with some limits.

No one is advocating we should be able to pay for sex with 15 year olds and do it in Yonge Dundas Square. Why? Because it is anti-social behaviour that is not in the best interest of society at large and that should supersede the interest of consenting adults.

Just like carrying a fucking rifle in an airport.
All rifles, including AR types as well as virtually anything other than a pistol, make up like 4% of violent crime statistics in the United States. Clearly the bias against them is wholly emotional and idealistic, not factual.
 

basketcase

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Dec 29, 2005
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Some Queen's Park guards will be armed.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toron...ve-some-armed-guards-in-near-future-1.3006041

Is this an overreaction? How often is Queen's Park attacked?
Maybe it's growing up with too many US movies but as kids we always assumed there were guys with sniper rifles and SAM missiles on the roof. A few trained guards there doesn't bother me.


p.s. Is it ironic when you misspell the word missile and one of the suggested corrections is misspell?
 

basketcase

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Dec 29, 2005
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And more glorious missing of the fucking point. Or points, even. For one thing, the the oft-repeated mantra about how "most law abiding gun owners are law abiding" is a huge crock of shit, since by fucking definition they are law abiding. ...
I'll bet there's a good number who have violated laws on safe storage of weapons. That would make them criminal wouldn't it?
 

Smallcock

Active member
Jun 5, 2009
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America doesn't have a gun problem.

A lot of hype and headlines say so, but it's not so.

It's remarkable that there are guns for every man, woman, and child in America yet it's by and large a peaceful country of over 300 million people.
 

basketcase

Well-known member
Dec 29, 2005
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You are strawmanning the anti-gun position by assuming that everyone is advocating an all-out ban on firearms. I am sure that most are merely suggesting there be restrictions on what can be owned and where it can be openly carried.

Using your same flawed reasoning should I assume you are saying there should be no restrictions at all? Should I be able then to own a machine gun? Tank? Artillery? How much firepower does one need for "protection" against a bear in rural areas or a home invader? Is a high powered extended ammo semi auto rifle necessary?
....
Or if we're strawmanning:
Don't like genocide, don't kill anyone.
Don't like necrophilia, don't sleep with corpses.
Don't like theft, don't steal anything.
 

herbnessman

Well-known member
Mar 10, 2011
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All rifles, including AR types as well as virtually anything other than a pistol, make up like 4% of violent crime statistics in the United States. Clearly the bias against them is wholly emotional and idealistic, not factual.
And a very small percentage of planes are hijacked and flown into buildings. And yet we have all sorts of rules and regulations on what can be carried on to planes because the potential for destruction is great enough to warrant a limitation on our rights.

Just like the potential for destruction is greater with increasingly more powerful weapons. You didn't answer my question. What is your limit (if any) and why?
 

basketcase

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Dec 29, 2005
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I don't care if it's belt fed, there are disadvantages and drawbacks to everything. Drum mags are notoriously unreliable, much more expensive, bulky, cumbersome and unwieldy. Why do cops need standard capacity magazines? Why does anyone need a vehicle capable of exceeding 100 km/h?
But what is the utility? Is there any conceivable purpose where this guy would need 100 rounds while walking around?

At a range would be a different story but he wasn't on the way to the range (and I bet that mag would reduce the accuracy of the gun).
 

basketcase

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Dec 29, 2005
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Virtually everyone on this board is breaking the law, but when the law is unjust...
...we pick up guns to protect ourselves from tyranny?

I thought we advocated to get the law changed.



p.s. I don't think any of us say we need the right to pay for sex in an airport.
 

poorboy

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Aug 18, 2001
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And a very small percentage of planes are hijacked and flown into buildings. And yet we have all sorts of rules and regulations on what can be carried on to planes because the potential for destruction is great enough to warrant a limitation on our rights.

Just like the potential for destruction is greater with increasingly more powerful weapons. You didn't answer my question. What is your limit (if any) and why?
You picked a poor example. The rules and regulations are mainly for the passengers, who are not supposed to control the aircraft. If you follow your example, people not using the firearms, but being with a person using a firearm would be the ones under the rules and regulations.

The final blow to your comparison is U.S. pilots are also allowed to carry firearms as a result of planes being hijacked and flown into buildings.

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=125224
 

cunning linguist

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Oct 13, 2009
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But what is the utility? Is there any conceivable purpose where this guy would need 100 rounds while walking around?

At a range would be a different story but he wasn't on the way to the range (and I bet that mag would reduce the accuracy of the gun).
I don't give a shit about need. If someone wants it, has the means to acquire it and uses it responsibly, I don't care.
 
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