Tim Hortons Locations Owned By Founders' Kids Reduce Employee Benefits/Breaks

[GameBoy27]

Wynne shouldn't act so surprised. Ontario businesses, both small and large have been warning that if the minimum wage is increased to $15 in a short period of time, businesses will look for ways to (legally) cut costs.

Has Wynne ever called another company a bully for cutting jobs in an effort to maintain profitability? What about when banks (who rake in millions) have slashed jobs in Ontario? Did she call them bullies?

 

[huckfinn]

Wynne shouldn't act so surprised. Ontario businesses, both small and large have been warning that if the minimum wage is increased to $15 in a short period of time, businesses will look for ways to (legally) cut costs.

Has Wynne ever called another company a bully for cutting jobs in an effort to maintain profitability? What about when banks (who rake in millions) have slashed jobs in Ontario? Did she call them bullies?

Businesses have always warned the dire consequences of stuff like this.

Funny thing is, they've continued to do fine.

 

[FAST]

Businesses have always warned the dire consequences of stuff like this.

Funny thing is, they've continued to do fine.

Then why not make the min. $20/HR,... if business "do fine" after a legislated "raise" ???

 

[anon1]

What about when banks (who rake in millions) have slashed jobs in Ontario? Did she call them bullies?

Does she NEED to?

 

[FAST]

Wynne shouldn't act so surprised. Ontario businesses, both small and large have been warning that if the minimum wage is increased to $15 in a short period of time, businesses will look for ways to (legally) cut costs.

Has Wynne ever called another company a bully for cutting jobs in an effort to maintain profitability? What about when banks (who rake in millions) have slashed jobs in Ontario? Did she call them bullies?

Even Granny is smart enough, or more likely been advised a such,... that her voter base would walk away if she attacked a major source of their retirement capital.

 

[frankcastle]

I see both sides....Tim Hortons took away benefits that they don't have to provide.

That said I saw an unverified post that claimed a single location brings in 400K profit per year. Edit another site says 256K

Tim's is almost synonymous with coffee (like Kleenex to tissue) so I doubt the outrage will last.

What's working against the employees is that they are unskilled and easy to replace.

 

[bver_hunter]

Seattle was the first USA state to implement the $15.00 minimum wage. All the pundits / media came up with the same kind of scaremongering. Yet, Seattle has now achieved the lowest unemployment rate in decades at 2.9%. We have to wait to see whether this was a very rash move or will actually help the economy.
“People have a tendency to focus on counter-factual headlines,” TD Bank’s Brian DePratto told VICE Money. “We’re talking about a very miniscule fraction of overall employment that will be affected by the minimum wage increase.”
A recent study from the Bank of Canada forecasted that minimum wage hikes across nine provinces in 2018 and 2019 will result in “employment losses of about 60,000 workers”, equivalent to a 0.3 percent decline in the overall number of hours worked.

Mainstream Canadian media was awash with headlines highlighting the “60,000” figure, which is indeed significant if viewed in isolation of the overall employment trend in Canada’s economy, especially of late.

“The Bank of Canada report was very badly reported by the media,” said Brett House, Deputy Chief Economist at Scotiabank. “The headline of that report should have said: ‘macroeconomic effect of minimum wage hike likely to be within margin of error’. There’s going to be a negligible effect on the macroeconomy, and a very positive effect on low wage earners.”

House points out that employment losses of 60,000 doesn’t necessarily mean 60,000 existing jobs will be lost due to the minimum wage hike — it implies 60,000 fewer jobs than projected will be created in the next year or so. For context, the Canadian economy created 79,000 jobs in December, and 79,500 jobs in November. In the year 2017 alone, Canada created 423,000 jobs — 394,200 of those jobs were full-time.

In Ontario, the minimum wage increase ($11.60 to $14 an hour) is estimated to impact eight percent of all workers — an additional 15 percent of workers will probably also see a rise in their wages as a result of the minimum wage increase, simply because the wage floor moves up, say economists.

https://news.vice.com/en_ca/article/...ive-job-losses

 

[dickydoem]

I see both sides....Tim Hortons took away benefits that they don't have to provide.

That said I saw an unverified post that claimed a single location brings in 400K profit per year. Edit another site says 256K

Tim's is almost synonymous with coffee (like Kleenex to tissue) so I doubt the outrage will last.

What's working against the employees is that they are unskilled and easy to replace.

Without seeing an actual P&L statement from one of these locations any of these guesses is pure speculation. There was a hypothetical example on here a few days ago that used really low suppositions. Here is one with what I think uses more realistic figures.

Wage increase of $2.40/hr. x8hr= $19.20
20 people to cover 24 hr. day=$384
364 days x$384= $139,776.
This does not include the extra CPP, Ei, Workers Comp, Vac Pay, etc. costs or the 2 new days off expense, so the total new cost would be in excess of $150,000.

Would you be happy if you were a franchisee and were denied the ability to raise price to offset this huge cost increase? Most owners have a large investment in their stores and work long hours and are virtually on call 24/7 if a problem arises. They don't simply sit back and watch the profits roll in.

 

[frankcastle]

Without seeing an actual P&L statement from one of these locations any of these guesses is pure speculation. There was a hypothetical example on here a few days ago that used really low suppositions. Here is one with what I think uses more realistic figures.

Wage increase of $2.40/hr. x8hr= $19.20
20 people to cover 24 hr. day=$384
364 days x$384= $139,776.
This does not include the extra CPP, Ei, Workers Comp, Vac Pay, etc. costs or the 2 new days off expense, so the total new cost would be in excess of $150,000.

Would you be happy if you were a franchisee and were denied the ability to raise price to offset this huge cost increase? Most owners have a large investment in their stores and work long hours and are virtually on call 24/7 if a problem arises. They don't simply sit back and watch the profits roll in.

Like I said before I see it from both sides. Neither person is in a great position. The worker has to figure out how to get by on their low wages. The employer has to figure out how to make a profit under the new laws.

As for being a franchisee. I'm sure they are unhappy but they knew what they were getting into when starting a franchise. But there are also major perks. If you opened a brand new coffee shop under your own name you would have to work really hard to get people in the door. Whereas when you open a Tims you have instant recognition.

 

[FAST]

So a person should invest $2 million of their money, plus ongoing fees... and then have some vote buying Fiberal force the owner to give your employees a 30% raise,... and the Looney left here wonder why the franchises reacted the way they did.

When someone invests their capital into a business,... one would expect the government to stay out of your business,... but who knew we would have Granny fucking things up for them.

And now,... Grannies employees are sticking their noses were is doesn't belong, "protesting" at a privately owned business... "join a union, all your problems are solved",... ass holes.

 

[frankcastle]

So a person should invest $2 million of their money, plus ongoing fees... and then have some vote buying Fiberal force the owner to give your employees a 30% raise,... and the Looney left here wonder why the franchises reacted the way they did.

.

It royally sucks but you can't expect the government to stay out of your business forever. One thing that is certain is things change.

I have no problem with what the Tim's owners did. They were within their rights.

 

[GameBoy27]

I see both sides....Tim Hortons took away benefits that they don't have to provide.

That said I saw an unverified post that claimed a single location brings in 400K profit per year. Edit another site says 256K

Tim's is almost synonymous with coffee (like Kleenex to tissue) so I doubt the outrage will last.

What's working against the employees is that they are unskilled and easy to replace.

I was listening to someone crunching the numbers this morning. They figured the wage increase with all the other changes to the legislation could cost a Tims with 30 full and part time employees up to 120K per year. Of course I have not verified those numbers but if true, it's a substantial hit to their bottom line.

It royally sucks but you can't expect the government to stay out of your business forever. One thing that is certain is things change.

I have no problem with what the Tim's owners did. They were within their rights.

I don't think people have a problem with increasing minimum wage. It's the rate at which their doing it. If the Liberals are telling us higher a minimum wage is important, why haven't they been incrementally increasing it over the last 14 ears? Answer: June election!

 

[dickydoem]

Why didn't Wynne also substantially increase the income of people on ODSP, who receive far less than those making minimum wage and are among the poorest in the province. Could it be that she would have had to pay that out of her provincial revenues?

 

[Occasionally]

Why didn't Wynne also substantially increase the income of people on ODSP, who receive far less than those making minimum wage and are among the poorest in the province. Could it be that she would have had to pay that out of her provincial revenues?

For sure.

The more funds paid by businesses the better.

On the other hand, the government has no problem spending $1.2 BILLION to redevelop the Port Lands area. Something that costs a ton, will only help any person or business in that part of town, and the various levels of government involved had no issue.

At a ballpark minimum wage increase of let's say $2 per person to get to $14/hr. $1.2 billion is equivalent to 600,000,000 man hours of work.

Instead it gets sunk into rebuilding an area, where tons of real estate companies and construction companies will be making tons of profits.

 

[frankcastle]

I don't think people have a problem with increasing minimum wage. It's the rate at which their doing it. If the Liberals are telling us higher a minimum wage is important, why haven't they been incrementally increasing it over the last 14 ears? Answer: June election!

Knowing the increases are rarely incremental and gentle. Businesses should keep that in the back of their mind so it is less of a shock when it inevitably happens.

 

[Musketeer]

Businesses have always warned the dire consequences of stuff like this.

Funny thing is, they've continued to do fine.

DITTO! Look at Alberta for example where the minimum wage went up to $13.80 last year. According to a CTV News report they've actually added many more service sector jobs in that province and there hasn't been the same huge outcry from small businesses in that province as there has been in Ontario.

The minimum wage workers in that province have more money to spend and are boosting sales, including buying more coffee and burgers etc.

I think that they'll do just fine given time.

 

[TeeJay]

Wynne shouldn't act so surprised. Ontario businesses, both small and large have been warning that if the minimum wage is increased to $15 in a short period of time, businesses will look for ways to (legally) cut costs.

Has Wynne ever called another company a bully for cutting jobs in an effort to maintain profitability? What about when banks (who rake in millions) have slashed jobs in Ontario? Did she call them bullies?

Liberals economic policy is laughable
They are cool with cutting out high tech jobs (or worse signing free trade agreements to make things cheaper overseas then importing) and flooding market with immigrants (many of whom feel lied to since their degree is not worth toilet paper in Canadian job market)
But minimum wage earners (and welfare recipients) should be courted for easy votes come election day

 

[Occasionally]

DITTO! Look at Alberta for example where the minimum wage went up to $13.80 last year. According to a CTV News report they've actually added many more service sector jobs in that province and there hasn't been the same huge outcry from small businesses in that province as there has been in Ontario.

The minimum wage workers in that province have more money to spend and are boosting sales, including buying more coffee and burgers etc.

I think that they'll do just fine given time.

So instead of banking the increase to help cover rent and accommodations (which low income people always complain about in large cities), they are spending it on coffee and burgers.

Great, so it's basically back to square one in terms of disposable income used for necessities. If people with low incomes are hurting that much for increased wages due to high cost of living, they should be banking the money for a rainy day or putting it to paying rent. Not blowing on fast food and impulse purchases.

 

[FAST]

Knowing the increases are rarely incremental and gentle. Businesses should keep that in the back of their mind so it is less of a shock when it inevitably happens.

Come on frank,... 1st, the "increase",... also known as vote buying,... are not incremental because its based on politics, and NOT economics.

And to say that business should prepare for said vote buying,... just in case a Fiberal government is elected,... so lets raise our prices now,.. because a Fiberal government just got elected.

 

[frankcastle]

Come on frank,... 1st, the "increase",... also known as vote buying,... are not incremental because its based on politics, and NOT economics.

And to say that business should prepare for said vote buying,... just in case a Fiberal government is elected,... so lets raise our prices now,.. because a Fiberal government just got elected.

You'd have to be a moron to run a business and not expect wages to go up. The fact that it was by the government should not be a shock as it has happened before. If you study ecomomics without considering the effects of government you really aren't studying ecomomics.

At no point did I say they should raise prices in advance.