Addiction help

[lunaseraphim]

I totally agree with all your commentary on this subject. I think men generally need to man up and work on their personal issues (related to sex and relationships). I man needs to be secure in his own psyche as to who he is and find (or have) a mission in life that positively contributes to his emotional security. Once you have that, everything else falls into place.

I also personally think that the idea of “hobbying” is a bad one. It feeds weak instincts and bad discipline. And definitely can lead to addiction.
I don’t have a problem with men seeing escorts in moderation because it can be a fun experience especially if there is a good connection with the girl. But the men need to remember , the girl isn’t there to find a relationship , she’s there to fulfill a little fantasy. As long as everyone’s expectations are kept in check and respect is shown both ways. Be cool, be decent and have fun everyone.

Personally, like I said, the guys who seem the most addicted are the ones who see escorts all the time, review them systematically, spend their time on review boards.. The way they write about us on these boards, not only in reviews but in other posts, is full of resentment, anger and hatred. They are addicted to escort services but we are like products for them to try and review. And unless we fit a certain criteria and offer a certain experience (which more or less corresponds to what they have seen in porn), they are unhappy. They talk about how fat this popular escort became, talk about us as if we weren't there, complain about ''a lack of women between the ages of 18 and 21'', etc. They are angry that other men book us for longer dates and social time.

An old friend of mine had an older brother who was rich and who was obese and ate all the time.. Every time he was in town, he could easily get a reservation at a really good restaurant. He would complain about the food the whole time, get off on giving the restaurant a bad review afterwards, have entitled behavior (insulting the waiters, requesting things that aren't on the menu, asking for dishes to be replaced).. He'd order so much food and polish everything off and was never happy about any of it, didn't seem to enjoy the food. He didn't enjoy the atmosphere of the restaurant, he would force my friend to finish his food early and they'd always have to leave really fast. Somehow this story popped in my mind this morning when I was thinking of certain self-proclaimed ''hobbyists''.

A big reason why to confront this addiction is to stop viewing women as objects. If you don't respect sex workers, you should not visit them. There are good reasons to see escorts.. Sometimes I feel like I'm doing something good for my clients, they need someone to talk to during a difficult period of their life, they need company while they are on a business trip, they want to feel more comfortable with themselves and their sexuality before starting to date again, some of them just want someone to have fun with, etc. The men who want to ''try me'' like they are trying a new product or restaurant are often not super respectful..

 

[Trevor Wong]

I think a lot of guys who want purely sexual experiences are sex addicts and view us as objects, they don't see us in a romantic way at all. But I know what you're referring to, I think there's another group of people who are really delusional about escorts and kinda develop ''romantic feelings'' for every escort they see. I think there is value in the work I do, a lot of guys who book me on these more ''romantic'' dates are satisfied, but they also know that this isn't a romantic relationship and that there are boundaries. They know there is a way to contact me, and that they can't always bombard me with messages in between bookings.

The guys who prefer being with escorts want everything to be catered to them.. If I spend a day with a client, I can't be in a bad mood or talk about something he won't like hearing about, depending on the person I can't really show certain sides of my personality. There are some men who really want to pretend that this is a relationship. Last summer, I was contacted by a man who sent me a really really long email.. He also texted me and told me to look at the email. He was asking very vague questions like ''what is a session with you really like? I don't want to read reviews to get an idea of who you are''. I was really tired and on the bus, and I answered the email in a short and professional way. I think he couldn't handle that. He got really upset and said he was cancelling.. Then he changed his mind. When I met him in person, I think I didn't correspond to the idea he had created in his mind of me. He started asking really intrusive questions and honestly really made the date worse. Afterwards he complained to a colleague that he didn't like his experience with me, and she said he is exactly the type I described.. He wants us to actually pretend we are his girlfriend.

There is a difference between offering companionship, and indulging the fantasy that this is an actual relationship that will go beyond these boundaries.. I don't know if the guys who act that way are addicted, but they definitely approach hiring escorts in a problematic way. I have also met guys who just saw escorts because they never had a girlfriend, and to them sex and the affection they get from escorts replaces a relationship. They aren't actually developing a bond with the escorts they see, they just confuse sex with love. I definitely think that is a recipe for disaster, and potentially addiction..

Hi Luna, you know I respect you 100%, but I don't agree with a lot of your statements. You have to realize that a lot of clients are "socially inept", and can't get into a real "civi" relationship, if their life depended on it. Therefore these guys see SP's "out of desperation", if the guy wants any sort of sex life, at all. I checked out some of your selfies, and you're "gorgeous" looking, so I can understand how some clients might be awkward in approaching you. For example, sending you very long e-mails etc.

Also, a client is paying a lot of money to see you, so in some ways they deserve to be pampered. You have to realize that a "socially" inept guy who's sees a "gorgeous" SP like yourself, for a 3 hour date, can start getting boundary issues blurred. FYI, a lot of SP's don't offer 3 hr dates , because they don't have the "gravitas", and high level social skills, that you seem to possess. I don't see how seeing a pretty escort like yourself, can lead to addiction. Luna, you have to realize that most escorts aren't like you. A lot of escorts are just happy with a bunch of 1 hr dates, as some escorts themselves, don't have the social skills to go on romantic outings or for dinner dates with "fun" after.

 

[Trevor Wong]

I totally agree with all your commentary on this subject. I think men generally need to man up and work on their personal issues (related to sex and relationships). I man needs to be secure in his own psyche as to who he is and find (or have) a mission in life that positively contributes to his emotional security. Once you have that, everything else falls into place.

I also personally think that the idea of “hobbying” is a bad one. It feeds weak instincts and bad discipline. And definitely can lead to addiction.
I don’t have a problem with men seeing escorts in moderation because it can be a fun experience especially if there is a good connection with the girl. But the men need to remember , the girl isn’t there to find a relationship , she’s there to fulfill a little fantasy. As long as everyone’s expectations are kept in check and respect is shown both ways. Be cool, be decent and have fun everyone.

Some men just aren't capable of getting married or getting a girlfriend. That's where SP's come in. It's just not married guys on terb, who see SP's, you know.

 

[Trevor Wong]

Personally, like I said, the guys who seem the most addicted are the ones who see escorts all the time, review them systematically, spend their time on review boards.. The way they write about us on these boards, not only in reviews but in other posts, is full of resentment, anger and hatred. They are addicted to escort services but we are like products for them to try and review. And unless we fit a certain criteria and offer a certain experience (which more or less corresponds to what they have seen in porn), they are unhappy. They talk about how fat this popular escort became, talk about us as if we weren't there, complain about ''a lack of women between the ages of 18 and 21'', etc. They are angry that other men book us for longer dates and social time.

An old friend of mine had an older brother who was rich and who was obese and ate all the time.. Every time he was in town, he could easily get a reservation at a really good restaurant. He would complain about the food the whole time, get off on giving the restaurant a bad review afterwards, have entitled behavior (insulting the waiters, requesting things that aren't on the menu, asking for dishes to be replaced).. He'd order so much food and polish everything off and was never happy about any of it, didn't seem to enjoy the food. He didn't enjoy the atmosphere of the restaurant, he would force my friend to finish his food early and they'd always have to leave really fast. Somehow this story popped in my mind this morning when I was thinking of certain self-proclaimed ''hobbyists''.

A big reason why to confront this addiction is to stop viewing women as objects. If you don't respect sex workers, you should not visit them. There are good reasons to see escorts.. Sometimes I feel like I'm doing something good for my clients, they need someone to talk to during a difficult period of their life, they need company while they are on a business trip, they want to feel more comfortable with themselves and their sexuality before starting to date again, some of them just want someone to have fun with, etc. The men who want to ''try me'' like they are trying a new product or restaurant are often not super respectful..

Not necessarily. A lot of SP's on terb, get constantly good reviews, like Abby@DD, and Jenn@Mirage, to name a couple. Some guys like reviewing, as it helps the other guys avoid subpar sp's, and to help guys not waste money. As you know this "hobby", isn't cheap.

Luna, in my opinion, you're making a lot of generalizations. With that being said, I still respect you 100% , and I appreciate your opinions from an SP's point of view. A lot of sp's are too scared, to be as open and honest as you are, as they are afraid that they'll lose business. However, you're an independent provider, whose "gorgeous" looking, so you can get away with it.

 

[Trevor Wong]

I'm an escort and quite proud of what I have to offer, but I agree that escorts are not replacements for genuine romantic & sexual relationships with women. I have had a few clients who were virgins. They were happy about the experience and thanked me, but they moved on to something else. I ultimately think it was for the best in their case. I also feel like most of the time I am doing something good for my clients.

But I find it concerning when I see that some clients have never had a relationship or sexual experience outside of escorts. Or when clients say that seeing escorts to them is better than being around civilian women and that they choose to no longer date because they'd rather just see escorts instead.. in short they prefer a fantasy to a real experience with a woman which is... Ok, fair enough? But I don't think it's healthy

Sometimes guys, don't have the ability to get in real life relationships, for whatever reason. That's why seeing SP's, "is the world's oldest profession." It's a much needed service.

 

[MelaniCarmelo]

This is where life experience comes in. Any decision he makes won't be an easy one. If the shame of telling his family and the potential consequences are too much for him, he will need to live with those consequences. If he tells his family and they are the rock of support that gets him to overcome his "addiction", he will need to live with those consequences. If he goes to a therapist to see if they can help him, he will need to live with those consequences. If he chooses to do nothing and continue seeing escorts, he will need to live with those consequences. He's asking us to make a decision for him, instead of making a choice. He's free to make whatever choice he wants, but can't complain if things go sour. I don't think compassion is what he needs, he needs to take personal responsibility. For those of us who have seen loved ones or perhaps had personal experiences with addictions, it's not compassion that triggered the change. It's sounds "bad" or "hard" but it is what it is. So to the OP, I don't give a damn about what this addiction does to you. If your marriage fails, I don't care. If your child thinks you are a monster and never wants to see you again, I don't care. If you spend a ton of money on escorts, I don't care. Only you face the consequences of your decisions, not me or anyone on this board. Act wisely and, forgiveness sakes, take some responsibility.

People who don't care don't reply in length to things they don't care about. I think you care to some degree but also wanted to make a jab at him for not dealing with his addiction how you feel an addict should and then disguise it as help. lol Now that you got your distaste for his addiction off your chest hopefully you can now finally stop caring about this thread and move on to something that makes you feel more positive! I mean... I get it, not everyone has a tolerance for addicts because they don't understand how they aren't able to just snap out of it whenever they want. Especially if they've had to deal with family or friends first hand who were addicted to something... Idk... I've worked with addicts before so I've seen and heard enough to grasp what their battle is like.

End of the day you're entitled to your opinion the same as me!

 

[Climberx]

People who don't care don't reply in length to things they don't care about. I think you care to some degree but also wanted to make a jab at him for not dealing with his addiction how you feel an addict should and then disguise it as help. lol Now that you got your distaste for his addiction off your chest hopefully you can now finally stop caring about this thread and move on to something that makes you feel more positive! I mean... I get it, not everyone has a tolerance for addicts because they don't understand how they aren't able to just snap out of it whenever they want. Especially if they've had to deal with family or friends first hand who were addicted to something... Idk... I've worked with addicts before so I've seen and heard enough to grasp what their battle is like.

End of the day you're entitled to your opinion the same as me!

How many people do you know that overcame serious "addiction" issues just from compassion and telling them "it's ok to feel the way you do"? What is your "work" with addicts? Are you a registered social worker or psychologist?

 

[MelaniCarmelo]

How many people do you know that overcame serious "addiction" issues just from compassion and telling them "it's ok to feel the way you do"? What is your "work" with addicts? Are you a registered social worker or psychologist?

Really? You're resorting to an ad hominem fallacy? What a truly disappointing comment... I don't need to disclose any in depth details to you just to prove some kind of point or satisfy your need to be right. I'm agreeing to disagree here, because you're making it clear that there was no point in responding to you to begin with. Learning from my mistake and moving right along thank you! Enjoy the rest of your day sir or argue by yourself. Whatever floats your boat! Lol

 

[lunaseraphim]

Hi Luna, you know I respect you 100%, but I don't agree with a lot of your statements. You have to realize that a lot of clients are "socially inept", and can't get into a real "civi" relationship, if their life depended on it. Therefore these guys see SP's "out of desperation", if the guy wants any sort of sex life, at all. I checked out some of your selfies, and you're "gorgeous" looking, so I can understand how some clients might be awkward in approaching you. For example, sending you very long e-mails etc.

Also, a client is paying a lot of money to see you, so in some ways they deserve to be pampered. You have to realize that a "socially" inept guy who's sees a "gorgeous" SP like yourself, for a 3 hour date, can start getting boundary issues blurred. FYI, a lot of SP's don't offer 3 hr dates , because they don't have the "gravitas", and high level social skills, that you seem to possess. I don't see how seeing a pretty escort like yourself, can lead to addiction. Luna, you have to realize that most escorts aren't like you. A lot of escorts are just happy with a bunch of 1 hr dates, as some escorts themselves, don't have the social skills to go on romantic outings or for dinner dates with "fun" after.

Are you saying that I shouldn't be offering longer dates because if I do I need to give something more than what the guy paid for? I really don't understand what you're talking about. You don't think my clients are being pampered? It seems like you're projecting a whole narrative onto me, when in fact you have never met me and if you look at most of my reviews they are written by very satisfied customers, who didn't necessarily book longer than a hour.

The guys who book these dates are not socially inept, let me tell you that. They are usually men who are very intelligent and good conversationalists and want to spend time with someone they feel they can have discussions with. What you have to realize is that I worked very hard at developing social skills and that is what you and others also don't understand. I never said I wasn't happy with 1 hour dates lol you are making that assumption. I get all sorts of dates. But I am not ''tricking'' socially inept men into booking me for multiple hours if that is what you're implying lol.. And I don't think booking long dates is what leads to addiction. It's consuming escort services like it's junk food, that does. Addiction is compulsive behavior. I am not going to become a food addict because I went to a nice restaurant with a 7 course meal. I'm more likely to become a food addict if I don't take care of my mental health and emotional well being and I compulsively eat junk food

Not necessarily. A lot of SP's on terb, get constantly good reviews, like Abby@DD, and Jenn@Mirage, to name a couple. Some guys like reviewing, as it helps the other guys avoid subpar sp's, and to help guys not waste money. As you know this "hobby", isn't cheap.

Luna, in my opinion, you're making a lot of generalizations. With that being said, I still respect you 100% , and I appreciate your opinions from an SP's point of view. A lot of sp's are too scared, to be as open and honest as you are, as they are afraid that they'll lose business. However, you're an independent provider, whose "gorgeous" looking, so you can get away with it.

I feel like you're missing my point. I know seeing an escort isn't cheap. However, this isn't a hobby and no one is entitled to these services. Believe me, I am scared of losing business and I do have some haters, but I allow myself to be outspoken on the behalf of other providers who, like I have in the past, have been targets of men who were aggressive, saw us as objects and pushed our boundaries. It seems like you don't see the amount of work, resources, and energy I put into this business.. I haven't always been an independent provider, either. I have worked for massage parlors as well, for a while. And when I started as an indy, my rates were very low and since I was new I was targeted by the type of sex addicts who have lower empathy, they tried to lowball me and treated me without respect.

Sometimes guys, don't have the ability to get in real life relationships, for whatever reason. That's why seeing SP's, "is the world's oldest profession." It's a much needed service.

No one is entitled to sex, NO ONE. Not even me. I grew up getting bullied and my family members were cold. I have always been seen as ''weird'' and never had friends when I was young. Social skills are things that you can work on. Believe it or not, you can work on yourself. Nobody is doomed to be single their whole lives and doomed to spend money on escort services. I have had long periods in my life during which I was single and didn't have a partner, couldn't find one. It was usually because I needed to work on myself.

Addiction often happens because someone has unhealed trauma and undiagnosed mental health struggles that they need to address, which is nothing to be ashamed of.. But it's something that has be worked on with the help of a therapist. Lots of men are lonely and socially inept but aren't addicted to porn or seeing escorts, btw. I hear this excuse a lot.. ''I see SP on a regular basis and feel addicted to it, because I am unattractive and don't have good social skills''..

There was a client I had before who was convinced he was ugly, but he was actually well dressed and cute. He was an intelligent, pleasant man but held so much anger and resentment, and he was CONVINCED that he could never find a girlfriend and had to see escorts forever. He spent all his time on a review board and would see girls from agencies and write reviews, spent all his (pretty good) salary on hour long appointments with escorts that he actually never even got to know as people. In reality he had developed a sex addiction. Many such cases.

 

[lunaseraphim]

How many people do you know that overcame serious "addiction" issues just from compassion and telling them "it's ok to feel the way you do"? What is your "work" with addicts? Are you a registered social worker or psychologist?

Most women who work in this industry have first hand experiences with addiction, we have seen how it works.. I have lost friends to addictions. Guilt tripping someone doesn't work.. Offering alternatives, guiding the person to appropriate resources and helping them question where the addiction actually comes from, does. I'm not a clinician or a social worker or psychologist, but I've seen this multiple times in my life

 

[Climberx]

Really? You're resorting to an ad hominem fallacy? What a truly disappointing comment... I don't need to disclose any in depth details to you just to prove some kind of point or satisfy your need to be right. I'm agreeing to disagree here, because you're making it clear that there was no point in responding to you to begin with. Learning from my mistake and moving right along thank you! Enjoy the rest of your day sir or argue by yourself. Whatever floats your boat! Lol

The guy asks for help. You are stating you "work" with people with addiction, implying some form of expertise, but are refusing to mention the source of said expertise. The OP may rely on your comments since you are putting yourself out there as being a professional in the field of addiction, potentially causing more harm than good. So again, what is the professional work you do in the field of addictions?

 

[Climberx]

Most women who work in this industry have first hand experiences with addiction, we have seen how it works.. I have lost friends to addictions. Guilt tripping someone doesn't work.. Offering alternatives, guiding the person to appropriate resources and helping them question where the addiction actually comes from, does. I'm not a clinician or a social worker or psychologist, but I've seen this multiple times in my life

I don't doubt you see many people with addiction issues. But seeing them in the capacity as a sex worker and as someone trained in the field of addictions support are two very very different things. Having experience in the field of sex work is not the same as having experience in the field of addictions counseling and working through said addictions with people, step by step. For example, I have a lot of experience with the stock market, even though I am not trained as a financial analyst. I'm not going to put myself out there as someone who works with people looking to improve there financial position. In the same light, just because someone has had sex before in their life, doesn't mean they would make a good sex worker.

 

[lunaseraphim]

I don't doubt you see many people with addiction issues. But seeing them in the capacity as a sex worker and as someone trained in the field of addictions support are two very very different things. Having experience in the field of sex work is not the same as having experience in the field of addictions counseling and working through said addictions with people, step by step. For example, I have a lot of experience with the stock market, even though I am not trained as a financial analyst. I'm not going to put myself out there as someone who works with people looking to improve there financial position. In the same light, just because someone has had sex before in their life, doesn't mean they would make a good sex worker.

Yes, but are YOU trained in the field of addiction support? I feel like this forum is really not the right place to discuss addictions, particularly sex addiction. All of us are pitching in and discussing, but ultimately it's inappropriate and just brings up a lot of negative feelings. What I'm saying on this thread is stuff that I have been told by therapists and social workers, myself. And things I have read in books about addiction and mental health.

 

[Climberx]

Yes, but are you trained in the field of addiction support? I feel like this forum is really not the right place to discuss addictions, particularly sex addiction

Nope, I absolutely am not. But I haven't put myself out there as working with people with addictions. My comment was in response to Melani's comments indicating that she works with people suffering from addiction.

 

[lunaseraphim]

Nope, I absolutely am not. But I haven't put myself out there as working with people with addictions. My comment was in response to Melani's comments indicating that she works with people suffering from addiction.

Well, I'm going to let her answer because there's a reason why she said that.

 

[Trevor Wong]

Are you saying that I shouldn't be offering longer dates because if I do I need to give something more than what the guy paid for? I really don't understand what you're talking about. You don't think my clients are being pampered? It seems like you're projecting a whole narrative onto me, when in fact you have never met me and if you look at most of my reviews they are written by very satisfied customers, who didn't necessarily book longer than a hour.

The guys who book these dates are not socially inept, let me tell you that. They are usually men who are very intelligent and good conversationalists and want to spend time with someone they feel they can have discussions with. What you have to realize is that I worked very hard at developing social skills and that is what you and others also don't understand. I never said I wasn't happy with 1 hour dates lol you are making that assumption. I get all sorts of dates. But I am not ''tricking'' socially inept men into booking me for multiple hours if that is what you're implying lol.. And I don't think booking long dates is what leads to addiction. It's consuming escort services like it's junk food, that does. Addiction is compulsive behavior. I am not going to become a food addict because I went to a nice restaurant with a 7 course meal. I'm more likely to become a food addict if I don't take care of my mental health and emotional well being and I compulsively eat junk food



I feel like you're missing my point. I know seeing an escort isn't cheap. However, this isn't a hobby and no one is entitled to these services. Believe me, I am scared of losing business and I do have some haters, but I allow myself to be outspoken on the behalf of other providers who, like I have in the past, have been targets of men who were aggressive, saw us as objects and pushed our boundaries. It seems like you don't see the amount of work, resources, and energy I put into this business.. I haven't always been an independent provider, either. I have worked for massage parlors as well, for a while. And when I started as an indy, my rates were very low and since I was new I was targeted by the type of sex addicts who have lower empathy, they tried to lowball me and treated me without respect.



No one is entitled to sex, NO ONE. Not even me. I grew up getting bullied and my family members were cold. I have always been seen as ''weird'' and never had friends when I was young. Social skills are things that you can work on. Believe it or not, you can work on yourself. Nobody is doomed to be single their whole lives and doomed to spend money on escort services. I have had long periods in my life during which I was single and didn't have a partner, couldn't find one. It was usually because I needed to work on myself.

Addiction often happens because someone has unhealed trauma and undiagnosed mental health struggles that they need to address, which is nothing to be ashamed of.. But it's something that has be worked on with the help of a therapist. Lots of men are lonely and socially inept but aren't addicted to porn or seeing escorts, btw. I hear this excuse a lot.. ''I see SP on a regular basis and feel addicted to it, because I am unattractive and don't have good social skills''..

There was a client I had before who was convinced he was ugly, but he was actually well dressed and cute. He was an intelligent, pleasant man but held so much anger and resentment, and he was CONVINCED that he could never find a girlfriend and had to see escorts forever. He spent all his time on a review board and would see girls from agencies and write reviews, spent all his (pretty good) salary on hour long appointments with escorts that he actually never even got to know as people. In reality he had developed a sex addiction. Many such cases.

Hi Luna, I'm tired of arguing with you. I think you're a very nice and intelligent woman, and let's leave it at that.

 

[lunaseraphim]

Hi Luna, I'm tired of arguing with you. I think you're a very nice and intelligent woman, and let's leave it at that.

Thank you for your compliments, I appreciate it. I just want to say that I am not arguing or trying to be unpleasant, I'm just offering my perspective on this subject, but I agree, let's leave it at that. I don't think these types of discussions tend to end very well on forums like these.