Bibi Wins, Two State Solution Dies?

[Moviefan-2]

As Obama stated:
"Afterwards, he (Netanyahu) pointed out that he didn't say 'never,' but that there would be a series of conditions in which a Palestinian state could potentially be created," Obama said. "But, of course, the conditions were such that they would be impossible to meet any time soon."

You are also adding conditions that make it impossible to establish a two state solution, just as Netanyahu does.
That is not supporting the two state solution.

Apparently, Obama (and Frankfooter, by the sounds of it) thinks it's unreasonable to ask the Palestinians to put an end to their Jew hatred.

What's scarier is Obama's suggestion that he thinks he can impose peace in the Middle East by royal decree.

 

[fuji]

As Obama stated:
"Afterwards, he (Netanyahu) pointed out that he didn't say 'never,' but that there would be a series of conditions in which a Palestinian state could potentially be created," Obama said. "But, of course, the conditions were such that they would be impossible to meet any time soon."

Which totally contradicts your blatant lie that Netanyahu doesn't support a Palestinian state. He does, but under conditions that will be impossible to meet anytime soon.

That is both a correct statement of Netanyahu's beliefs, and also an accurate statement about the present situation. Netanyahu is right: it is not currently possible to create a Palestinian state. His conditions are not only reasonable, they are obviously right.

No Palestinian state can be created while Hamas exists as a popular armed militia hell bent on killing Jews. No one state is possible for the exact same reason.

It is just accurate to say that.

Clearly it will take significant change by the Palestinians to create the conditions for a state, change that seems unlikely to occur anytime in the next ten years.

Netanyahu is absolutely right.

 

[basketcase]

Obviously a Palestinian state cannot be established while Hamas exists. If in future Hamas does not exist then certainly he supports a Palestinian state, and today he can work towards that goal.

Hamas can exist. They just need to give up their stated goal of destroying Israel and removing Jews from the middle east.

 

[fuji]

Hamas can exist. They just need to give up their stated goal of destroying Israel and removing Jews from the middle east.

And disarm. Sure. Otherwise they become the Hezbollah of Palestine. Hamas is unlikely to do any of those things anytime soon.

 

[Frankfooter]

Which totally contradicts your blatant lie that Netanyahu doesn't support a Palestinian state. He does, but under conditions that will be impossible to meet [anytime soon].

Note that anytime soon is possibly in 20 or 30 years, mostly likely when Netanyahu is dead according to your previous claims.
That is still the time frame you are referring to, isn't it?
You deleted that post but you haven't suggested any other time frame.


Now as for this accusation that I lied by saying that Netanyahu doesn't support a Palestinian state.
This is your quote:

Netanyahu was elected on a promise not to establish a Palestinian state while he was in office.

That single action will do more to not support the two state solution then any possible action when he is out of office, retired or dead.
Netanyahu's claim is worthless in his refusal to retract this statement.

As Obama said.
"Netanyahu, in the election run-up, stated that a Palestinian state would not occur while he was prime minister," Obama said. "And I took him at his word that that's what he meant.

Netanyahu's pre-election promise has single handedly killed all hope for the two state solution as long as Netanyahu is in power.
That is very much not supporting the two state solution.

You still owe me an apology for accusing me of lying.

 

[fuji]

Note that anytime soon is possibly in 20 or 30 years,

Certainly. How long do you think it will take the Palestinians to rid themselves of violent, antisemitic militias? Do you disagree with the observation that it will likely take at least that long?

That single action will do more to not support the two state solution then any possible action when he is out of office, retired or dead.

Clearly given the length of time the Palestinians will need to create the conditions for a state it will be another PM working with them by the time they are ready.

Netanyahu's pre-election promise has single handedly killed all hope for the two state solution as long as Netanyahu is in power.

All he has killed is Hamastan. A free and peaceful Palestinian state isn't possible. For statement is like blaming Newton for gravity.

You are confusing observing that something is not possible with opposing it.

 

[Frankfooter]

Certainly. How long do you think it will take the Palestinians to rid themselves of violent, antisemitic militias? Do you disagree with the observation that it will likely take at least that long? .

No.
You talk like a racist spouting only stereotypes.

Now that we've agreed that your form of support is for a Palestinian state when _______ (insert impossible condition here) happens.
In other words, its lip service.
You don't want a Palestinian state since you have a racist view that Palestinians are all 'violent anti-semites'.

Clearly you don't support the two state solution.

 

[basketcase]

Note that anytime soon is possibly in 20 or 30 years,....

Are you talking about when Hamas etc. will renounce violence and decide to accept peaceful coexistence?

 

[basketcase]

No.
You talk like a racist spouting only stereotypes.
...

Sorry but when the last elected Palestinian legislature campaigned on a promise of destroying Israel and eliminating the Jewish presence from the middle east it is government policy, not a stereotype.

Now that we've agreed that your form of support is for a Palestinian state when _______ (insert impossible condition here) happens.

Are you saying Hamas renouncing their genocidal aims is an impossible condition?

 

[Frankfooter]

Are you talking about when Hamas etc. will renounce violence and decide to accept peaceful coexistence?

Those were the dates fuji talked about, before he deleted his post in embarrassment.
I see you also have impossible conditions, yours being all Palestinians must renounce Hamas and violence?
Your support also reads like fuji's.
Basketcase supports the two state solution once hell freezes over, or something along those lines?

Netanyahu was elected on a promise not to establish a Palestinian state while he was in office.

As Obama said.
"Afterwards, he (Netanyahu) pointed out that he didn't say 'never,' but that there would be a series of conditions in which a Palestinian state could potentially be created," Obama said. "But, of course, the conditions were such that they would be impossible to meet any time soon."

 

[fuji]

No.
You talk like a racist spouting only stereotypes.

Now that we've agreed that your form of support is for a Palestinian state when _______ (insert impossible condition here) happens.
In other words, its lip service.
You don't want a Palestinian state since you have a racist view that Palestinians are all 'violent anti-semites'.

Clearly you don't support the two state solution.

You rambled a lot in this post but you never actually addressed the point that a Palestinian state is currently IMPOSSIBLE due to the presence of Hamas and other violent militias, and that it isn't likely Hamas will disappear before the end of Netanyahu's term.

You lied, and now you are trying to cover up your lie and avoid the substantive issue by throwing up a big bluster of sand.

 

[fuji]

I see you also have impossible conditions, yours being all Palestinians must renounce Hamas and violence?

And here you reveal yourself to be a supporter of terrorism and atrocity.

It is according to you "impossible" for the Palestinians to renounce Hamas and violence.

Ponder that.

 

[fuji]

Those were the dates fuji talked about, before he deleted his post in embarrassment.

20 or 30 years seems to me like a good estimate for how long it might take the Palestinian people to rid themselves of terrorists like Hamas, an obvious condition for any hope of a Palestinian state or really any sort of resolution to the conflict.

But of course you feel it is impossible for the Palestinians to renounce violence, so perhaps you feel that isn't long enough.

 

[fuji]

As Obama said.
"Afterwards, he (Netanyahu) pointed out that he didn't say 'never,' but that there would be a series of conditions in which a Palestinian state could potentially be created," Obama said. "But, of course, the conditions were such that they would be impossible to meet any time soon."

I think we are all agreed, Obama's quote is good, that is a true and accurate statement. It is indeed impossible to create a Palestinian state anytime soon.

I hope that Netanyahu uses his time in office to work on the elimination of terrorists to help take at least a step towards the conditions for a Palestinian state.

 

[Frankfooter]

Its time to sum up this 'debate'.
Your claim:

Nope, you are a blatant liar. You continue to lie and say that Netanyahu opposes a Palestinian state. He clearly supports one and is the only politician actually discussing the problems that make one impossible right now.

Your defence:

Netanyahu was elected on a promise not to establish a Palestinian state while he was in office.

It is indeed impossible to create a Palestinian state anytime soon.

20 or 30 years seems to me like a good estimate for how long it might take

And your recipe to peace:

I hope that Netanyahu uses his time in office to work on the elimination of terrorists

Now lets be clear here, you are supporting killing all Palestinians who resist the occupation, or are militants, correct?
This sounds a lot like what you described as extrajudicial killing in another thread:

You are worse, you are a cancerous rot within our democracy itself, a treasonous fifth column that pretends to support our system when in reality you are anathema. You hate what we stand for, you despise our fair and open courts, our rule of law, our democratic freedoms.

That is the debate to this day.
Its time for you to apologize for calling me a liar.

 

[fuji]

You continue to blatantly lie and claim that a promise not to create a Palestinian state in the next few years means he is opposed to one when conditions change after that.

You are a pathetic, lying clown.

 

[fuji]

Now lets be clear here, you are supporting killing all Palestinians who resist the occupation, or are militants, correct?

Nope. More of your blatant lying. I said nothing like that, you are a fucking liar.

I said a Palestinian state was not possible due to the presence of Hamas and other militias dedicated to the killing of Jews. I said eliminating Hamas would be a step towards a state. Hamas are terrorists dedicated to ethnic violence, they are not "all Palestinians who resist the occupation".

 

[Frankfooter]

You continue to blatantly lie and claim that a promise not to create a Palestinian state in the next few years means he is opposed to one when conditions change after that.

You are a pathetic, lying clown.

As Obama said:
"Netanyahu, in the election run-up, stated that a Palestinian state would not occur while he was prime minister," Obama said. "And I took him at his word that that's what he meant.
"Afterwards, he (Netanyahu) pointed out that he didn't say 'never,' but that there would be a series of conditions in which a Palestinian state could potentially be created," Obama said. "But, of course, the conditions were such that they would be impossible to meet any time soon."

Are you calling Obama a 'blatant liar' and 'pathetic, lying clown' as well?

 

[fuji]

Obama has not lied. You have lied.

Obama has noted correctly that Netanyahu supports a Palestinian state but does not think it will be possible for many years.

Unlike Obama you have lied and said Netanyahu does not support a Palestinian state.

I agree with Obama, but you are a fucking liar. You are also a supporter of terrorism and atrocity, you reprehensibly equated Hamas with any Palestinian opposed to the occupation, a disgusting justification of racist aggression.

 

[Frankfooter]

Obama has not lied. You have lied.

Obama has noted correctly that Netanyahu supports a Palestinian state but does not think it will be possible for many years.

Unlike Obama you have lied and said Netanyahu does not support a Palestinian state.

I agree with Obama, but you are a fucking liar. You are also a supporter of terrorism and atrocity, you reprehensibly equated Hamas with any Palestinian opposed to the occupation, a disgusting justification of racist aggression.

You are mischaracterizing Obama and the US's position.
“We will be watching very closely to see what happens after a new government is formed on this issue of working toward two states living side by side in peace and security,” Undersecretary of State for Political Affairs Wendy Sherman told a gathering of Reform Jewish leaders near Washington, DC on Monday.

“If the new Israeli government is seen as stepping back from its commitment to a two-state solution — something that all of you, and a vast majority of American Jews, support — that makes our jobs in the international arena a lot tougher because our ability to push back on efforts to internationalize… Israeli-Palestinian issues has depended on our insistence that the best course in achieving a two-state solution is through direct negotiations between the parties,” she said.


“Steps that the United States has taken at the United Nations have been predicated on this idea that the two-state solution is the best outcome,” White House Spokesman Josh Earnest said a day after the Israeli election. “Now our ally in these talks has said that they are no longer committed to that solution. That means that we need to reevaluate our position in this matter, and that is what we will do, moving forward.”
http://www.timesofisrael.com/top-us-official-intimates-un-veto-policy-could-change/


You really need to apologize.