Blue Jays, 2013 edition

[Rockslinger]

In hockey, it is a goal when the puck crosses the goalline.
In football, it is a touchdown when the ball crosses the goalline.
In soccer, it is a goal when the ball crosses the goalline.

In baseball, it may or may not be a home run when the batted ball crosses the fence.

 

[blackrock13]

In hockey, it is a goal when the puck crosses the goalline.
In football, it is a touchdown when the ball crosses the goalline.
In soccer, it is a goal when the ball crosses the goalline.

In baseball, it may or may not be a home run when the batted ball crosses the fence.

If you you touch home plate after touching all three bases, before they touch you it's a run.

Exactly what is your point?

 

[Rockslinger]

If you you touch home plate after touching all three bases, before they touch you it's a run.

Exactly what is your point?

Here is a recent example. A couple of games ago, Bautista hit a ball that clearly went into the stands. Normally that would be a home run BUT the Angels outfielder reached in, over and fell into the stand to catch the ball.

Using a hockey analogy, it is a goal once the puck crosses the goalline even if it is in the goalie's glove.

 

[gcostanza]

Baseball Rule 6.05

A batter is out when—

(a) His fair or foul fly ball (other than a foul tip) is legally caught by a fielder;

“Rule 6.05(a) Comment: A fielder may reach into, but not step into, a dugout to make a catch, and if he holds the ball, the catch shall be allowed. A fielder, in order to make a catch on a foul ball nearing a dugout or other out-of-play area (such as the stands), must have one or both feet on or over the playing surface (including the lip of the dugout) and neither foot on the ground inside the dugout or in any other out-of-play area. Ball is in play, unless the fielder, after making a legal catch, falls into a dugout or other out-of-play area, in which case the ball is dead. Status of runners shall be as described in Rule 7.04.

Seems pretty straightforward to me.

The play in question, Jose Bautista's fly ball to left field, was caught in the field of play, and the fielder, J. B. Shuck fell into the seating area after the catch.
Batter is out. The runner was awarded 2nd base.

 

[Dawgger]

Here is a recent example. A couple of games ago, Bautista hit a ball that clearly went into the stands. Normally that would be a home run BUT the Angels outfielder reached in, over and fell into the stand to catch the ball.

Using a hockey analogy, it is a goal once the puck crosses the goalline even if it is in the goalie's glove.

I hope this isn't going to be another curse thingy. The catch will be on a hi-lite reel for a long time to come. He caught the ball had control and tumbled into the stands while hanging on to the ball. Great catch and an out!
Why would you try to compare the two sports? No similarity!

 

[ZeroSumPlus]

Baseball Rule 6.05

A batter is out when—

(a) His fair or foul fly ball (other than a foul tip) is legally caught by a fielder;

“Rule 6.05(a) Comment: A fielder may reach into, but not step into, a dugout to make a catch, and if he holds the ball, the catch shall be allowed. A fielder, in order to make a catch on a foul ball nearing a dugout or other out-of-play area (such as the stands), must have one or both feet on or over the playing surface (including the lip of the dugout) and neither foot on the ground inside the dugout or in any other out-of-play area. Ball is in play, unless the fielder, after making a legal catch, falls into a dugout or other out-of-play area, in which case the ball is dead. Status of runners shall be as described in Rule 7.04.

Seems pretty straightforward to me.

The play in question, Jose Bautista's fly ball to left field, was caught in the field of play, and the fielder, J. B. Shuck fell into the seating area after the catch.
Batter is out. The runner was awarded 2nd base.

This one didn't seem straightforward at all to me.

Shuck "caught" the ball in mid-air while leaping into the stands.

He then very quickly disappeared behind a low fence...
So quickly that a legal catch had yet to be determined.

At this point, the umpire completely lost sight of the play...
And appeared to rely on the reaction of the fans...
And the way Shuck bounced up... and showboated with the ball.

So a correct call seems impossible... it's just a guess.

This rule needs to change for home runs:

If both the player and the ball have left the playing area = home run...
Anything else is pure guesswork.

 

[gcostanza]

This rule needs to change for home runs:

Yeah, why don't you and Pat Gillick get to work on that.

 

[blackrock13]

I hope this isn't going to be another curse thingy. The catch will be on a hi-lite reel for a long time to come. He caught the ball had control and tumbled into the stands while hanging on to the ball. Great catch and an out!
Why would you try to compare the two sports? No similarity!

http://fansided.com/2013/08/03/j-b-...bautista-of-a-home-run-video/?fb_source=pubv1


Don't hold your breath, he's never been able to grasp this apples and oranges thing.

The next step is for RS to say that the rule is stupid and then go off from there and of course he knows better.

 

[blackrock13]

Yeah, why don't you and Pat Gillick get to work on that.

C/C Sandy Alderson Chair, Sam Bernabe, Rod Carew, Brian Gorman, John McHale Jr., Terry Ryan, John Schuerholz, Bill Stoneman and Joe Torre.

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/official_info/official_rules/foreword.jsp

 

[ZeroSumPlus]

Yeah, why don't you and Pat Gillick get to work on that.

Keep drinking that Koolaid, baby.

 

[gcostanza]

Keep drinking that Koolaid, baby.

Okay honey.

Now, have you heard back from Gillick yet?

 

[Rockslinger]

I know it is unfair to compare a traditional sport like baseball to a progressive sport like hockey or football but I think that baseball should (but won't) adopt the "break the plane" rule. When a ball "breaks the plane" by crossing the fence then it should be ruled a home run even if the fielder leans over the fence to catch the ball and both the ball and fielder end up together in the stand.
Unlike hockey or football, I think baseball changes one rule every 100 years.

 

[blackrock13]

I know it is unfair to compare a traditional sport like baseball to a progressive sport like hockey or football but I think that baseball should (but won't) adopt the "break the plane" rule. When a ball "breaks the plane" by crossing the fence then it should be ruled a home run even if the fielder leans over the fence to catch the ball and both the ball and fielder end up together in the stand.
Unlike hockey or football, I think baseball changes one rule every 100 years.

If you know it,why do it?

Knowing that your last point was pure bafflegab, it took about 30 seconds to prove it.

http://www.baseball-almanac.com/rulechng.shtml

National League / Major League Rule Change TimelineIn Chronological Order
[SIZE=-1]Year[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]Change In Official Major League Rules[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1877[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]Canvas bases 15 inches square were introduced.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Home plate was placed in the angle formed by the intersection of the first and third base lines.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]The hitter was exempted from a time at bat if he walked.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1879[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]Player reserve clause was for the first time put into a contract.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]The number of "called balls" became 9 and all balls were either strikes, balls or fouls.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]The pitcher had to face a batsman before pitching to him.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]A staff of umpires was first introduced.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1880[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]Base on balls was reduced to 8 "called balls."[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]The base runner was out if hit by a batted ball.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]The catcher had to catch the pitch on the fly in order to register and out on a third strike.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1883[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]The "foul bound catch" was abolished and the pitcher could deliver a ball from above his waist.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1884[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]All restrictions on the delivery of a pitcher were removed.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Six "called balls" became a base on balls.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Championships were to be decided on a percentage basis.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1885[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]One portion of the bat could be flat (one side).[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Home base could be made of marble or whitened rubber.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Chest protectors worn by catchers and umpires came into use.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1887[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]The pitcher's box was reduced to 4 feet by 5 1/2 feet.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Calling for high and low pitches was abolished.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Five balls became a base on balls.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Four "called strikes" were adopted for this season only.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Bases on balls were recorded as hits for this season only.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]The batter was awarded first base when hit by a pitch.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Home plate was to be made of rubber only - dropping the marble type and was to be 12 inches square.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Coaches were recognized by the rules for the first time ever.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1888[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]Player reserve clause was written into the contracts of minor leaguers for the first time.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]The base on balls exemption from a time at bat was restored.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]A batsman was credited with a base hit when a runner was hit by his batted ball.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1889[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]Four balls became a base on balls.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]A sacrifice bunt was statistically recognized.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1891[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]Substitutions were permitted at any point in the game.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Large padded mitts were allowed for catchers.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1893[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]Pitching distance increased from 50 feet to 60 feet 6 inches.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]The pitching box was eliminated and a rubber slab 12 inches by 4 inches was substituted.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]The pitcher was required to place his rear foot against the slab.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]The rule exempting a batter from a time at bat on a sacrifice was instituted.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]The rule allowing a flat side to a bat was rescinded and the requirement that the bat be round and wholly of hard wood was substituted.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1894[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]Foul bunts were classified as strikes.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1895[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]Pitching slab was enlarged to 24 inches by 6 inches.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Bats were permitted to be 2 3/4 inches in diameter and not to exceed 42 inches.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Infield-fly rule was adopted.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]A held foul tip was classified as a strike.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1901[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]Catchers were compelled to remain continuously under the bat.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1903[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]Foul strike rule was adopted by the American League.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1904[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]Height of the mound was limited to 15 inches higher than the level of the baselines.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1908[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]Pitchers were prohibited from soiling a new ball.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Shinguards were reintroduced.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]The sacrifice fly rule was adopted.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1910[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]The cork center was added to the official baseball.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1917[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]Earned-run statistics and definitions were added to the rules.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1920[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]All freak deliveries, including the spitball, were outlawed.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]The failure of a preceding runner to touch a base would not affect the status of a succeeding runner.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]The batter was given credit for a home run in the last of the ninth inning if the winning run was on base when the ball was hit out of the field.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]The number of runs batted in were to be included in the official score.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Frivolous ninth-inning uncontested steals in one-sided games were discarded.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1925[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]Pitcher was allowed to use a resin bag.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]The minimum home-run distance was set at 250 feet.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1931[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]Sacrifice fly rule was brought back, this time with a man scoring after the catch only.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Defensive interference was changed from an offense solely by a catcher to one by a fielder as well.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]No fielder could take a position in line with a batter's vision with the deliberate intent to in any way distract the batter.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Regulations referring to a batter contacting his own ball were clarified as was the area of bases awarded a batter when a defensive player threw his glove at a batted or thrown ball or in the case of spectator interference.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1953[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]Players were to remove their gloves from the field (in 1954) when batting and no equipment was to show on the field at any time.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1959[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]Regulations were set up for minimum boundaries for all new parks, 325-400-325 feet.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1968[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]The anti-spitball rule was rewritten and tightened up because of the wave of moistened pitches that floated plateward the prior season.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1969[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]The pitcher's mound was dropped five inches.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]The strike zone was shrunken to the area from the armpits to the top of the batter's knees.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]The save rule was added to the official rules for the first time.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1971[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]All major-league players were ordered to wear protective helmets.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1973[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]The rule on glove size and color was minutely outlined for standardization.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]The American League began using designated hitter for pitchers on an experimental basis.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1974[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]The save rule was rewritten.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Minimum standards for individual championships were outlined.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1975[/SIZE]	[SIZE=-1]The ball was permitted to be covered with cowhide because of the shortage of horses.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Suspension for three days became mandatory if batter were to hit a fair ball with a filled, doctored or flat-surfaced bat.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]The save rule was changed again.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]2008[/SIZE]​	[SIZE=-1]MLB adds limited (home run calls, fair or foul) instant reply to be in effect for all games starting on Friday, August 29th.[/SIZE]

 

[Rockslinger]

[SIZE=-1][/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]2008[/SIZE]​	[SIZE=-1]MLB adds limited (home run calls, fair or foul) instant reply to be in effect for all games starting on Friday, August 29th.[/SIZE]

2067 MLB adds limited instant replay for safe or out calls at 1B and 2B.

2088 MLB adds limited instant replay for safe or out calls at 3B and home plate.

2132 MLB goes to tiebreaker so games don't go 20 innings.

 

[Rockslinger]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Home_run
"As with American football, where a touchdown once required a literal "touch down" of the ball in the end zone but now only requires the "breaking of the [vertical] plane" of the goal line, in baseball the ball need only "break the plane" of the fence in fair territory (unless the ball is caught by a player who is in play, in which case the batter is called out)."

Query: What if the batted ball "breaks the plane" but the outfielder also breaks the plane to catch the ball and then tumbles into the stand?

 

[blackrock13]

2067 MLB adds limited instant replay for safe or out calls at 1B and 2B.

2088 MLB adds limited instant replay for safe or out calls at 3B and home plate.

2132 MLB goes to tiebreaker so games don't go 20 innings.

More magic eight ball fortune telling from RS, irrelevant to the point he was making shit up.

 

[gcostanza]

Query: What if the batted ball "breaks the plane" but the outfielder also breaks the plane to catch the ball and then tumbles into the stand?

This point has been covered already.

 

[blackrock13]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Home_run
"As with American football, where a touchdown once required a literal "touch down" of the ball in the end zone but now only requires the "breaking of the [vertical] plane" of the goal line, in baseball the ball need only "break the plane" of the fence in fair territory (unless the ball is caught by a player who is in play, in which case the batter is called out)."

Query: What if the batted ball "breaks the plane" but the outfielder also breaks the plane to catch the ball and then tumbles into the stand?

Unlike football games, there usually aren't officials anywhere near the outfield walls, especial centre field, to make the breaking the plane call. In football, there are two official within ~25 yards of the ball carrier on either side of the field, with a view down the line to make the call.

 

[gcostanza]

Rockslinger conveniently (or is just so unaware) of how the game of football is played.

Many times a season, players catch a thrown pass where the ball has broken the boundries of the field, is 'out of bounds', yet because the player's feet are inbounds, it is ruled a 'complete pass'.

Would that Rocky disallow those completions?

 

[blackrock13]

Another streak begins with two road wins, fully deserved.