Toronto Passions

Oskar Pistorius, I don't get it

danmand

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Nov 28, 2003
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1. No women gets out of bed, gets dressed and locks herself into the bathroom, if nothing else is going on.

2. No sane person stands outside a door to a bathroom and shoots through the door without knowing who/what is inside.

3. neither 1 or 2 are explained by "South Africa"
 

AK-47

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Mar 6, 2009
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In the 6
Apparently Oscar had discharged a gun in a crowded restaurant before when he was drinking with his buddies.

This guy had major anger issues I think. He probably got into a huge fight with her, and wanted to fire some warning shots or something, and then he hit her by accident. Either that or he really meant to kill her.

I'm not buying the burglar theory, sorry
 

shack

Nitpicker Extraordinaire
Oct 2, 2001
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The difference between what one hears in the courtroom, or even more so learns when involved in a case, and what one reads in even the best of newspapers is staggering.
In this case there should be no difference as it is being televised live.
 

fuji

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The very first thing (which almost certainly applies to all of us) is that I don't know nearly enough about the facts of the case to truly comment intelligently. The difference between what one hears in the courtroom, or even more so learns when involved in a case, and what one reads in even the best of newspapers is staggering.
We know that he has admitted shooting her through a locked door. I mean, we always heard that, but he has now openly admitted that himself on the stand.

To me that is a confession of second degree murder, at least. The trial should in any reasonable country now narrow in on whether it was a crime of passion or premeditated, and honestly I would buy that it was a fit of rage and not premeditated.
 

Aardvark154

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Jan 19, 2006
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In this case there should be no difference as it is being televised live.
I'm not looking at it live on television nor listening to it on the radio.

Furthermore, at least in Toronto the court comes into session at about 1:30 a.m. and concludes for the day at about 9:30 a.m. - - Six hour time difference this time of the year before daylight time it was 12:30 a.m. to about 8:30 a.m.
 

needinit

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Jan 19, 2004
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In general living in South Africa is different - I was on a conference call once (a while ago) with someone in their car - he had to hold the line for a minute or two while he ran a red light as he was concerned he was about to be stopped in a bad part of town - this was mid nineties, but it was normal for him...I don't think Pretorious is innocent, but laws are a little different over there
 

elephant_jun

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Aug 2, 2012
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In general living in South Africa is different - I was on a conference call once (a while ago) with someone in their car - he had to hold the line for a minute or two while he ran a red light as he was concerned he was about to be stopped in a bad part of town - this was mid nineties, but it was normal for him...I don't think Pretorious is innocent, but laws are a little different over there
Yah my high school buddy always told me his burglary stories from SA how 4-5 guys stormed into the house with ak47s when they had two armed securities. They had it happened twice to them and came to Canada.
 

fuji

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Nothing about it being in south africa changes the fact that the door was not only closed, but actually locked.
 

Aardvark154

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We know that he has admitted shooting her through a locked door. I mean, we always heard that, but he has now openly admitted that himself on the stand.

To me that is a confession of second degree murder, at least. The trial should in any reasonable country now narrow in on whether it was a crime of passion or premeditated, and honestly I would buy that it was a fit of rage and not premeditated.
Yes, to the first part of the above, however, one then applies potential defences. To start with but one: it was in my house in the middle of the night (that this is not a good defence in Canada does not mean that it is not in other Common Law jurisdictions. The prosecution then attempts to rebut that defence.

As to the second part of the above, that indeed goes to Murder or Manslaughter.
 

fuji

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And are you claiming that a similar trial in a so-called "reasonable country" would by now have been abridged only to determination of degree of guilt?
Yes, that is what I am saying. Unless his lawyers are nuts they believe he can say "I shot someone through a locked door" and expect that to be a defense rather than a confession.
 

IM469

Well-known member
Jul 5, 2012
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To start with but one: it was in my house in the middle of the night (that this is not a good defence in Canada does not mean that it is not in other Common Law jurisdictions.
I'm not aware of any jurisdictions in which murder is allowed if committed in your own home. I was listening to today's cross examination from the 'pit bull' prosecutor. He is poking a holes in Pistorius's statements suggesting that he didn't know who was in bathroom. Pistorius maintains that he went towards the bed to get his gun, talked to the victim without making eye contact (thus not realizing she wasn't in the bed). He did not ask 'did you hear that ?' or look to see if she was okay. This was totally opposite an incident with a previous gf when his dog knocked over something in the living room and he woke her up before checking out the problem. As the prosecutor suggests - who wouldn't take even a second to glance at the girl in the bed or solicit a response to confirm a conversation - particularly if there was a real danger ?

It was already proven that the victim was standing behind the locked door before the first shots were fired. Pistorius said that he was shouting at his girlfriend to call the police before he fired - yet she did not respond while standing behind the locked door in front of him ? After the first shot hit her hip crumpling her to the floor - at first Pistorius said that she did not scream or make a noise - when pressed - Pistorius said the ringing in his ears from the gunshot would have prevented him from hearing screams. The prosecutor told him the neighbours heard the screams - Pistorius said they were mistaken - she did not scream. The prosecutor reminded him that he just said he couldn't her anything so how does he know she didn't scream. The prosecutor suggested that Pistorius is simply continuously changing his testimony to fit the latest facts.

BTW: Pistorius's new 19 yr gf:
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2014/02/28/article-2570334-1BEACBDA00000578-945_306x432.jpg

I doubt a guilty plea will cramp his style. Ted Bundy went the the electric chair with numerous wedding proposals from girls who love bad boys.
 

fun-guy

Executive Senior Member
Jun 29, 2005
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Nothing about it being in south africa changes the fact that the door was not only closed, but actually locked.
Why you didn't know that burglars often close the door and then lock themselves in a room when they're robbing a house for fear the owners might hear/see them and then shoot them? Come on, it's only common sense that when burglars rob houses they lock themselves in so as to make it more difficult to escape and easier to get caught if a home owner wakes up. Sheesh, that's Pistorius' next line of defense.
 

danmand

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Yes, that is what I am saying. Unless his lawyers are nuts they believe he can say "I shot someone through a locked door" and expect that to be a defense rather than a confession.
It is all they have.

Pistorius and his team of lawyers are claiming that the shots fired through the closed door was an "accident". If it was purposeful he shot through the open door it would be minimum manslaughter according to SA law.
 
Ashley Madison
Toronto Escorts