CBC report - Most Canadians don't think humans are the main cause of climate change

Moviefan-2

Court Jester
Oct 17, 2011
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If you actually wanted to look at things scientifically, the question is which theory produces the most reliable results. Considering you and the rest of the (pro-science) crew refuse to suggest a better (hypothesis)....
A better hypothesis for what?

The Earth's climate has been changing for the past 4.5-billion years. And there is no evidence that anything unusual or unprecedented has occurred in recent times.

Furthermore, the predictions of how man-made emissions would supposedly create unusual changes in temperature have been consistently and spectacularly wrong.

(Oh, and I fixed your quote for you.)
 

canada-man

Well-known member
Jun 16, 2007
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Toronto, Ontario
canadianmale.wordpress.com
That's Canada-man's source, iceagetheatre.ca who was calling an ice age in 30 years, that's where he was getting some of his charts from.
No legit scientists predicted an imminent ice age.

In fact there was a study that looked at the 2 or 3% of peer assessed papers that didn't support the theory of anthropogenic climate change, when they were looked at they were found to have major issues, from ignoring data that didn't support their findings, poor science and other nonsense to the point that none of those studies could be replicated.

They were found to be just shoddy work.

http://www.theguardian.com/environm...trarian-papers?CMP=twt_a-science_b-gdnscience


so what caused the medieval warming period?

why was the age of the dinosaurs warmer than today?

why was the period from 8000bc to 1000 BC warmer than today?
 

lucky_blue

New member
Nov 23, 2010
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A better hypothesis for what?

The Earth's climate has been changing for the past 4.5-billion years. And there is no evidence that anything unusual or unprecedented has occurred in recent times.

Furthermore, the predictions of how man-made emissions would supposedly create unusual changes in temperature have been consistently and spectacularly wrong.

(Oh, and I fixed your quote for you.)
Anthropogenic climate change has become the new religion for urban leftists. How dare you insult the prophet muhammad? You "deniers" will pay!

 

lucky_blue

New member
Nov 23, 2010
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Anthropogenic climate change alarmism significantly increases centralized political power and control. Sadly they are for the most part confused and misguided sympathizers.

 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
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A better hypothesis for what?

The Earth's climate has been changing for the past 4.5-billion years. And there is no evidence that anything unusual or unprecedented has occurred in recent times.
The only other times CO2 has risen so drastically it lead to mass extinctions. So yes, it has happened before, but to call a mass extinction 'nothing unusual' is incredibly stupid.
http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2015/04/13/3646211/boom-youre-dead/

and
(Phys.org) —It's has been know that massive increases in emission of CO2 from volcanoes, associated with the opening of the Atlantic Ocean in the end-Triassic Period, set off a shift in state of the climate which caused global mass extinction of species, eliminating about 34% of genera. The extinction created ecological niches which allowed the rise of dinosaurs during the Triassic, about 250-200 million years ago.

Read more at: http://phys.org/news/2013-03-link-co2-mass-extinctions-species.html#jCp

Furthermore, the predictions of how man-made emissions would supposedly create unusual changes in temperature have been consistently and spectacularly wrong.
You continue to state this lie, even when you've been caught out with it.
Typical denier, as you've said:

For instance, you admitted:

I did. The published sources -- including your source -- has the IPCC "projection" for 2015 at 0.85ºC and the HadCRUT4 anomaly (using the same baseline) in this super El Nino year at just 0.71ºC.

Proving the IPCC's "projections" have been spectacularly wrong.
0.745ºC is nowhere near the IPCC "projection" of 0.85ºC for 2015
2015 was reported at 0.87ºC, hardly 'spectacularly wrong'.

Its a typical moviefan post, lie after lie.

This is the work that moviefan thinks is 'spectacularly wrong'.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
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Anthropogenic climate change alarmism significantly increases centralized political power and control. Sadly they are for the most part confused and misguided sympathizers.
So you think Suzuki and Gore are out to rule the world?
And not Exxon, the Seven Sisters and the Koch bros et al?

Some people....
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
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so what caused the medieval warming period?
The medieval warming period was largely a local event, with larger changes in the Northern Hemisphere and a smaller change globally. There was higher solar radiation and lesser volcanic action, the two largest of the 'natural variation forcings', which lead to a slight increase. We are experiencing much higher changes now with lower solar radiation and more volcanic action, which should make the planet cooler, instead its been getting much warmer due to man made CO2 releases.

why was the age of the dinosaurs warmer than today?
There was twice as much CO2 in the atmosphere.

why was the period from 8000bc to 1000 BC warmer than today?
It wasn't, as far as I know.

Very high CO2 lead to drastic climate change which lead to mass extinctions. We aren't headed that high, I would hope, but just enough to totally mess with our climate.
 

rhuarc29

Well-known member
Apr 15, 2009
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There is no evidence of that provided.
Of course there is. In Canada, the lowest percentage of people (by a wide margin) believing humans are partly or mainly the cause of climate change can be found in the fossil-fuel powerhouses of Alberta and Saskatchewan, where many are employed in that field or otherwise profit from it (such as through enriched tax coffers). To not draw the correlation there is to be willfully blind. Geographic demographics are hard to dismiss.

One could just as easily say, "Most of the supporters the Global Warming disaster Theory are typical left-wing types who have an agenda to extend the already far-reaching tentacles of government control into further reaches of human activity.
I'm sure the majority of supporters are left-wingers. Keep in mind I am economically Conservative in my views and prefer small government, and yet I still believe we have a social responsibility to the environment. It shouldn't be about special interest groups (aka, people who benefit economically from government decisions), but about macro impacts. This is one area where government should play a role.
 

canada-man

Well-known member
Jun 16, 2007
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Toronto, Ontario
canadianmale.wordpress.com
The medieval warming period was largely a local event, with larger changes in the Northern Hemisphere and a smaller change globally. There was higher solar radiation and lesser volcanic action, the two largest of the 'natural variation forcings', which lead to a slight increase. We are experiencing much higher changes now with lower solar radiation and more volcanic action, which should make the planet cooler, instead its been getting much warmer due to man made CO2 releases.
average global temps where higher during the medieval warming period. and ice ages occurred milllions of years ago when CO2 levels were higher than today

Very high CO2 lead to drastic climate change which lead to mass extinctions. We aren't headed that high, I would hope, but just enough to totally mess with our climate.
0.04% is not a high that's a trace gas
 

Moviefan-2

Court Jester
Oct 17, 2011
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2015 was reported at 0.87ºC, hardly 'spectacularly wrong'.
Too funny. The self-declared expert on science still doesn't know what the word "baseline" means.

Unlike the NASA number you're citing, the HadCRUT4 data uses the same baseline as the one that was used to calculate the CMIP5 average.




And, yes ... I do say that a final temperature anomaly of 0.745ºC for 2015 is less than 0.85ºC. Noticeably so in what was a super El Nino year.
 

Moviefan-2

Court Jester
Oct 17, 2011
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I have a feeling Franky's not going to like this article that appeared in Nature today about a published paper on current temperature trends.

The Nature article is called: Global warming ‘hiatus’ debate flares up again:

http://www.nature.com/news/global-warming-hiatus-debate-flares-up-again-1.19414#/b2

Some select quotes:

“There is this mismatch between what the climate models are producing and what the observations are showing,” says lead author John Fyfe, a climate modeller at the Canadian Centre for Climate Modelling and Analysis in Victoria, British Columbia. “We can’t ignore it.”
Susan Solomon, a climatologist at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology in Cambridge, says that Fyfe’s framework helps to put twenty-first-century trends into perspective, and clearly indicates that the rate of warming slowed down at a time when greenhouse-gas emissions were rising dramatically.

“It’s important to explain that,” Solomon says. “As scientists, we are curious about every bump and wiggle in that curve.”
Interesting side note: Many of the published paper's list of authors are IPCC authors and the list includes known AGW enthusiasts Ben Santer and Michael E. Mann.
 

basketcase

Well-known member
Dec 29, 2005
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A better hypothesis for what?

The Earth's climate has been changing for the past 4.5-billion years. And there is no evidence that anything unusual or unprecedented has occurred in recent times.

Furthermore, the predictions of how man-made emissions would supposedly create unusual changes in temperature have been consistently and spectacularly wrong.

(Oh, and I fixed your quote for you.)
So you keep talking about evidence but refuse to actually follow scientific method. Not a surprise.


Also not surprising is that you continue to stand by your untrue thread title.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
91,523
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average global temps where higher during the medieval warming period
That's wrong. Present day temps are higher.

. and ice ages occurred milllions of years ago when CO2 levels were higher than today
No, CO2 levels were lower during the ice ages and about double when the temp was higher.
You have bad info.



0.04% is not a high that's a trace gas
That doesn't mean it doesn't have major effect. O2 and N2 aren't greenhouse gases, CO2 has a big effect on global temp, not O2 or N2.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
91,523
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Too funny. The self-declared expert on science still doesn't know what the word "baseline" means.

Unlike the NASA number you're citing, the HadCRUT4 data uses the same baseline as the one that was used to calculate the CMIP5 average.
Nope, you are spectacularly wrong, as you are wont to say.
You tried to pull this same bullshit move before, attempting to use the wrong baseline to make false claims.
https://terb.cc/vbulletin/showthrea...e-change-yet&p=5475131&viewfull=1#post5475131

HadCRUT uses a different baseline and you know it.
You are lying again.

And, yes ... I do say that a final temperature anomaly of 0.745ºC for 2015 is less than 0.85ºC. Noticeably so in what was a super El Nino year.
Same bullshit lie, already exposed as bullshit.
https://terb.cc/vbulletin/showthrea...e-change-yet&p=5475131&viewfull=1#post5475131

You need some new lies, these ones are really getting tired.
 

Moviefan-2

Court Jester
Oct 17, 2011
10,489
171
63
HadCRUT uses a different baseline and you know it.
Exactly. And as your own graph showed, the 0.85ºC prediction is based on the HadCRUT4 baseline -- not the NASA baseline.

If you actually knew what you were talking about, you would realize you have just called yourself a liar.




And, yes ... I continue to say that a final temperature anomaly of 0.745ºC for 2015 is less than 0.85ºC.
 

Moviefan-2

Court Jester
Oct 17, 2011
10,489
171
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To the surprise of no one, neither Frankfooter nor Basketcase responded to the latest published paper -- by some of their favourite climate researchers -- confirming that the observed temperatures are nowhere near what was predicted.

I'll repeat my post again. Maybe one of the two self-declared experts on "the science" will actually acknowledge that their own researchers are confirming what I have been saying all along.

This is the article that in the Feb. 24, 2016 edition of Nature, about a published paper on current temperature trends.

The Nature article is called: Global warming ‘hiatus’ debate flares up again:

http://www.nature.com/news/global-warming-hiatus-debate-flares-up-again-1.19414#/b2

Some select quotes:

“There is this mismatch between what the climate models are producing and what the observations are showing,” says lead author John Fyfe, a climate modeller at the Canadian Centre for Climate Modelling and Analysis in Victoria, British Columbia. “We can’t ignore it.”
Susan Solomon, a climatologist at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology in Cambridge, says that Fyfe’s framework helps to put twenty-first-century trends into perspective, and clearly indicates that the rate of warming slowed down at a time when greenhouse-gas emissions were rising dramatically.

“It’s important to explain that,” Solomon says. “As scientists, we are curious about every bump and wiggle in that curve.”
Interesting side note: Many of the published paper's list of authors are IPCC authors and the list includes known AGW enthusiasts Ben Santer and Michael E. Mann.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
91,523
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Exactly. And as your own graph showed, the 0.85ºC prediction is based on the HadCRUT4 baseline -- not the NASA baseline.
The 0.83ºC temperature we bet on was based on using the NASA baseline dates. Trying to claim it was HadCRUT just shows you lying, yet again.
You've reached the point where you can't even keep your lies straight anymore.
The important thing for me was to reaffirm that the bet was on NASA's numbers. I will keep this post bookmarked in case you try to weasel out of the bet in January.
If you actually knew what you were talking about, you would realize you have just called yourself a liar.
We went over this before, you were the one who was caught making basic mistakes. You didn't even know what the different baselines were, how they work or why you fucked up so much.
https://terb.cc/vbulletin/showthrea...e-change-yet&p=5475131&viewfull=1#post5475131

And, yes ... I continue to say that a final temperature anomaly of 0.745ºC for 2015 is less than 0.85ºC.
OMG!
Its so hard to keep track of which lie you are on. So now you're not trying to change the bet to 0.86ºC, 0.89ºC or 0.76ºC, now you think that NASA reported 0.745ºC as the 2015 anomaly and we bet on 0.85ºC?
Its like wack a mole keeping track of which lie you are on.
https://terb.cc/vbulletin/showthrea...e-change-yet&p=5479787&viewfull=1#post5479787
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
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To the surprise of no one, neither Frankfooter nor Basketcase responded to the latest published paper
That's a paper that claimed that the increase in global temperature slowed a bit, not that it 'paused' or 'stopped'.
You really should read the paper.

Hotwhopper has a good take down of the wattsupwiththat talking points that moviefan is repeating.
If you really need to know, read that.
http://blog.hotwhopper.com/2016/02/global-surface-warming-continues.html
 
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