Well I'm fed up with my taxes going up and having ungrateful asshats who complain when we only pay 80% of their bill for them.
Quebec Student Protest
- Thread starter dcbogey
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In this morning's Globe and Mail, columnist Lysiane Gagnon says the unions and the PQ have played a big role in funding and fuelling the protests against the Liberal government:
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...-protesters-fellow-travellers/article2437614/
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...-protesters-fellow-travellers/article2437614/
Canada is losing out in the new world of competition to countries, that has a strategy of educating its people to as high a level as they are capable off. We are living on export of raw materials, that other countries refine into products and sell to us.Well I'm fed up with my taxes going up and having ungrateful asshats who complain when we only pay 80% of their bill for them.
Education should be free to any level based upon merit, with generous living expenses grants for all students that pass their exams. It is just common business sense for a country to develop a highly educated workforce, the ROI is fantastic.
Transforming the Canadian economy will be trickier than simply providing greater access to post-secondary education. To build on a point Jenn mentioned earlier in this thread, there are plenty of people with liberal arts degrees who are working at Starbuck's.Canada is losing out in the new world of competition to countries, that has a strategy of educating its people to as high a level as they are capable off. We are living on export of raw materials, that other countries refine into products and sell to us.
Education should be free to any level based upon merit, with generous living expenses grants for all students that pass their exams. It is just common business sense for a country to develop a highly educated workforce, the ROI is fantastic.
True, you'd have to work with an economic plan for the country that didn't work off selling resources to the cheapest bidder, but involved using them to our advantage to develop our own industries and manufacturing. The opposite of Dutch disease, but this government isn't smart enough to do it.Transforming the Canadian economy will be trickier than simply providing greater access to post-secondary education. To build on a point Jenn mentioned earlier in this thread, there are plenty of people with liberal arts degrees who are working at Starbuck's.
You think the world is changing? Really?Your point of view and your justifications of cost, miss the point.
The fact is people are fed up with costs increasing and getting nothing more in return, infact often getting less. Students just have the wherewithal to protest, and a desire to change the system. Sheeple who work are too scared to protest, because they might loose their job, and they don't have the time, they have to work.
The world is changing JTK, those old norms and ways of thinking are being questioned and disputed around the globe, not just in Montreal.
I don't.
To paraphrase Don Draper (the TV show, not the Terbite), "I hate to break it to you, there is no system. There is no big lie. The Universe is indifferent"
I believe this to be very true. Always has been, always will be.
So many people think that without higher education you are not worthy. I would say that more depends on the character of the individual and the smarts of the individual rather than the amount of higher education. For example, I have two degrees after my name. My boss has high school (ironically in Quebec). He dropped out of the program I have a master's degree in. Yet I work for him. (Though I own the second most shares in the company, he is without a doubt my boss and he can fire me.)
I look at it and I figure that he took a different road than me and he gambled everything he owned and started the company I now work for. He didn't need the master's degree to do it. Maybe if he had the master's degree, he would have ended up far less successful than he is. One can look at any number of high achievers and see the same example. Hunter Harrison (former CEO of CNR had highschool. Made 55 million a year at CN). Bill Gates, Larry Elison, the list goes on and on.
Here's something else to think about......
They should publish the photos of every student in Quebec who is "on strike" on a webpage. That way, future employers could check out potential hires.
How do you think that would work out???
If it's such a "noble cause" - I would think that the so called "students" should be lining up to have their identities posted. No?
After all, the world is changing right?
It is.Education should be free to any level based upon merit, with generous living expenses grants for all students that pass their exams. It is just common business sense for a country to develop a highly educated workforce, the ROI is fantastic.
But you need to apply what you've learned for it to be so.
You see, the "bill" for any education is paid by taxpayers. Taxpayers who continue to reap the benefits of their education now, and are paying the rest of the bill for their education now. Sure, some of their education was paid in advance - a loan, if you will, against their future income. But the bulk of the bill was loaned to them by other taxpayers.
Today's students are relying on "loans" from today's taxpayers, and must pay back those loans through the taxes they will earn in the future.
No matter how you slice it, education is expensive and must be paid for. It's just a question of who is loaning the money to whom, when. And most rational societies have determined that the most efficient way is to have the student account for the loan up front through higher tuition (and higher student loans). It's a system which provides the best incentives for the student to achieve at the highest levels.
The best way to ensure that everybody gets equal access to education is to make education free and provide grants fro living expenses as long as students pass their exams. That way no human potential is wasted. Taxpayers need not worry about paying for educating young people. It is a massive benefit to society, and highly educated people pay more taxes, which will pay for the next generation's education.It is.
But you need to apply what you've learned for it to be so.
You see, the "bill" for any education is paid by taxpayers. Taxpayers who continue to reap the benefits of their education now, and are paying the rest of the bill for their education now. Sure, some of their education was paid in advance - a loan, if you will, against their future income. But the bulk of the bill was loaned to them by other taxpayers.
Today's students are relying on "loans" from today's taxpayers, and must pay back those loans through the taxes they will earn in the future.
No matter how you slice it, education is expensive and must be paid for. It's just a question of who is loaning the money to whom, when. And most rational societies have determined that the most efficient way is to have the student account for the loan up front through higher tuition (and higher student loans). It's a system which provides the best incentives for the student to achieve at the highest levels.
The only negative effect of free education is that the ruling class would lose their advantage ehen it comes to education. However, the ruling class has enough advantages without that, and will dio just fine.
I received an exellent education in Denmark, free to masters level (and I was paid a regular salary as a Ph. D student). In Canada I have had to pay for my children's education. Which I happily did, but not all parents have the ability to pay for a childs law school.
When I die, I am going to show my gratitude to Denmark for educating me by sending a substantial amount of money there.
The Greeks are laughing all the way to the bank. Those stupid gringos lent them $440billion dollars and the Greeks are repaying zero, zilch, na na, nothing, etc.You'd have to be daft to not see the scapegoat that Greece is.
Right up until the Germans get tired of a facade that the Greeks will ever live within their means.....The Greeks are laughing all the way to the bank. Those stupid gringos lent them $440billion dollars and the Greeks are repaying zero, zilch, na na, nothing, etc.
OTB
No, no, the EU must adopt the Canadian model. The rich gives to the poor. Like Alberta gives to Quebec. Greece leaving the EU is as unimaginable as Quebec leaving Canada.Right up until the Germans get tired of a facade that the Greeks will ever live within their means.....
Union involvement and sponsership is no surprise. Sid Ryan must be laughing his head off.In this morning's Globe and Mail, columnist Lysiane Gagnon says the unions and the PQ have played a big role in funding and fuelling the protests against the Liberal government:
But that funding is probably a pittance compared to:Union involvement and sponsership is no surprise. Sid Ryan must be laughing his head off.
kickbacks in Quebec (ongoing investigation)
right wing thinktank funding (hello Manning centre of robocall theory)
oil sands propaganda (who funds ethical oil ads? China and the US)
gazebo kickbacks
and maybe even robocall funding
Its OWS round 2
This takes me back to days of our fixed bayonet and razor wire crowd control training during the War Measures Act. Different times now, but back then the Feds were serious.
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They were not long bayonets, just little pig stickers, but they were intimidating. We were never deployed on campuses but were ready.
Wonder if kwebek coppers are training behind the scenes.
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They were not long bayonets, just little pig stickers, but they were intimidating. We were never deployed on campuses but were ready.
Wonder if kwebek coppers are training behind the scenes.
Might have been the best thing for you....No, no, the EU must adopt the Canadian model. The rich gives to the poor. Like Alberta gives to Quebec. Greece leaving the EU is as unimaginable as Quebec leaving Canada.
Do you think if France had of kept Quebec (instead of Guadaloupe) after the 7 years war (after all, the victorious British said to France, "you can keep Quebec, or you can keep Guadaloupe (France chose Guadaloupe) but not both") that France would not have offered to SELL Quebec to the young United States just as they sold the USA Louisianna??Might have been the best thing for you....
I do.
If France had kept Quebec, France would have sold Quebec to the United States and the Quebecers would be speaking French about as much as they speak French in Louisianna today.
I think you could look to more recent history when you had your chance to nudge them out the door.....Do you think if France had of kept Quebec (instead of Guadaloupe) after the 7 years war (after all, the victorious British said to France, "you can keep Quebec, or you can keep Guadaloupe (France chose Guadaloupe) but not both") that France would not have offered to SELL Quebec to the young United States just as they sold the USA Louisianna??
I do.
If France had kept Quebec, France would have sold Quebec to the United States and the Quebecers would be speaking French about as much as they speak French in Louisianna today.
OTB
No one is suggesting that Greece leave the EU. The question is whether or not they have to leave the Euro zone.No, no, the EU must adopt the Canadian model. The rich gives to the poor. Like Alberta gives to Quebec. Greece leaving the EU is as unimaginable as Quebec leaving Canada.
Feel free to return to Denmark if you feel that it is that much better a place.The best way to ensure that everybody gets equal access to education is to make education free and provide grants fro living expenses as long as students pass their exams. That way no human potential is wasted. Taxpayers need not worry about paying for educating young people. It is a massive benefit to society, and highly educated people pay more taxes, which will pay for the next generation's education.
The only negative effect of free education is that the ruling class would lose their advantage ehen it comes to education. However, the ruling class has enough advantages without that, and will dio just fine.
I received an exellent education in Denmark, free to masters level (and I was paid a regular salary as a Ph. D student). In Canada I have had to pay for my children's education. Which I happily did, but not all parents have the ability to pay for a childs law school.
When I die, I am going to show my gratitude to Denmark for educating me by sending a substantial amount of money there.
Your view of things the state is responsible for is so large as to be terrifying. I don't think it is the responsibility of government to ensure that "no human potential is wasted." That is simply over reaching craziness.
I guess the good news is that there is virtually no chance of your philosophy becoming policy in this country.
I have a liberal arts degree, and I cherish it and think it was valuable. One of the reasons I do is because I paid for it. Myself. And after having seen many students who were quite bright, and would enjoy your free education and living supplement, spend several years bouncing between programs and drinking and smoking their OSAP money...I am inclined to want to make sure these individuals are making an investment in their own education, not simply getting a free ride.
Feel free to return to Denmark if you feel that it is that much better a place.
Your view of things the state is responsible for is so large as to be terrifying. I don't think it is the responsibility of government to ensure that "no human potential is wasted." That is simply over reaching craziness.
I guess the good news is that there is virtually no chance of your philosophy becoming policy in this country.
I have a liberal arts degree, and I cherish it and think it was valuable. One of the reasons I do is because I paid for it. Myself. And after having seen many students who were quite bright, and would enjoy your free education and living supplement, spend several years bouncing between programs and drinking and smoking their OSAP money...I am inclined to want to make sure these individuals are making an investment in their own education, not simply getting a free ride.
I never stated that it is the responsibility of government to ensure that "no human potential is wasted. I posted that it is good business sense for a country to educate every one of its citizens to the highest level possible, based of course on merit. Canada is losing out in the knowledge based world to countries that provides free education.
You are predictably against free education, because it will provide equal opportunities for everyone to reach his or her potential, something the conservative privileged class will fight against tooth and nail.
