Reverie
Ashley Madison

Why Germany Has It So Good -- and Why America Is Going Down the Drain

fuji

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Which is another way to say that Canada is an area, not really a country in the sense of a people.
No, it is to say that Canada has freed itself of the 19th century idea of nationhood that still afflicts European countries. We know here that the concept of country is separate from the concept of ethnic nationality. The European nations are mistaken, and their mistake limits them.
 

blackrock13

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It is possible to dig up an economist who will agree or disagree with any just about anything. I respect that your opinion is different to my own. I would ask that you specify what part of what I said to you disagree with? The idea of self-sufficiency of the nation state? That a majority of Japanese consumers like to buy Japanese cars partly out of a sense of national loyalty? That the fall of the Roman Empire was in part due to outsourcing of food production to North Africa which resulted in enemy forces being able to blockade shipping to cause food shortages? That maintaining U.S. agricultural production is in the national interest? That a country needs a domestic industrial base in the long term to be a superpower?
I think we could bring forward the name of more than one economist that would differ with you. Although somebody has said, put 4 economist in a room and you'll have 5 different viewpoints.

I have sad numerous times the best way to beat the dollar a day producers is to make the best or a unique product and people will buy them. This is where countries like the US and Canada can compete.
 

danmand

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Nov 28, 2003
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Canada allows you to celebrate your difference from other Canadians. We don't try to quash these differences as many do in the US and other countries. Toronto is a perfect example as there is a fair, festival or celebratory parade almost every week. The one thing we all do though is, as citizen, overtly through pledging an allegiance or in more quiet forms, promise to follow the laws of the land.
As long as you are not too different, that is, and as long as immigrants don't behave as if they are full patch canadians.

On terb, which admittedly and fortunately is not representative of canadians, immigrants are required to be eternally thankful to have been allowed into this promised land. They are not allowed to critizise anything canadian, although they are told when they become citizens, that the government expects them to use their knowledge and varied experience in working to improve Canada.
 

Never Compromised

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That is all good for you. However, it takes an extremely selfish (if not asocial) person to say that: "I have good health care, to hell with the ones who cannot afford it"

I go to the US (Mayo clinic) for health care when I cannot get timely service here in Ontario, simply because I can afford it. However, I still argue for the best possible health care for everyone in Ontario and every other place.
Yeah, the simple fact that you run to the Mayo Clinic for prostate problem shows just how deeply committed to the idea of affordable health care you really are. If you truly believed the socialist propaganda you spout at every opportunity, you would be sticking around Ontario for your timely treatment. And if you truly believed the crap you spout, you would be giving away your excess income and capitalist wealth to the less fortunate through a gift the the various levels of government and donations to charitable causes.

The reality is that you are some spoilt child that wants to give away other people's money, but won't lead by example. There is a word in the dictionary that describes you very well. It starts with a "H".
 

danmand

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Yeah, the simple fact that you run to the Mayo Clinic for prostate problem shows just how deeply committed to the idea of affordable health care you really are. If you truly believed the socialist propaganda you spout at every opportunity, you would be sticking around Ontario for your timely treatment. And if you truly believed the crap you spout, you would be giving away your excess income and capitalist wealth to the less fortunate through a gift the the various levels of government and donations to charitable causes.

The reality is that you are some spoilt child that wants to give away other people's money, but won't lead by example. There is a word in the dictionary that describes you very well. It starts with a "H".
Right on, idiot. Continue your nonsense. Nobody is allowed to argue for better conditions for the poor, unless they are poor. Good thing that poor people are allowed to vote for tax cuts for the rich.

Your handle is descriptive of your logic.
 

Never Compromised

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Right on, idiot. Continue your nonsense.

let me repeat: You are an idiot.
I'm an idiot for pointing out that you are a hypocrite, and that at the first chance you get you turn your back on the Canadian health care system and run to the Mayo clinic like a good little Capitalist? I'm an idiot for pointing out that you demand the redistribution of wealth from others, but don't do so freely for yourself?

If you really want to shut me up, do what you preach. Give away your capital and live like one of those you wish to help. Telling the American's how evil their social network is, then running into their arms for health care shows just how deeply committed you are to the drivel you post.
 

danmand

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I'm an idiot for pointing out that you are a hypocrite, and that at the first chance you get you turn your back on the Canadian health care system and run to the Mayo clinic like a good little Capitalist? I'm an idiot for pointing out that you demand the redistribution of wealth from others, but don't do so freely for yourself?
Yes, that is what I said. You are an idiot.
 

Mervyn

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If someone has the money to travel and pay for healthcare elsewhere , then as long as they are paying their taxes, I have no problem with that, in fact they are helping local health care services by not using them and keeping the strain on the local system down.
 
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Never Compromised

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Feb 1, 2006
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If someone has the money to travel and pay for healthcare elsewhere , then as long as they are paying they're taxes, I have no problem with that, in fact they are helping local health care services by not using them and keeping the strain on the local system down.
Quite frankly, that is a very Conservative attitude, and one that I share. And apparently danmand does too, since that is exactly what he has done. But that is not what he wants to be seen as standing for.

I am simply pointing out that danmand does not have the conviction of his beliefs to do as he says. But rather, he acts as conservative as the very people he rales against.
 

danmand

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I am simply pointing out that danmand does not have the conviction of his beliefs to do as he says. But rather, he acts as conservative as the very people he rales against.
Maybe your problem lies in the fact that I am a more successful capitalist than you.
 

irlandais9000

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What a load of garbage. Socilalist love turning out this crap. Just about every statistic in this article can be refuted.

Europe's population- 800 million with 195 fortune 500 companies
U.S. populatin- 300 million with 176 fortune 500 companies
Since liberals don't understand numbers...The U.S. only has 38% as much population yet has 90% as many fortune 500 companies.
WHO is full of crap.....The true measure of healthcare is to compare Caucasians in the U.S. to Europeans. U.S. comes out way ahead.
Confronting Global climate change...who cares?.
More energy efficient...Forced due to higher energy costs.
Unemployment in the U.S. is chronic, but not in Europe?...BS
etc.etc.etc
Many of your points were properly refuted by other posters, so I will focus on one that was not addressed by others.

The original article that you responded to compares the European Union to the US. You then try to refute the article by comparing Europe as a whole (non-EU countries tend to perform not as well economically) to the US, instead of using EU numbers to compare to the US. Tell me again how liberals are the ones who don't understand numbers?
 

james t kirk

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Aug 17, 2001
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I met a guy selling sausages one time in front of Canadian Tire. We got to talking, he was an interesting guy.

He told me that he loved living in Canada. For him, Canada was a paradise. Yes, he was selling his sausages, but he was making a living. I asked him why he loved living in Canada so much and he told me that prior to coming here, he lived in Germany and the Germans, and I quote "treated me like a piece of shit" He told me how at every turn he was a victim of ethnic hatred because he wasn't German. He told me that he couldn't even go to a train station to buy a ticket for a train and the guy selling him the ticket would call him a "dirty pollock" or words to that effect.

Angela Merkel's spout off toda about immigrants would seem to confirm exactly what he told me.

Anyway, he loved Canada because people were nice to him and treated him with proper respect. That made me feel good about my Country and my fellow Canadians.
 

onthebottom

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It is possible to dig up an economist who will agree or disagree with any just about anything. I respect that your opinion is different to my own. I would ask that you specify what part of what I said to you disagree with? The idea of self-sufficiency of the nation state? That a majority of Japanese consumers like to buy Japanese cars partly out of a sense of national loyalty? That the fall of the Roman Empire was in part due to outsourcing of food production to North Africa which resulted in enemy forces being able to blockade shipping to cause food shortages? That maintaining U.S. agricultural production is in the national interest? That a country needs a domestic industrial base in the long term to be a superpower?
OK, since you asked, and at the risk of someone correcting me....

The U.S. isn't going down the drain, but it does need to look at things and maybe change course on some.


I went to those "Japanese Secrets" seminars too lol.

Facebook, YouTube, Apple, and Google are great. In 1985 Apple made its famous "Mac" screen + computer combo in California. Look at the back of a vintage 1985 model and it says "Made in USA". By the 1990's they had moved production to Asia and the "made in USA" no longer was on the back. Now they have started using terms like "designed in USA". It is not enough to design the products in the USA. One needs to make them domestically as well - not just Apple but other companies as well. It builds up a strong lower-middle class of comsumers. The designers were always needed as a middle to upper middle class. The moving the lower-middle class jobs offshore and drastic reduction in domestic manufacturing capacity is dangerous on the global stage and very short-sighted. Yes, it makes for higher pofits for shareholders and lower prices for consumers, but it damages the self-suficency of the nation.
This assumes there is nothing else for the lower middle class to do, clearly this is a case of comparative advantage - where the job is done where it can be done most efficiently. Does it make sense for every country to produce every good, of course not. Sharing the work and doing what you can do better than anyone else is the most efficient system. Take Apple, while I would argue they have a massive strategy and design advantage to other consumer computing companies they don't have a manufacturing advantage, why do a job where you don't have an advantage.

I do agree that as these roles shift this causes displacement and re-alignment that is often painful.

As long as the U.S. continues having the best military in the world and keeps domestic food production, it won't go down the drain IMHO. Keeping domestic food production is a must - look what happened to Rome when they decided to push food production to north Africa.
I think the US focuses too much on food production, certainly we subsidize it too much, raising the costs and discouraging competition from poorer countries where producing food would dramatically increase the standard of living.

The Chinese have a strong sense of the importance of the state's interest as well as the individual interest, as does Japan and Germany. The U.S. once did so as well, but it seems for the past couple of decades to have been more of a "what is good for me and let the state take care of itself". The Japanese aren't flocking to buy foreign-made cars - it is a matter of national pride for most to buy Japanese made cars. The majority of Americans tend to buy the car they like best regardless of where it is designed or manufactured.
I would say the Chinese have a strong sense of what is important to the state and they do just as much as they have to for the individual to avoid social unrest. The currency manipulation is all about allowing the state, not the consumer in China to profit from the export business. I'd say the American decision criteria is more healthy.

I admit I let WWII colour my thoughts a bit - nations up against each other having to survive. Domestic self-suffficency I think is a good think, but it is eroding in many places.
Look at Canada and tell me about self sufficiency, what does Canada produce other than Blackberrys and raw materials for the US? I'm sure Canada can feed itself, it can't defend itself....

OTB
 

onthebottom

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The best banking system in the world.
I could argue that but that isn't a manufactured good so many here won't count it for much.

OTB
 

nottyboi

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May 14, 2008
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OK, since you asked, and at the risk of someone correcting me....



This assumes there is nothing else for the lower middle class to do, clearly this is a case of comparative advantage - where the job is done where it can be done most efficiently. Does it make sense for every country to produce every good, of course not. Sharing the work and doing what you can do better than anyone else is the most efficient system. Take Apple, while I would argue they have a massive strategy and design advantage to other consumer computing companies they don't have a manufacturing advantage, why do a job where you don't have an advantage.

I do agree that as these roles shift this causes displacement and re-alignment that is often painful.



I think the US focuses too much on food production, certainly we subsidize it too much, raising the costs and discouraging competition from poorer countries where producing food would dramatically increase the standard of living.



I would say the Chinese have a strong sense of what is important to the state and they do just as much as they have to for the individual to avoid social unrest. The currency manipulation is all about allowing the state, not the consumer in China to profit from the export business. I'd say the American decision criteria is more healthy.



Look at Canada and tell me about self sufficiency, what does Canada produce other than Blackberrys and raw materials for the US? I'm sure Canada can feed itself, it can't defend itself....

OTB
If we really needed to defend ourselves we could. Canada easily has the capacity to design and manufacture nuclear weapons. If the threat profile changed and we were really worried about our sovereignity, we could have a deliverable nuclear weapon within 6 months to a year. So please don't give me that nonsense about Canada not being able to defend ourselves.
 
Ashley Madison
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