Project 2025

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
33,219
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That was you trolling the conversation, as you continue to do now.
You really think I'd choose a libertarian over the green party even if they did have similar positions on Palestine?
Yes.
You have repeatedly said the most important, indeed the ONLY important thing to vote on is the position on Palestine.
That being the case, you obviously want to vote for the person who has the best chance to get into power and stop the genocide.

Since the Libertarian is clearly in the better position to win, you must vote for the Libertarian.

You have said, repeatedly, that any other consequences are secondary to that issue.

Now, I have accused you repeatedly of just posturing and arguing that the point of your vote is to show that you support certain things and the actual outcome of the election is secondary.
This has made you angry and you have sometimes denied it (sort of - it mostly just makes you angry).

But if I take your idea that voting on the genocide trumps all other moral considerations, then obviously the Libertarian is the proper choice for you, because those other Libertarian positions shouldn't bother you compared to the real issue, which is genocide.

Biden is actively aiding the genocide in Gaza, not committing it.
Then stop saying he is single-handedly responsible for the genocide if that's not what you mean.

In your academically superior view, they are.
But for voters without the cash of AIPAC to buy those positions feet on the ground and voting are the power they control.
Stop trying to tell them they are stupid for using it in ways you disagree.
Coddling the feelings of people who are doing something that is counter productive to the cause they state they support isn't my style.

This is what you said.

I replied by posting a Stein attack on the dems mentioning the genocide, which you claimed didn't exist.
Yup.
I said the hashtags didn't exist on that tweet and they didn't.
You got me.

Olivier would be more of a butler guy while you appear to be more of a Biden or Netanyahu guy than a Harris guy.
I do love when you start wildly trying to land blows by saying silly shit like that.
It's comical. :)

I don't know if Butler would be an Olivier stan, he may have been Ron Paul curious at some point (I don't know) but he mostly doesn't strike me as going for the US version of the Libertarians.
 

basketcase

Well-known member
Dec 29, 2005
62,126
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Easy.

Vote for the only Jew running for office, the only person clearly against genocide.
...
As I said, knowingly undermining the Democratic campaign while understanding the result will put Trump in power.


p.s. It's a sign of your elitist racism the way you pull out racial tokens to justify your hatreds.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
93,713
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How they voice that displeasure has no bearing, then?
Your criticism was about reporting that displeasure through the xitter, not about the how they voiced that displeasure.
If you'd like to change the subject and declare they shouldn't protest at Harris rallies go for it.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
93,713
23,463
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As I said, knowingly undermining the Democratic campaign while understanding the result will put Trump in power.


p.s. It's a sign of your elitist racism the way you pull out racial tokens to justify your hatreds.
Then that blame falls on Harris for supporting unpopular positions.
People protest so she knows, but if she decides not to change then she is to blame.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
93,713
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Which has been the official Democrat stance forever.

Meanwhile trump is still talking about getting Israel to "finish the job" quickly.
Yes, the dem position has been to declare support for a ceasefire while acting to enable and aid genocide.
The lip service hasn't fooled voters.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
93,713
23,463
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Yes.
You have repeatedly said the most important, indeed the ONLY important thing to vote on is the position on Palestine.
That being the case, you obviously want to vote for the person who has the best chance to get into power and stop the genocide.

Since the Libertarian is clearly in the better position to win, you must vote for the Libertarian.

You have said, repeatedly, that any other consequences are secondary to that issue.

Now, I have accused you repeatedly of just posturing and arguing that the point of your vote is to show that you support certain things and the actual outcome of the election is secondary.
This has made you angry and you have sometimes denied it (sort of - it mostly just makes you angry).

But if I take your idea that voting on the genocide trumps all other moral considerations, then obviously the Libertarian is the proper choice for you, because those other Libertarian positions shouldn't bother you compared to the real issue, which is genocide.
If you want to compare straw men...

You have repeatedly argued that nobody understands democracy as well as you or they would vote pragmatically to aid genocide.
You have argued that keeping rump out of power is the most important issue to you and anyone who votes on any other issue doesn't understand democracy.

You have also argued that most people don't understand democracy as well as you do or they would understand that while you need third parties you shouldn't vote for them.

You have argued that while Israel is committing genocide right now on Palestinians its more important to worry about who wins an election this fall.

You have repeatedly stated that genocide isn't really a big deal and should be way down on voters lists.

You have argued that the US spending $840 billion on war and genocide instead of social services and health care isn't as important as keeping your tribal choice in power.

You have argued that being a war criminal by aiding genocide doesn't discount a candidate and that the same tribalism that MAGA is based on applies to dems, that rules based democracy just isn't pragmatic. That anyone who would dare vote for a rules based system instead of tribalism doesn't understand democracy the way a tenured politics prof does, whether you are or not.

You have argued that keeping your binary tribal choice in power is more important than democracy itself, that voters should not vote for a third party even if it represents their views because it is a wasted vote given by people who clearly don't have degrees in politics and don't understand the system.

This is the corollary to your attacks, the next step in the form of 'debate' you clearly prefer.
I would pity students who were graded by someone who intentionally misstated positions to assert power.

Then stop saying he is single-handedly responsible for the genocide if that's not what you mean.
That's a shitty straw man - I have never said he is single handedly responsible for the genocide, only that he has single handedly aided and allowed the genocide to continue. The US is the only country that has the power to stop Israeli actions. The POTUS in the US gets executive power over foreign policy but Netanyahu is responsible for the genocide.

Coddling the feelings of people who are doing something that is counter productive to the cause they state they support isn't my style.
In an honest discussion you'd be talking about power and options.
What options do voters have in the US?
What power do they have in their positions?
You would also be willing to accept that just as some people will vote MAGA, some people won't vote for a party that spends money on genocide instead of social services.

Your claims of supremacy of understanding doesn't acknowledge the basics of the political system, the flaws in the system, how people choose to try to fix or change the system and most importantly the democratic basics of being able to make shitty choices if they choose. You can choose to educate people, but you aren't doing that here, you are doing the tenured prof type action of declaring supreme understanding while actively enforcing the feudal system that keeps tenured profs and billionaires in control in their worlds and belittling the actions of people with fewer resources and power to try to act to better the situation. Your presence here is based on you asserting your self declared power of understanding through occasional references to rules presently being ignored. You do have better understanding of the mechanics of the US political system but you appear to lack understanding of humans themselves. Its the same with ever prof I know, they spend their lives surrounded by people who have less experience and understanding and beating them down with arcane academic language the way Jordan Peterson uses language for MAGA, while at the same time in a competitive battle for their own position and SSRC prestige within a closed system that doesn't represent the reality of the world they study. I've had the privilege to study with a few who were genuinely interested in learning and teaching, people who enjoyed discussion in order to learn new ideas and clarify their own and I've studied with those who are their to assert their supremacy.

If you were interested in anything but asserting your own supremacy in defence of supremacy, we'd be having a much more interesting discussion about race, colonialism, political power, capitalism and systemic change. That would have been much more interesting.

Instead this is more like talking to a cop.
 

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
33,219
62,248
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Your criticism was about reporting that displeasure through the xitter, not about the how they voiced that displeasure.
My comment was entirely about how they did their protest.
I asked you if you were paying attention to that.
Clearly you did not.
Your entire focus is on what happened on twitter.

Maybe, just maybe, you should rethink your relationship with social media.

If you'd like to change the subject and declare they shouldn't protest at Harris rallies go for it.
Whether or not they should protest at rallies at this point in the election cycle has a whole lot to do with what they think their end goal is and what they want to accomplish.

If you think "shouldn't" as in "shouldn't be allowed to" then obviously not, they should have as much right to protest at a rally as anyone else.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
93,713
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Yes, read what you just quoted.

You claimed it was just the social media backlash and I asked if that was all you think it was.
You have said yes, that is all it is to you.
No, I didn't claim it was 'just' the social media backlash.
You are very exact with your language, you are choosing to mischaracterize replies to score points and stop the discussion of the subject itself.
You'd rather try to avoid discussing Harris' policy by trying to attack the messenger.

Harris is facing protesters within her own rallies, protests from democrats.
This is amplified on social media.
Its early in her campaign, we will see if she clarifies her positions.
 

Skoob

Well-known member
Jun 1, 2022
7,430
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Please stop misstating my views.
If you are going to claim that I made a statement I'm going to demand you back it up with quotes.
hahahahahahahahaha!!!

Says the king of putting words in other people's mouths!

OMFG that's a funny one...thanks! Lol!
 

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
33,219
62,248
113
No, I didn't claim it was 'just' the social media backlash.
You are very exact with your language, you are choosing to mischaracterize replies to score points and stop the discussion of the subject itself.
Since you don't do details and just post twitter things you saw without looking further, yes, I am fairly exact.

Harris is facing protesters within her own rallies, protests from democrats.
Yes she is.

This is amplified on social media.
Yes, it is.

Its early in her campaign, we will see if she clarifies her positions.
Yes, we will.

And we will see if she responds differently to different protesters saying different things and protesting in different ways.
 
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squeezer

Well-known member
Jan 8, 2010
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Yeah sure, let's take the words of the twats that want to end Democracy and enable Trump to be a dictator, yeah sure Skoob.

2025 project and abortion is going to sink the Repugs and hopefully lose the Presidency, the House and the Senate.
 

Skoob

Well-known member
Jun 1, 2022
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Yeah sure, let's take the words of the twats that want to end Democracy and enable Trump to be a dictator, yeah sure Skoob.

2025 project and abortion is going to sink the Repugs and hopefully lose the Presidency, the House and the Senate.
But you took the words already and decided you believed them. Now you don't.

Funny how confirmation bias works eh?
 

squeezer

Well-known member
Jan 8, 2010
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But you took the words already and decided you believed them. Now you don't.

Funny how confirmation bias works eh?
I have no idea what you're talking about, do you?

Hey, even DJT panicked when her heard about 2025 knowing how it will be received by normal folks. Hmmmmm, I guess you are the only one who looks at it as a good thing. Yup, creepy and weird is a good tagline for the right and their agenda, creepy and weird.
 

Skoob

Well-known member
Jun 1, 2022
7,430
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I have no idea what you're talking about, do you?

Hey, even DJT panicked when her heard about 2025 knowing how it will be received by normal folks. Hmmmmm, I guess you are the only one who looks at it as a good thing. Yup, creepy and weird is a good tagline for the right and their agenda, creepy and weird.
You read Project 2025's agenda and believe it.
You read Project 2025's explanation about statements that were false about most of the items but you don't believe it.

Are you confused?
 

squeezer

Well-known member
Jan 8, 2010
21,558
16,400
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You read Project 2025's agenda and believe it.
You read Project 2025's explanation about statements that were false about most of the items but you don't believe it.

Are you confused?
I'm not but you are so can we leave it at that?

 
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