Female student arrested after 8 stabbed at Dunbarton High School in Pickering

Bud Plug

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Aug 17, 2001
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In what century do you come from? That used to be what was happening in those upper class English public schools in the 19th century, where newcomers were sytematically bullied in order that they could develop this English 'stiff upper lip'... so that they could face the enemy standing at attention in battle order without flinching and showing emotion in front of the troops. What they produced instead were psychopaths and generations of sexual deviants, obsessed with being caned by mistress. Bullying also teaches people that the law doesn't apply to them and they can do it in adult life.

Bullying often leads to physical interaction. Just touching someone without their permission is criminal assault, but is hardly seen like that in schools. People have a right to carry out their activities without being assaulted and harrassed. That includes school too. People get picked upon because of their differences, and they get picked upon by people who gang up together. There were probably warning signs and teachers should have spotted them. But too often, bullying gets written off as 'kids will be kids' and notions that kids cannot be evil. Psychopathic behaviour starts in school and will carry out in adult life. The mother, if she had any inkling, is also responsible for not bringing it up with school authorities. Some resort to suicide because they feel they have nothing to lose and have no avenue because the system tells them to simply buck up. In this case, she had probably decided that she had nothing to lose, but was going to give payback first.

Bullying is visible in a school environment, and teaching staff have some responsibility when they look the other way.
I guess I must come from the future, when people finally realize that incidents like this cannot be so simplistically explained away with "the girl lashed out as a result of bullying - it's really someone else's fault she stabbed 8 kids".

Although I couldn't really follow your post, you do seem to have misinterpreted my post as completely absolving bullies from blame or correction. My main point, and the one you don't really address, is that "bullying", in particular verbal bullying, does not excuse every imaginable form of retaliation (and certainly not a deadly assault with a weapon). I think it's been at least a couple of centuries here in western society since a verbal slight could justify homicide. Is that the century you are from?

Yes, children pick on other children based on a variety of differences, and we wish they wouldn't, but they do and they always will. More to the point, so do adults, and they always will, and there's not much that can be done about it. Children have to learn that they will not always be included in groups, that they will not always be treated kindly or fairly, and how to deal with these problems short of inflicting physical harm on themselves or others.

And yes, psychopathic behaviour can take root at any age. But what would you call the behaviour of the girl who did the stabbing? Certainly appeared to be conduct without regard to its consequences. Seems like classic psychopathic behaviour to me. My point is that there are almost always issues to be addressed ON BOTH SIDES of a bullying problem. They may not be the same issues, but they are both problems worth addressing.

We may not be able to completely prevent bullying, but we ought to be able to do a much better job of preventing these sorts of violent rampages in our schools.
 

oldjones

CanBarelyRe Member
Aug 18, 2001
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I know a couple of people at the school.
They must be very shaken, and I hope the best for them and you. But that still amounts to gossip.

In any case no matter the notional method, suicide wishes in the very young are very serious and far too common. We shouldn't trivialize and confuse our thinking by equating them to catchphrases; it's still a death wish.
 

oldjones

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Aug 18, 2001
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Oldjones really needs to learn the fine art of multiquoting
That art among many others. Who else did you want me to quote in my reply, and how would it get anyone closer to the thread topic?

If it's just the line-up of sig gifs of getting nowhere fast that you're concerned with, I recommend AdBlocker™. My standard is one response per customer, not a freeforall grab-bag. Which is why this one's all for you, not stuck in the middle of some long screed that wanders all over.

You know I never do that.
 

oldjones

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Aug 18, 2001
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Thanks for at last doing what should have been done from the first (and always): referencing a source.

And thanks to a couple of brave — but useless and hugely overpaid* — teachers she didn't get her infantile wish and may well live past her juvenile troubles. Good thing there weren't a lot of highly paid, heavily armed and armoured cops fearful she might lunge a step or two; she'd be dead because that would make them 'feel' endangered.

But then it's teachers we pay to think, not cops. And suicide by cop is still suicide, and just as awful and tragic as by any other method. When you try to think and not trivialize it.
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* summarizing the consensus here during the teachers' job action.
 

AK-47

Armed to the tits
Mar 6, 2009
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Thanks for at last doing what should have been done from the first (and always): referencing a source
Have you tried googling this stuff yourself?? Do you even know what google is??
 

oldjones

CanBarelyRe Member
Aug 18, 2001
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Have you tried googling this stuff yourself?? Do you even know what google is??
Think back to basic high-school essay writing. It's for the one claiming the fact to provide the reference that supports it. Not for the one they're attempting to persuade or convince. Why ever would the doubters make any effort to prove the other side's point? You'd have to be dim to expect that. Or to imagine your unsubstantiated point was made at all.

Google is a mis-pelling of 'googol', chosen by one of its founders as the name of the new search-engine after a conversation with his daughter.

I assumed 'googol' needed no explanation.
 

AK-47

Armed to the tits
Mar 6, 2009
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Or you can just google it
 

poorboy

Well-known member
Aug 18, 2001
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Since you're determined to be off topic: No one* has seriously proposed a ban on firearms. Not even in Canada, let alone the US where bearing arms is a Right. Much like roadside breath tests, many authorities have proposed serious mandatory background checks to try to weed out the dangerous individuals. And that would be case by case.

Shall we get back to the topic at hand? Or discuss guns intelligently, more than a sentence at a time?
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*Just as general as 'they', on the other side.
You missed the whole CZ 858 and Swiss Arms bans made by the RCMP, which were successfully overturned by Justice Minister Stephen Blaney under the Harper government after gun owers fought back. The Liberals have handed the power back to the RCMP to ban firearms without providing a reasonable rationale. Even now, rifles such as the Blaze 47 get banned simply because they look scary. Here's a fact. A firearm the looks scary is no more dangerous than a firearm that doesn't.
 

wilbur

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Jan 19, 2004
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Since you're determined to be off topic: No one* has seriously proposed a ban on firearms. Not even in Canada, let alone the US where bearing arms is a Right. Much like roadside breath tests, many authorities have proposed serious mandatory background checks to try to weed out the dangerous individuals. And that would be case by case.

Shall we get back to the topic at hand? Or discuss guns intelligently, more than a sentence at a time?
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*Just as general as 'they', on the other side.
Can't let this one by. Yes, there are some leading politicians who want to ban firearms. It is based on the theory that the fewer firearms, the fewer the fatalities. The problem is that they can only realistically ban firearms they know about..... those legally owned. No mention about the firearms illegally owned that cause the carnage.

Three successive leaders of the Liberal Party proposed bans of legally owned firearms as electoral promises: Martin before he lost the elections: ban all handguns. Dion: all semi-auto firearms including handguns. Ignatieff: ban all semi-auto firearms.

But, you may say: they didn't want to ban all firearms. They start with the scariest ones..... until they are all gone. And that is the real purpose of a registry: so they know what to seize when the time comes, just like they did in the UK and Australia.

BTW, in Canada we already have serious background checks for firearms license applicants. But that is never enough for the gun grabbers.
 

wilbur

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Jan 19, 2004
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Can't let this one by. Yes, there are some leading politicians who want to ban firearms. It is based on the theory that the fewer firearms, the fewer the fatalities. The problem is that they can only realistically ban firearms they know about..... those legally owned. No mention about the firearms illegally owned that cause the carnage.

Three successive leaders of the Liberal Party proposed bans of legally owned firearms as electoral promises: Martin before he lost the elections: ban all handguns. Dion: all semi-auto firearms including handguns. Ignatieff: ban all semi-auto firearms.

But, you may say: they didn't want to ban all firearms. They start with the scariest ones..... until they are all gone. And that is the real purpose of a registry: so they know what to seize when the time comes, just like they did in the UK and Australia.

BTW, in Canada we already have serious background checks for firearms license applicants. But that is never enough for the gun grabbers.
And another occasion back in 1995. They banned all legally owned pistols with a barrel shorter than 4 inches. They also banned select military rifles just because of their appearance. I met a cop who owns a FN-FAL. He can't even take it to the range because as he's prohibited from shooting it. It's got the same functionality as another semi-automatic .308 hunting rifle you can buy at Sail; but it looks scary. The gun grabbers always want more..... until they are all gone.
 

mmouse

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Sad, sad, sad - but the two teachers who reportedly wrestled the girl down and disarmed her deserve recognition for their actions.

(edit - why is the word b**********y, or the quality of being brave, being blocked?)
 

Yoga Face

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Jun 30, 2009
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My first thought is she acts out against

1 racism

2 bullying

3 other feelings of hopelessness and frustration brought on, not by other kids, but by the system that forces her into a school with these other kids are who commit acts of gross immaturity

solution to the majority of this nonsense is school vouchers

putting all students into a melting pot is, and has always been, and always will always be ludicrous

give students the freedom to be with the teachers, the students and the learning environment that is peculiar to them

Also, it is ludicrous to create a melting pot subject matter for all students


Ever watch are you smarter than a fifth grader?

Most adults are not because you forget most stuff you were taught

So, WTF is so important in teaching it?

teach kids to think in the subject matter that they need to grow and learn who they are and that means no melting pot, treat kids as individuals and that means different schools for different kids . Let the free enterprise rule and the public schools can compete for the vouchers with the free enterprise and if they cannot compete then they disappear into the garbage bin of history and will become what the future will regard as the dark days of education


If you search for wisdom in the public schools' concept of melting pot education you are searching for wisdom where there is none


When I was in public school I formed two walkouts against having to co-exist with immature students, and that is the solution - just walk the fuck out then protest!

Ironically, I was breaking truancy laws and any non-conformist parent who supported such actions by pulling there kids and encouraging the protest could face jail
 

fuji

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Jan 31, 2005
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The UK has implemented a knife control system. You have to be 18 to buy a knife and adults are supposed to supervise any use of a knife by a minor. If you order a knife online the delivery guy has to check ID.

They don't have a knife registry yet. Maybe one day.
 
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