OK, maybe it was a mistake on my part to include you in my comment on Phil. I apologize.
Getting hydroxychloroquine
- Thread starter Spacealien2
- Start date
I am pleasantly surprised you apologize! Therefore I accept your apologies!
We are all in it together... Fuck the politics ! Don't want anyone to get coved-19 and faster this disease is conquered the faster we can get back to worK! Longer the world it stay shutdown it will become a depression and it will affect everyone!!
PS. Fuck CCP governments ( They are extremely evil... No different then the Nazi regime ) . The vast majority of ordinary Chinese people are good.
Fuck all governments ( left or right ) they are all scum!! Politicians ( Fuck Trump, Fuck Bernie Sander, Fuck Biden , Fuck Trudeau, Fuck Doug Ford, Fuck HillaryClinton) they are all scumbags!
Darn those silly doctors. Porn Addict is so much smarter than they are and has just picked out where they went wrong - all while sitting at his computer in his mom's basement!
Peak Prospectiry ( Chris Marktenson PHD ) in the video point out the facts and the flaw of the paper not me!
Typically leftie can't attack my logical arguments so they start to invented things like " sitting at his computer in his mom's basement and start to attack me by making things up!
Just followed the data which was pointed in the video post#134. All papers must be peer reviewed! Just pointing out the flaws on the papers that don't include zinc combo treatment!!
Go to video time 14:12 to 16:12 and also
Go to video time 42:30 to 42:53
He not a fan of the study ( research paper) don't include Zinc or studies indicate why their reason don't include the use of zinc!
BottomLine: Study after study exploring Hydroxychloroquine aren't including zinc , measuring
for serum levels, or in any way tracing or even discussing it. Very weird! As pointed in the above video !
To be fair, the Porn guy said this:
PS. If the peer reviewed paper hydroxychlooquine & Azithromycin with Zinc combo treatment says it only it garbages then that what the data indicate then it time to move on! Always follow the data regardless of the politics!
Flaws studies ( they did not include Zinc Combo treatment, it a small Studies, not peer reviewed)
It only includes hydroxychlooquine & Azithromycin only!! Zinc treatment is very critical !! You need. Zinc needed to combined in order for hydroxychlooquine to be effective!
Can you tell me why they left out the Zinc? This is like leaving out brake fluid and saying brakes don't work... Also why they left out the dosage they used in the paperwork? This is like not showing how much oil you put in your car and blaming the oil for the stuttering or overheating (you can put too little or too much)... bear in mind, the recent Brazil study was overdosing their candidates by as much as 300% and came to the conclusion that it doesn't work... Plus it not peer reviewed!squeezer; said:
Nope mostly likely Flaw paper if it don't include Zinc combo treatment!
PS All paper need to be doubled blinded , large sample size and peer reviewed! That the Gold Standard for medicines.
PPS. Don't know why people not including Zinc in treatment also in the studies .
With all the deaths do you not believe if this worked it would be used all over the world and if low in supply every doctor would be screaming "WE NEED hydroxychlooquine, Azithromycin, Zinc just as they were yammering for ventilators.
Leave it to the professionals not the politicians and the internet goofballs.
Those studies don't include zinc combo treatment with hydroxychlooquine & Azithromycin that why those treatment don't work!
Zinc is the critical for hydroxychlooquine to work!
Plus all papers must be peered reviewed! For now combo treatment with Zinc & hydroxychlooquine & Azithromycin is still hold the best promised and best outcome providing start treatment as early as possible ( if start treatment too late mean outcome of disease will be bad too much damage to body)!
Don't understand why those Guess those professional are not including Zinc in their treatment also.
Remember all those professional ( Health Canada ! United State CDC) say the public don't need mask , now they say public should wear mask!
Remember all those professional in the beginning not to worry it only a flu, and then they lockdown the cities and countries triggering
a world wide recessions with possible a depression !
So something as simple as wearing a mask getting that wrong it mind blowing!!!
FYI:
https://www.propublica.org/article/...escriptions-for-themselves-and-their-families
Doctors Are Hoarding Unproven Coronavirus Medicine by Writing Prescriptions for Themselves and Their Families
Pharmacists told ProPublica that they are seeing unusual and fraudulent prescribing activity as doctors stockpile unproven coronavirus drugs endorsed by President Donald Trump.
PS. Only India produces hydroxychlooquine and China produced 90% of world antibiotics and rest 10% antibiotics produces by India. Furthermore India ban the export of Hydroxychloroquine they say they need for their citizens.
PPS. Hydroxychlooquine & Zinc & Azithromycin treatment work only if you take early in the disease and it will provide a better outcomes ! If taken too late will not cure the disease! Plus most Doctor don't prescribe this treatment until it is peer reviewed!
I have not had the time to go over all the comments in this thread or go over the original articles from the mentioned studied but I will make one point. There is also an epidemic of medical "experts" on the internet. I do not mean that as a derogatory term but people need to realize what it takes to become a real expert:
4 years of undergrad with average GPA 4.0 or A+, volunteering, research, and leadership roles
4 years of medical school
At least 2 years of residency
Now those people who you see in the studies also likely have an additional 3 years of residency for ID or publichealth, they likely have an additional 1-2 years of fellowship and likely 2-3 years additional for their graduate training. That is 18 YEARS of studying before they are named experts on the field.
I would also like to point out that the academic ID experts who I quoted to have approximately 18 years of experience usually are not motivated by money. They infact take a pay cut to do what they do. Most of them are salary and do research because they love doing it. If they were after money they would be fee- for service and they would not do graduate school. In fact if money was their sole interest opening a medical spa and selling HCQ, Zinc, Azithro would probably make them millions.
So what does all that training give those experts which an online overnight expert does not have when it comes to this topic?
A) Understanding of the pathophysiology and pharmacology
B) Critical thinking and appraisal skills
C) Knowing the CONTEXT and history behind things
So taking those points and applying it to your question of why zinc was not included:
A) Synergistic drug effects are VERY rare in medicine. One of the few examples is levo dopa for parkinsons and that has a clear relationship. For one drug to make another drug better it has to alter its mechanism of action; otherwise that drug is just a cofounder and including it in the study is just adding noise to the impact of the drug of interest. Azithro is included in the HCQ regimen because it is an antibiotic and its sole purpose is to try to prevent opportunistic infections from a diseased COVID lung, it does nothing against COVID and it does nothing with HCQ. Zinc it self has immune properties. HCQ has a very complex multi progned mechanism that people dont really understand thats why it is tried literally in all diseases.
B) It is VERY hard to show that a drug has an impact unless it is very clear like vaccines are and even that is debated... lol. To show in a study that a specific drug is the REASON why someone got better and it was not just chance alone, the natural history of the disease or any other supportive intervention or patient protective factor is a BIG task. The only way is a randomized double blinded, placebo control trial with BIG numbers to make inferences from a sample to a population. Having more drugs only makes things harder for the investigators at some point if the claim is HCQ works people have to isolate it and do combination studies
C) This is perhaps the most important. People that study mediicne know how these trials go and know about HCQ. There is always chaos at the begining of every drug. If you take a sugar pill and claim its a cure to cancer I am sure you will get mixed results from actual researchers, just due to chance alone 5% of studies will be positive no matter what given the significance value of 95% used in medicine. The other important factor is experts KNOW what is relevant when treating a patient. A drug may have a clear established effect but whats the point if it has no clinical impact? You need experience to know these things.
I think Porn Addict is going to have to go look up a lot of big, long words now....
That line of argument does not work. Why not just give all drugs we have to everyone just to see if it works ? Drugs have side effects. Also focusing on one drug too much in research takes away from other drugs that have more promise. Chemotherapy drugs arguably undergo one of the most rigorous research and development paths out of any medication. All of them usually have level 1 evidence specified to the exact disease matches to the dose. I can guarantee you with the current evidence for and against hcq there is no way it will pass any of the steps chemo drugs have gone though. Doctors can always prescribe things off label but that’s up to them Ans their professional opinion But it does open them up to litigation if things go wrong and they are not within the standard of care.
No one that is serious in the medical community is against a treatment for covid and that includes hcq. We just need to study it more.
Go to video time 0.23 to 1:23 ( main treatment in South Korea for covid-19 working pretty well there HcQ& Zinc & Azithro)
Also Go to video time from 11:25 to end ( HcQ acts like ionphore which allows Zinc to entered the cell to stop covid-19 from replicating).
Don't understand those other research paper don't include Zinc combo treatment meanwhile South Korea doctor are using it as main treatment for covid-19.
PS. Like I say before all the papers need to be peer research. Please explain why South Korea doctor using it as main treatment in South Korea!
https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/22/politics/read-whistleblower-vaccine-development/index.html
Updated 4:52 PM ET, Wed April 22, 2020
(CNN)Dr. Rick Bright, the director of the agency responsible for leading the charge on the production and purchase of vaccines in the Trump administration, released a statement Wednesday blaming political motives for his abrupt reassignment.
Read the statement in full:
"Yesterday, I was removed from my positions as the Director of the Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority (BARDA) and HHS Deputy Assistant Secretary for Preparedness and Response by the Administration and involuntarily transferred to a more limited and less impactful position at the National Institutes of Health. I believe this transfer was in response to my insistence that the government invest the billions of dollars allocated by Congress to address the COVID-19 pandemic into safe and scientifically vetted solutions, and not in drugs, vaccines and other technologies that lack scientific merit. I am speaking out because to combat this deadly virus, science -- not politics or cronyism -- has to lead the way.
"I have spent my entire career in vaccine development, in the government with CDC and BARDA and also in the biotechnology industry. My professional background has prepared me for a moment like this -- to confront and defeat a deadly virus that threatens Americans and people around the globe. To this point, I have led the government's efforts to invest in the best science available to combat the COVID-19 pandemic. Unfortunately, this resulted in clashes with HHS political leadership, including criticism for my proactive efforts to invest early in vaccines and supplies critical to saving American lives. I also resisted efforts to fund potentially dangerous drugs promoted by those with political connections.
"Specifically, and contrary to misguided directives, I limited the broad use of chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine, promoted by the Administration as a panacea, but which clearly lack scientific merit. While I am prepared to look at all options and to think "outside the box" for effective treatments, I rightly resisted efforts to provide an unproven drug on demand to the American public. I insisted that these drugs be provided only to hospitalized patients with confirmed COVID-19 while under the supervision of a physician. These drugs have potentially serious risks associated with them, including increased mortality observed in some recent studies in patients with COVID-19.
"Sidelining me in the middle of this pandemic and placing politics and cronyism ahead of science puts lives at risk and stunts national efforts to safely and effectively address this urgent public health crisis.
"I will request that the Inspector General of the Department of Health and Human Services investigate the manner in which this Administration has politicized the work of BARDA and has pressured me and other conscientious scientists to fund companies with political connections as well as efforts that lack scientific merit. Rushing blindly towards unproven drugs can be disastrous and result in countless more deaths. Science, in service to the health and safety of the American people, must always trump politics.
"I am very grateful for the bipartisan support from Congress and their confidence in my leadership of BARDA as reflected in the generous appropriation to BARDA in the CARES 3 Act. It is my sincere hope that the dedicated professionals at BARDA and throughout HHS will be allowed to use the best scientific acumen and integrity to continue their efforts to stop the pandemic without political pressure or distractions. Americans deserve no less."
Corrupt, profiteering nutbar president fires top doc who won't aid him pushing quack cures on innocent sufferers, just so Trump and his cronies can make extra $$$$$$$.
Updated 4:52 PM ET, Wed April 22, 2020
(CNN)Dr. Rick Bright, the director of the agency responsible for leading the charge on the production and purchase of vaccines in the Trump administration, released a statement Wednesday blaming political motives for his abrupt reassignment.
Read the statement in full:
"Yesterday, I was removed from my positions as the Director of the Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority (BARDA) and HHS Deputy Assistant Secretary for Preparedness and Response by the Administration and involuntarily transferred to a more limited and less impactful position at the National Institutes of Health. I believe this transfer was in response to my insistence that the government invest the billions of dollars allocated by Congress to address the COVID-19 pandemic into safe and scientifically vetted solutions, and not in drugs, vaccines and other technologies that lack scientific merit. I am speaking out because to combat this deadly virus, science -- not politics or cronyism -- has to lead the way.
"I have spent my entire career in vaccine development, in the government with CDC and BARDA and also in the biotechnology industry. My professional background has prepared me for a moment like this -- to confront and defeat a deadly virus that threatens Americans and people around the globe. To this point, I have led the government's efforts to invest in the best science available to combat the COVID-19 pandemic. Unfortunately, this resulted in clashes with HHS political leadership, including criticism for my proactive efforts to invest early in vaccines and supplies critical to saving American lives. I also resisted efforts to fund potentially dangerous drugs promoted by those with political connections.
"Specifically, and contrary to misguided directives, I limited the broad use of chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine, promoted by the Administration as a panacea, but which clearly lack scientific merit. While I am prepared to look at all options and to think "outside the box" for effective treatments, I rightly resisted efforts to provide an unproven drug on demand to the American public. I insisted that these drugs be provided only to hospitalized patients with confirmed COVID-19 while under the supervision of a physician. These drugs have potentially serious risks associated with them, including increased mortality observed in some recent studies in patients with COVID-19.
"Sidelining me in the middle of this pandemic and placing politics and cronyism ahead of science puts lives at risk and stunts national efforts to safely and effectively address this urgent public health crisis.
"I will request that the Inspector General of the Department of Health and Human Services investigate the manner in which this Administration has politicized the work of BARDA and has pressured me and other conscientious scientists to fund companies with political connections as well as efforts that lack scientific merit. Rushing blindly towards unproven drugs can be disastrous and result in countless more deaths. Science, in service to the health and safety of the American people, must always trump politics.
"I am very grateful for the bipartisan support from Congress and their confidence in my leadership of BARDA as reflected in the generous appropriation to BARDA in the CARES 3 Act. It is my sincere hope that the dedicated professionals at BARDA and throughout HHS will be allowed to use the best scientific acumen and integrity to continue their efforts to stop the pandemic without political pressure or distractions. Americans deserve no less."
Corrupt, profiteering nutbar president fires top doc who won't aid him pushing quack cures on innocent sufferers, just so Trump and his cronies can make extra $$$$$$$.
Sorry I fail to see how the opinion of one family physician practicing in Northern Virginia on his you tube channel with links to his IG, Twitter and website evidence for the efficacy and safety of a medication. Lets get information from the proper channels. Go to https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/
and search for studies there. TO be honest I did not even look at the video as I have better avenues for my information.
That video at best is "expert opinion" although he really isnt an expert at this as he is a community GP with no academic appointments.
If you look at the evidence tree expert opinion is at the very bottom. I will emphasize again, I am NOT against HQ I hope it works all I am saying is lets wait for the results to be completed.
