Harvard scientist says Trump hatred motivated experts who denied Wuhan lab leak theory

basketcase

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Sorry to jump in here, but honest question.

If tomorrow the world is presented with irrefutable evidence that fully supports the story that COVID-19 ”escaped from a lab,” how do our lives change?
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It would give the Trumpians some smugness as they continue to pretend that masks don't work.
 

basketcase

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They are. ...
What you said:
It matters in that China should quit fucking around with nature by collecting bats who carry viruses like this.
Clearly you think China is "fucking with nature". Either you think it is fucking with nature to collect viruses that are already out there, you know, in nature or you're making an insinuation that China is doing something beyond just studying naturally occurring viruses.

The article you referred to (second hand through some opinion piece) said it is possible that a person studying bats in nature may have been bitten by a covid positive bat. If that is the case then it was not a lab leak.

We currently have no evidence of a lab leak. If that changes and the evidence supports a lab leak, I will follow what the science says. Until then, it is simply people like you and the trump fanatics trying to pretend their conspiracy theories were in any way based in fact.

There is lots of circumstantial evidence.
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Have you taken the time to look up the meaning of the word "circumstantial"?
 

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
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Sorry to jump in here, but honest question.

If tomorrow the world is presented with irrefutable evidence that fully supports the story that COVID-19 ”escaped from a lab,” how do our lives change?

Like, does this change our response to the pandemic? Does it justify / necessitate economic, diplomatic or even military intervention with China? Something else?

Or, do the Wikipedia articles get edited, all the major news media outlets acknowledge it, and we go back to our regularly scheduled pandemic?
The latter.
If irrefutable evidence came out it escaped from a lab, basically nothing changes except maybe (maybe) we get some insight in how it grows in culture that might be useful.
If irrefutable evidence came out it was engineered, you might get some small change in approach because maybe there is some evidence about how they did it that would be useful.
If irrefutable evidence came out it was engineered and released deliberately as an attack of some kind, then you get blowback on China.

But it remains very unlikely it escaped from a lab at all, and it being engineered or engineered deliberately are even less likely.
 

Valcazar

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There is lots of circumstantial evidence.

1. The Wuhan lab collects bat viruses, and the pandemic started in Wuhan. Coincidence??
2. Three workers at Wuhan lab became sick with a flu-like illness and sought hospital care in November 2019. Their symptoms were consistent with both COVID-19 and common seasonal illness. Link: https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20210524/wuhan-lab-researchers-illness
3. And last but not least, China wont allow the WHO into Wuhan lab to do an investigation. What do they have to hide??!!

Thats enough for any rational person to have reasonable suspicion this virus may have escaped from a lab
That's actually very little circumstantial evidence, especially when compared to the evidence the other way.

1. - indisputable fact that the lab is there. And yes, that can easily be coincidence.
2. - Not strong evidence at all. As you noted, consistent symptoms with common seasonal illness. Hospitals used as common first point of care in China. No indication of testing positive for COVID upon later investigation.
3. China also cleaned up the market, got rid of the animals there, and hindered that investigation, so it's a wash.

 
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Phil C. McNasty

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What you said:

Clearly you think China is "fucking with nature". Either you think it is fucking with nature to collect viruses that are already out there, you know, in nature or you're making an insinuation that China is doing something beyond just studying naturally occurring viruses
The bat viruses are collected from bats that live in very remote, desolate caves where almost no humans tred into (partially because its easy to contract rabies
if you enter those caves without proper protection gear). Thats why if you leave those bats alone its highly unlikely anyone could ever get Covid (or any other virus) from those bats, because nobody dares enter those caves. Thats what I meant with "leave nature the fuck alone".

We currently have no evidence of a lab leak. If that changes and the evidence supports a lab leak, I will follow what the science says. Until then, it is simply people like you and the trump fanatics trying to pretend their conspiracy theories were in any way based in fact
And we're back Trump Derangement Syndrome. I see he's still living rent free inside your head 😂
Biden also launched an investigation, do you think he's into conspiracy theories as well??

Have you taken the time to look up the meaning of the word "circumstantial"?
The 3 bullet points I layed out meet the definition of circumstantial evidence
 

Phil C. McNasty

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2. - Not strong evidence at all. As you noted, consistent symptoms with common seasonal illness. Hospitals used as common first point of care in China. No indication of testing positive for COVID upon later investigation
Not true. The 3 workers displayed symptoms consistent with Covid, which was serious breathing issues.
I believe one had to be hooked up to a ventilator.
Symptoms like that are not usually present in a regular flu or common cold
 

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
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Not true. The 3 workers displayed symptoms consistent with Covid, which was serious breathing issues.
I believe one had to be hooked up to a ventilator.
Symptoms like that are not usually present in a regular flu or common cold
Please show me that report.
"I believe" is insufficient.

I have never heard anything saying they had symptoms that were unique to COVID-19 or strongly implicating COVID-19.
That would be important information.
 

basketcase

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The bat viruses are collected from bats that live in very remote, desolate caves where almost no humans tred into (partially because its easy to contract rabies
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Congrats. You finally figured out that the guy who potentially got bit by a bat potentially infected with covid happened in the field, not in a lab.

Sadly your bias about China has you trying to pretend that it is fucking with nature for people to go out in nature. Of course Canada does the same thing by continually monitoring infections in natural environments but lets ignore that.

p.s. Another word for circumstantial is coincidence.
 

Phil C. McNasty

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Congrats. You finally figured out that the guy who potentially got bit by a bat potentially infected with covid happened in the field, not in a lab
What difference does it make if he gets bit in the field, or if he brings the bat back to the lab and gets bit there??
 

Phil C. McNasty

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Which is why no one ever gets seriously sick from a cold or flu?
I didnt say that, I said serious lung infection symptoms which require a patient to be hooked up to a ventilator usually are not present with a regular flu or common cold
 

basketcase

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I didnt say that, I said serious lung infection symptoms which require a patient to be hooked up to a ventilator usually are not present with a regular flu or common cold
Except they are. In case you missed it, a few thousand Canadians die of the flu every year.
 

Phil C. McNasty

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Because if it is from the wild then it was not leaked from the lab. Is that too hard for you to understand?
If the scientist brought the virus back to the lab to study it, its highly possible it may have been leaked from there.

Why is this so hard for you to understand?? Does chronic TDS interfere with your logical thought process??
 

Phil C. McNasty

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Except they are. In case you missed it, a few thousand Canadians die of the flu every year
They die from the flu, but they normally dont die while hooked up to a ventilator because they cant breathe
 
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