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Eugenie Bouchard

shack

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I know that Eugenie will be a multiple GS champ before her career is over. The jury is still out on Keys,
The jury is still out Bouchard.
 

Insidious Von

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No argument here. But she's ours and the rest of the world loves her as much as we do.

 

wazup

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She's turning out to be above average and not great, got spanked by Pova, a top 8 player and that's it, no power.

Raonic has way more upside, but he'll get spanked tomorrow too I think.
 

shack

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She's turning out to be above average and not great, got spanked by Pova, a top 8 player and that's it, no power.

Raonic has way more upside, but he'll get spanked tomorrow too I think.
As I said, the jury is still out for her.

Last year I considered Genie to have more upside. Milos looked awkward and not much of an athlete and only able to only go as far as his serve would take him.
At this point I've seen him make great strides in his on court movement, ground strokes, return of serve, winners off the ground, better net game, stamina and amazing composure.
 

mjg1

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She does lack the power to stay with the top players right now. That being said, I would not be surprised if she won a major or two in her career.
 

starzero4

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She does lack the power to stay with the top players right now. That being said, I would not be surprised if she won a major or two in her career.
Power so important in the women's game. Hingis was basically driven away from tennis because the game changed and she was left behind. Take a look at Aga who is a very similar player to Martina Hingis in terms of style - variety of shot, court-craft, very intelligent - can construct points, can anticipate very well, and probably a superior defensive player over Hingis. Yet Hingis won majors and Aga has NOT. Reason is the lack of power. Genie of course plays a different style of game than Aga but the issue to me is the same - power. Genie has good power but not great power. Part of the reason why Genie hugs the baseline and tries to take the ball so early (ala Monica Seles) is because she is trying to compensate for the lack of power. Some of those errors she hit today can also be traced back to her power deficiency. WHen you lack power you need to gamble more, take more risks, hit closer to the lines in order to gain control of a point. But that high risk style also can produce errors. That is also why we have seen in many of Genie's matches in the past (even against lesser opponents) her game can be streaky within matches.

She COULD win a major but I think she would need a draw to open up for her with some upsets. One could argue the only reason she even got to the Wimby final last year was because several things bounced her way - Shazza and Serena were in her section of the draw but she avoided both because Kerber and Cornet bounced them. And then in the semis Simona injured herself and that clearly affected her movement in that match.
 

starzero4

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As I said, the jury is still out for her.

Last year I considered Genie to have more upside. Milos looked awkward and not much of an athlete and only able to only go as far as his serve would take him.
At this point I've seen him make great strides in his on court movement, ground strokes, return of serve, winners off the ground, better net game, stamina and amazing composure.
Under Galo Blanco for a good 2 years I saw literally NOT one iota of improvement from Raonic. Match after match I would see the same issues - % of returns in play was sub-par, quality of the return was sub-par, BH was a problem (so much so that he was running around it way too much ), movement an issue. But under Ljubicic and Piatti we have seen improvements.

The improvements specifically that I have seen are the following
a) Movement - he is moving better and playing better defensively
b) BH - the BH is much improved. As a result Milos trusts the BH more and does not run around it as much. The added benefit of the improved BH is that he is managing his fuel tank better in a match. He runs around the BH to hit the FH LESS now so he is saving fuel and that helps him later in matches.
c) Return of serve - he still has a LOT of work to do in this department but he HAS shown some improvements. Specifically his % of returns in play and BH ret of serve has improved.

The only area that we seem to disagree on is his play up at net.

I have not seen much improvement there. If there has been any improvement I think it is negligible. I see 3 issues specifically with his play up at net

a) His decision-making on what to come in behind is not great. He sometimes comes into net behind an approach shot that is not sufficiently good. Even if he just improves his decision-making on what to come in behind and nothing else that would automatically improve his efficiency up at net.

b) Sometimes he misses makeable volleys

c) Sometimes he doesn't do enough with that 1st volley


As for the stamina - hard to say how much of that is due to improved conditioning (I would imagine some) and how much of that is due to some of the aforementioned changes. Running around the BH LESS & moving forward MORE naturally leads to better fuel efficiency and thus stamina. So that probably has a lot to do with his improved stamina as well.

The problem for Milos though is that while he has made these improvements I still feel like the improvements have not been enough to beat the top dogs in the big matches. Federer still treated Milos like Andy Roddick at Wimbledon last year. Seemed like Fed had so much TIME to set up for his shots and so much SPACE to hit into.
 

Insidious Von

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Shazza eh, it fits.

Maria Sharapova, or as I like to refer to her Maria Regina, was hurt by her growth spurt. Had she stayed the same height she was at when she won Wimbledon she would have 10+ Majors by now. She is finally comfortable with her body and is in the zone, Genie had trouble with her returns.

Genie needs a top quality coach and she needs to transform. I don't know how rigorously tennis looks out for PEDs, that may be one route. She needs more muscle on her frame, her power game is sorely lacking. Mary Pierce was just as svelte when she started out. Then she put on the muscle mass, winning several Majors along the way. Too bad you can't put Genie's court smarts into Sabine Lisicki's body, you'd have an almost unbeatable player.
 

starzero4

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Shazza eh, it fits.

Maria Sharapova, or as I like to refer to her Maria Regina, was hurt by her growth spurt. Had she stayed the same height she was at when she won Wimbledon she would have 10+ Majors by now. She is finally comfortable with her body and is in the zone, Genie had trouble with her returns.

Genie needs a top quality coach and she needs to transform. I don't know how rigorously tennis looks out for PEDs, that may be one route. She needs more muscle on her frame, her power game is sorely lacking. Mary Pierce was just as svelte when she started out. Then she put on the muscle mass, winning several Majors along the way. Too bad you can't put Genie's court smarts into Sabine Lisicki's body, you'd have an almost unbeatable player.
Problem to me is Genie has a firepower deficiency + isn't an ELITE defensive player (though she does move better than people give her credit for not unlike Masha) + lacks variety in her game. Not a good combination. And what many people have overlooked is that Genie had some soft draws and some luck go her way at the majors last year in terms of upsets. Her record against the top players is less than impressive.

I agree that Genie lacks the firepower to compete with the big hitters. Problem is this - cite the case of a player who developed into a power player. Firepower in tennis is not unlike arm-strength for a QB in football - you either got it or you don't. Masha was playing "big babe tennis" (Mary Carillo reference) when she was 17 years old - pop in the tape of the 04 Wimby final when Masha had Serena on the back foot that entire match hitting powerful deep groundies. Madison Keys is as big a hitter on the tour right now and she is YOUNGER than Genie. Matter-of-fact speak with insiders and they will tell you that Maddy already had that firepower when she was 14 years old! Pam Shriver said the other day on the ESPN coverage that power is something you are born with which I totally agree. Sure, you can work on strength and conditioning but any improvement in power IMO will be negligible. Can't think of a single player who lacked power early in their career and then later became a big hitter.

Speaking of Boom Boom Lisicki - a very likeable girl and easy to root for. Just too bad her game seems to be so tailor-made for grass. Her game absolutely comes alive on grass w/ the big serve and fearhand but she rarely has any notable results outside of the grass court season. Basically like a grass-court specialist - not unlike a Tsvetana Pironkova in that respect.
 

starzero4

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I would looooove me some Boom Boom, the type of girl I would marry.

Her game & personality really comes alive @ Wimbledon every year. HEr game is so tailor-made for grass that her results usually spike during the grass court season. Great personality too. Great smile as well. It is too bad we don't get to see much of her personality the rest of the year because she really doesn't make any deep runs at the other tournaments on other surfaces.
 

starzero4

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As I said, the jury is still out for her.

Last year I considered Genie to have more upside. Milos looked awkward and not much of an athlete and only able to only go as far as his serve would take him.
At this point I've seen him make great strides in his on court movement, ground strokes, return of serve, winners off the ground, better net game, stamina and amazing composure.
As we saw tonight Raonic's movement as you said (and as I had agreed earlier) is MUCH improved. There were a couple of points early in that 3rd set in particular where Milos played some SENSATIONAL defense (although he ended up losing both points)

However, a few days ago I had posted that I disagreed on your assessment of his net game and the tape of this QF would serve as one piece of evidence to support my argument. With due respect to Milos it was a ROUGH volleying night for him. He was POOR up at net tonight. Really no other word to describe his performance up at net in this match. Aside from a couple of nice volleys in the opening game of that 3rd set it was a NIGHTMARISH night for him in the front-court Lot of people seem to agree with me in my assessment of Milos up at net - Johnny Mac , P.Mac and others. More often than not I feel like Milos does not perform well up at net. I will say that he did play fairly well up at net in the Brisbane Final versus Fed - HOWEVER his play in the front-court in that match was ABOVE the standard of play I usually see from him up at net. So I would look at the Brisbane Final more as the exception and not the rule.
 

mjg1

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I think Madison Keys has more upside, than Eugenie Bouchard.
 

starzero4

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And the downward spiral continues. She just lost to the diminutive road runner Lauren Davis - a player who doesn't have any big offensive weapons.

I've said it before and I'll say it again Genie lacks weapons and that is gonna be a big problem for her going forward. I hate to say it but she had a lot of bounces go her way last year with the draws.

What was Genie's signature win last year? Have to think about it? I did too. Interesting. No? One would think that a player who reached 2 major semis and a major final we would quickly be able to pick out a signature win or two.

Madison Keys already has a more impressive win on her resume OUTHITTING Kvitova in Melbourne.

Sloane Stephens seems to be back on the uptick again . Coincidentally she is now with Genie's former coach Nick Saviano.
 

Insidious Von

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I'm not buying it starzero4, according to your criteria Lisicki should have won several majors by now.

What's wrong with Genie?

It's not mechanical it's personal, Shazza stole her boyfriend. A Machiavellian move by Sharapova, she messed up the head of she that wants to replace her. Genie is a certified dude magnet, she can't even begin to process that she lost a guy to another girl. Now that she's knocked of pedestal she will benefit in the long run. And it's time for Martina Navratilova to take over her training.
 

starzero4

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I'm not buying it starzero4, according to your criteria Lisicki should have won several majors by now.

What's wrong with Genie?

It's not mechanical it's personal, Shazza stole her boyfriend. A Machiavellian move by Sharapova, she messed up the head of she that wants to replace her. Genie is a certified dude magnet, she can't even begin to process that she lost a guy to another girl. Now that she's knocked of pedestal she will benefit in the long run. And it's time for Martina Navratilova to take over her training.
Can you clarify? Not buying what?

I didn't say having power means you will win. I am saying NOT having power makes it much more difficult to win. Subtle but very important difference. Look at the list of slam winners in women's singles over the last 15 years. The vast majority are big hitters. The ones that aren't (Henin, Schiavone, etc) have a lot of variety. VERY few exceptions to this rule.

Re: Masha's boyfriend

You are gonna have to provide me some info on this. I was not aware that Masha stole Genie's boyfriend. Are you referring to Showtime? I do know that Showtime was linked to Serena and now is Maria's boyfriend. Genie and Dimitrov have never been a couple or dated. I am sure some people will now go online and see pictures of Showtime and Genie together. That was some stuff for the Acapulco tournament - they were not dating. Now let us suppose for the sake of argument that Masha did steal Genie's boyfriend (Showtime). Well Masha has been dating Showtime since 2012. So you are saying Genie was not affected by this last year but suddenly now in 2015 she is affected by Masha being with Showtime? Some sort of delayed reaction? Not logical in my opinion. Masha and Showtime didn't just start dating in 2015. Unless you are referring to somebody other than Showtime. You are gonna have to provide some info on this because I wasn't aware that Masha stole Genie's boyfriend. Either I don't follow tennis enough or haven't been following the tennis gossip closely enough.


Lisicki does have some big weapons but a big serve and FH alone isn't enough to win you slams. Lisiciki's results spike during the grass season every year b/c her game comes alive on grass - it rewards her big weapons and aggressive play and hides her weaknesses. Grass court tennis is about first strike tennis and you play a lot of short points on grass as well.

Take Aga Radwanska for example - lot of variety in her game, high tennis IQ, very good defensive player but has not been able to break through and win a major in part due to her power-quotient. Not a lot of power. There are other factors that have contributed to that too. Aga has come up inexplicably flat in some big matches deep in tournaments (see 2014 AO semi v. Cibulkova). If you recall Pam Shriver was courtside for ESPN during that match and Pammy said she had never seen a match where there was such a big discrepancy in the energy level on either side of the net. But make no mistake the absence of power has also hurt Aga against the bigger hitters.

Ever read Jon Wertheim's mailbag on cnnsi? He even wrote a couple months ago in one of his mailbags that power is the essential weapon in women's tennis these days. You can count me as one of the fans who subscribes to that theory.

A lot of Genie's issues can be traced back to the power deficiency. She has to hug the baseline and take the ball super early. Why? To compensate for the lack of power. Taking the ball super early and hugging the baseline allows her to rob opponents of time but taking the ball that early that consistently can cause timing issues and that is what we are seeing now. Moreover, she hits very close to the lines. Why? Because she doesn't hit nearly as big a ball as Madison Keys. Keys can hit a couple feet inside the lines and play with more margin and still blast the ball past her opponents. So Genie doesn't have as much margin to work with and that can lead to very streaky play. Truth is she benefited from some soft draws at majors last year and upsets (see 2014 Wimbledon). And even with those soft draws she still had to grind out a lot of matches. She wasn't exactly putting on a lot of clinics or beat downs. Also , have you noticed how Genie has had trouble playing against bigger hitters? She lost to Masha, Kvitova and other big hitters last year. And she has a terrible record versus top 10 opponents. Just an overrated player in my opinion . As unpalatable as that may be for Canadians to hear. I have to be fair and call it like I see it. Canadian or not. This is just my opinion.

Also, Genie lacks variety. That is okay if you have power. Power can mask some deficiencies but Genie lacks the power as I stated. Also, Genie is an adequate but not an elite defensive player.

Re: Martina Navratilova

Curious why you think Martina needs to coach Genie. Martina didn't exactly do a great job with Aga. In fact Aga REGRESSED under Martina. If I were to pick a player for Martina to coach I'd pick Taylor Townsend b/c she plays the game more similarly to Martina. Genie's game and Martina's game styles completely different. But like I said there isn't recent evidence to prove Martina is a good coach. Quite the opposite based on the Aga-Martina partnership.

By the way check out this article.... It talks about a lot of the same issues that I have been stating for a long time about Genie.

http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/features/eugenie-bouchards-great-expectations-20150121

Anyway. I respect your opinion but we can agree to disagree. I think the issue is her game and skill set and not boyfriend issues.

By the way Ken Crosina a tennis analyst was on TSN1050 last night with Mike Hogan and Jim Tatti and Croina said Genie lacks power and variety as well. Same things I have been saying for quite a while. I'm in agreement with him.

Here is the link of TENNIS ANALYST Ken Crosina last night from TSN1050 radio. He DOES think the problem is related to her game. Not in her head due to boyfriend issues. http://www.tsn.ca/radio/toronto-105...-stats-to-figure-out-what-went-wrong-1.292488

I just believe that in the modern day women's game you need big offensive weapons and power. Genie lacks big weapons and power. You are a big disadvantage if you don't have these things. In the 90s or before that she might have gotten away with it. Hingis won without power . Hingis played a brand of tennis not dissimilar to Aga Radwanska but the game was different back then. It has evolved and power is very critical. I won't say impossible to win w/o power but its VERY hard to do so. And if you don't you better have a boatload of variety - Genie lacks in that department as well and Ken Crosina would seem to agree with me.
 
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shack

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*0. I wish you would give us more thorough analyses instead of just glossing over things.:wink:

Actually, there is an issue that I've noticed that you haven't addressed. I'll agree with your assessment of her lacking power and variety and as a result not being able to beat top 10 players. But she can't even beat top 50 players anymore, let alone the 1st round loss to a qualifier earlier this year. Do you think that even with her physical shortcomings she is that bad? Could she have played so almost unthinkably over her head last year for most of the season if you feel her results this year are are a true indication of her overall ability? She may not have beat any top 10's but she did beat a lot of good players in a lot of tournaments.

I feel there is more going on here, which IMO are mental/emotional issues.

First of all, she has only known success during her rise as a junior and winning Jr. Wimbledon which led directly into women's rookie of the year and then last year's rise to the top 10. I get the feeling she's never had to deal with adversity and she has no idea how to deal with it now that it's hit her. Her interview after her RG loss showed her to be a beaten person at this point. She has absolutely no belief in herself. Morally defeated. She was always so confident in her interviews last year, that I thought they bordered on cocky. I was actually not liking her personality wise. She is the opposite now. No more mental toughness. Contributing to this, and I'm only speculating here, but I also get the feeling she has led a sheltered, possibly privileged life in which she also has not had to deal with major adversity.

Commercials, interviews, magazine covers, her "army" had a twofold effect. Obviously there is the distraction factor. I also think the adulation contributed her her overinflated sense of self. Once her weaknesses became exposed and her success was not as great, her downward spiral was accelerated. What a shock to her system.

I think she is still an immature young girl who doesn't know how to cope, despite being a professional athlete and hard worker. Remember her giggling about Bieber after that Aussie Open interview?

She may have physical deficiencies but the mental issues are a huge contributor to her Tiger-like demise.

BTW, she's a big enough girl that she should be able to match most other girls power wise. What is the problem there?
 

starzero4

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*0. I wish you would give us more thorough analyses instead of just glossing over things.:wink:

Actually, there is an issue that I've noticed that you haven't addressed. I'll agree with your assessment of her lacking power and variety and as a result not being able to beat top 10 players. But she can't even beat top 50 players anymore, let alone the 1st round loss to a qualifier earlier this year. Do you think that even with her physical shortcomings she is that bad? Could she have played so almost unthinkably over her head last year for most of the season if you feel her results this year are are a true indication of her overall ability? She may not have beat any top 10's but she did beat a lot of good players in a lot of tournaments.

I feel there is more going on here, which IMO are mental/emotional issues.

First of all, she has only known success during her rise as a junior and winning Jr. Wimbledon which led directly into women's rookie of the year and then last year's rise to the top 10. I get the feeling she's never had to deal with adversity and she has no idea how to deal with it now that it's hit her. Her interview after her RG loss showed her to be a beaten person at this point. She has absolutely no belief in herself. Morally defeated. She was always so confident in her interviews last year, that I thought they bordered on cocky. I was actually not liking her personality wise. She is the opposite now. No more mental toughness. Contributing to this, and I'm only speculating here, but I also get the feeling she has led a sheltered, possibly privileged life in which she also has not had to deal with major adversity.

Commercials, interviews, magazine covers, her "army" had a twofold effect. Obviously there is the distraction factor. I also think the adulation contributed her her overinflated sense of self. Once her weaknesses became exposed and her success was not as great, her downward spiral was accelerated. What a shock to her system.

I think she is still an immature young girl who doesn't know how to cope, despite being a professional athlete and hard worker. Remember her giggling about Bieber after that Aussie Open interview?

She may have physical deficiencies but the mental issues are a huge contributor to her Tiger-like demise.

BTW, she's a big enough girl that she should be able to match most other girls power wise. What is the problem there?

Yeah sorry for the "thorough analysis" / long posts. I know it would be better if I kept things brief but I find that hard to do because I want to provide a lot of reasoning for my arguments. Apologies in advance for this post being long too.

You are correct in your assessment that I didn't bring up the subject of mental/emotional issues. I do recognize and acknowledge that there is a mental component to tennis and emotional state can certainly affect play for sure. I won't argue against that. The reason I avoid addressing mental/emotional stuff for the most part is because I feel that for outsiders (i.e fans likes us) there is some guess work involved to analyze that. It is hard (for me anyway) to get inside a player's brain and know for sure whether they are experiencing mental or emotional issues. Is it possible ? Sure. But I tend to just stick to what I can see. Genie lacking firepower and variety isn't so much my opinion as it is observation. I'll let others debate whether she is having mental or emotional issues. That doesn't mean its invalid but I just have never felt like I could know for sure whether a player is having mental or emotional issues. Sometimes there is some guess work involved there and I don't want to guess.

One thing I did not address though before was that players do know her game more now though and we see that in all sports where a player has success early and then the following year the competition now has a scouting report and tape to work with and knows the game of that player more so weaknesses can be attacked better. So I admit maybe that is a contributing factor as well that I probably failed to mention in my original post. Shame on me for that. Because I should have.

In my own defense I do have to state that I NEVER suggested that her results this year are a true reflection of her overall ability. You implied that I suggested that. What I suggested/implied was that her results last year was NOT a true reflection of her overall ability. There is a difference. I just wanted to point that out because I don't want to be misquoted or misinterpreted. Do I think she is such a bad player that she should lose 8 of her last 9 matches and be losing so much early in tournaments? No. But I would argue most players who go deep into 3/4 majors in a single year are MUCH better players than Genie Bouchard. So the true Genie IMO lies somewhere in between. But I will stick to my claim and say that I don't think she is as close to winning a major as her results last year indicated. And I think there are other young talented (and less hyped) players who will win majors before she does (such as Keys, and if Townsend improves her fitness which she most likely will she definitely can win majors - multiple majors).

I don't disagree that off court distractions and perhaps the coaching change are contributing factors. It does take time for a player to adjust to a new coach. If you recall Milos wrote an article for cnnsi last year and he talked about how it can take 6-8 months for a player to sort of reap the benefits of a new coach. But I do think her results last year were NOT a true reflection of the player that she is. I get that the nature of tennis is you play who you play but consider the fact that this is a player that made 3 very deep runs at majors last year and we are hard pressed to think of a true signature win. The win over Ana at the AO? That was a signature win in name only IMO. Reason - AI was playing the tennis of her life in the 2 previous rounds v. Stosur & Serena - YES the tennis of her life , even better than the tennis she played en route to her 2008 French Open title. Don't take my word for it - BG & Chrissie said the same thing. The FH was as good as ever (Graf-like) and I can't recall anybody taking Serena's 1st serve INSIDE The baseline for winners like Ana did in that match. It was AMAZING how Ana was returning serve versus Serena who has the best serve in the history of the women's game. Genie beat Ana in the QF but Ana probably felt the pressure of being the favorite in that match and sometimes you can have a let down after some big wins and Ana did not play anywhere near the level she had played in the 2 previous rounds when she played Genie. Had she done so she would have wiped out Genie 2 and 2 probably. So not to take anything away from Genie but to me that win had as much to do with Ana having a bit of a let down after 2 big wins. The win over Halep at Wimbledon - well Halep did roll her ankle during that match and was NOT the same player after. Don't have to take my word for it - Darren "Killer" Cahill said it. She had a very dramatic win over CSN (an accomplished dirt-baller ) @ RG last year where she made huge comebacks in the 1st and 3rd set and while it was a dramatic win I'm not sure I would call a win over CSN a signature win (although I grant you she is a pretty good clay court player and is one of my dark horses in this year's tournament). Genie had some soft draws at majors last year, benefited from some upsets in the draw and again her record versus top 10 players is TERRIBLE. Look at Madison Keys as a comparison - she is a year younger and already has a better signature win on her resume. Keys not only beat Kvitova at the AO she OUTHIT her. So its not just that Keys has a win over Kvitova it was how the match played out. I watched that match and Keys absolutely OUTHIT Kvitova who is one of the biggest hitters of the ball. And then in the semifinal Maddy more than held her own against Serena and MATCHED Serena's power. There is just a MASSIVE chasm in power-differential between Genie and Madison. She had Serena on the back foot in that match quite a bit. Genie does not have a single win on her resume more impressive than that Keys win over Kvitova. And a signature win is not just in terms of the name you beat but also how you play in that victory. Madison was balling in the Kvitova match at the AO and was balling against Serena too. Serena is arguably the best player in women's history and had to summon up her best tennis to beat Maddy. So yes Genie made it deep at majors last year but I think the soft draws, upsets helped her in that regard and to me there was an absence of big signature wins.

As for your question about her power-quotient. Here is my answer and this is just my opinion - I liken the power-quotient in tennis to arm-strength or vision for a QB. It is something you either got or you don't. Those that have it came out the womb with it. Cite the case of a player that DEVELOPED into a power player as they matured. I cannot think of a single one. So power is something you are born with. It cannot be taught. So I don't think Genie will develop more power than she already has. Not tangibly anyway. Maddy was hitting a HUGE ball at 14 years old. And she hits as big a ball as anybody on the tour right now and she is a year younger than Genie. Masha was hitting a big ball at 17 years old - check the tape of the 04 Wimby Final when she had Serena on the back foot for much of that match. Just like QBs - Joe Flacco always had a rocket launcher for an arm. Matt Ryan's arm strength has always been average at best. Hell Rodney Harrison said Matty ICe has a weak arm and I am not going to argue with him. Ryan's deep ball does hang in the hair some and he doesn't have the zip on his throws that the big arm QBs have. The only answer I can give to your question is I'm not necessarily sure that power is a function of size. For example Domi packs a punch and she is tiny. She probably hits a bigger ball than some girls that are bigger than her. I'm not necessarily sure that there is a linear relationship between size and power. To use a football analogy Mike Vick is a small QB but has one of the biggest arms in the league - could probably throw it 60-70 yards off his back foot. Matt Ryan is a bigger guy but his arm strength is average at best and calling it average may even be kind to him. His deep ball hangs in the air and he isn't exactly throwing Colin Kaepernick 95mph fastballs.

I do think you make a good point about having to deal with adversity. A fair point and I admit I had not really considered and overlooked. I can't dismiss that as a factor in her poor results this year. Certainly a possibility.

Look, it is definitely a combination of factors at work. I'm not suggesting that any of your points are invalid. I can't summarily dismiss any of your points. But I personally tend to think its MORE her game than the other factors. Part of that too is because like I said I have a hard time evaluating the mental/emotional component because really only Genie and the people around her in her camp know whats going on with her in those regards. As fans we can only speculate and make educated guesses. I just like to go with what I observe so that is why I was sort of sticking to the issues with her game.

I honestly believe though that a player like Keys will win MULTIPLE slams before Genie even wins a single one. I could be wrong. But that is what I think. Wouldn't even surprise me if Taylor Townsend won a major before Genie. I just think those young players have higher ceilings. In fact of all the young players on the tour right now I think Keys might have the highest ceiling. THat girl has weapons of mass destruction. And I have seen improvements in her game this year under Davenport. She is doing a better job playing with more margin now and constructing points. Also her defense has improved from last year - definitely getting to balls this year that she wasn't getting to last year.
 
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thailover

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Jan 4, 2012
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what wrong with Genie?
the same thing that is wrong with Milos--fame gone to their heads(enjoy the cult of personality too much) and forgot what got them their in the 1st place--hard work
they have gotten spoiled and lazy
IMHO it is true Milos was going to have a tougher time to win majors with joker,roger,nadal & murray out there still playing top notch tennis,but Genie should have an easier road to bring canada's 1st major single title because the women's field is weak in comparison
wasted talent is a bigger shame than having no talent and both of them are wasting their talents
at least for us maybe by 27 Genie will be an SP in montreal---hahaha
 

shack

Nitpicker Extraordinaire
Oct 2, 2001
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what wrong with Genie?
the same thing that is wrong with Milos--fame gone to their heads
The only place fame went is to Milos' foot.

He has been a consummate, dedicated, hard working pro who has done all he could to overcome his lack of natural athleticism and is still improving and rising in the rankings.

I don't see any validity in your comparison.
 
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