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Attawapiskat, The Conservative Governments Response To This Emergency......

OddSox

Active member
May 3, 2006
3,149
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Ottawa
Not all bands run casinos. I can't think of one isolated community that has one. The Casino money is not shared between communities. In some of these communities it can costs $400,000 to build a bungalow that would cost $100,000 down here. We covered food in a previous thread, but $20 for peanut butter and $12.00 for a dozen eggs is not uncommon.
Attawapiskat 2011 revenue includes about 3.5 million from Casino Rama so it looks like casino money does get shared...

Total revenue for the year was nearly $33 million including $16 million from INAC and $4.5 million from the Province. Expenditures include over $3 million for 'Administration' and $11 million in employee salaries and benefits.

http://www.attawapiskat.org/financial-statements/

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fuji

Banned
Jan 31, 2005
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A classic case of shooting the messenger. The number one issue of our native communities is themselves. Abuse by the band leaders has been well known for decades, and as long as you have the right last name you are in the money.
Actually I think that is the #2 issue. I think the #1 issue is that they have had their traditional way of life criminalized, they've been segregated into isolated communities, prevented from engaging in their historic trading, and denied access to the resources on their own land. Having had all viable means of forming an economy stripped away from them, they've been told that if they leave their communities to find work elsewhere that they will lose their status, and therefore whatever remaining benefits they had once negotiated. So finally, they are dependent on government funding, having had all other options taken away from them by the Indian Act.

I agree that in that context, they have likely poorly managed their funds, and that they could be doing much better if they managed their handouts better.

However that is a clear #2 problem. The clear #1 problem is finding some sort of way for those communities to become self sufficient, and that likely requires an overhaul of the Indian Act.
 

blackrock13

Banned
Jun 6, 2009
40,085
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Attawapiskat 2011 revenue includes about 3.5 million from Casino Rama so it looks like casino money does get shared...

Total revenue for the year was nearly $33 million including $16 million from INAC and $4.5 million from the Province. Expenditures include over $3 million for 'Administration' and $11 million in employee salaries and benefits.

http://www.attawapiskat.org/financial-statements/
Then I stand corrected, but it could boil down to family or tribal connections or they invested for whatever reason during the set up of Rama and get a piece as a result.
 

blackrock13

Banned
Jun 6, 2009
40,085
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why are they sick? should they live on a flood plain?
Illnesses can come from poor diet, mold, and water borne diseases. Living on flood plain doesn't automatically mean disaster, but the initial placement was done by Ottawa and the problem go down hill from there.

Ottawa's latest plan is to house 30 people of the 300 that are in serious troubles in the local healing centre, which has no road access, no working kitchen, no locks on doors, and no running water; another great plan from Duncan's Dummies.
 

wigglee

Well-known member
Oct 13, 2010
10,049
1,887
113
if only there were some taliban up there, Harper and MacKay would be up there getting their hands dirty, takin' care of business!
 

larry

Active member
Oct 19, 2002
2,070
4
38
we have given enough to these deadbeats. they squander it. they don't want to be told what to do. but like lots of others, when things go wrong, they sure have their hand out. chiefs should be in jail. tribal elders should be disgraced. but they want to run their own society. let them. one day perhaps they'll accept the freedom of being a canadian citizen. and work for a living like their ancestors. then they'll begin the long road to acceptance and respect. they haven't started yet maybe a couple more generations.
 

blackrock13

Banned
Jun 6, 2009
40,085
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we have given enough to these deadbeats. they squander it. they don't want to be told what to do. but like lots of others, when things go wrong, they sure have their hand out. chiefs should be in jail. tribal elders should be disgraced. but they want to run their own society. let them. one day perhaps they'll accept the freedom of being a canadian citizen. and work for a living like their ancestors. then they'll begin the long road to acceptance and respect. they haven't started yet maybe a couple more generations.
Having spent time with and actually worked with some of these 'deadbeats' over the past 20 years, you're an idiot. Many work harder and put in longer days doing what they do to make a living than most on this BB.

As far as wanting to run their society, you make it sounds that the Federal government has done a great job.

Some of the reserves in BC's Okanagan Valley, such as the Osoyoos bands are a model of how to run a community, with a quarry, construction company, winery, and a Hotel resort.
 

The Fruity Hare

Well-known member
Dec 4, 2002
5,111
33
48
We were well on the way to fixing many problems, not all, with the signing of the Kelowna Accord in 1996, under the Liberals, but the Conservatives have been in power since then and has basically pushed the KA out the door. Who do we blame? Yes, there's lot of blame to go around over the years, but nothing like taking toe steps forward and then three steps, or more backwards.
The Kelowna Accord was apparently signed in November 2005 as the Liberals were about to lose power. How long had they been in power previous to that without making any concrete advances on this situation? Election promises don`t mean much these days.

The present Conservative government have their share of blame, but don;t make it seem like it is all their fault. This problem has been around for decades, as indicated by the houses having been built inadequately, and there is no way of knowing whether the Liberals would have lived up to their election promises either.



....edit In November 2005, Martin, the premiers and aboriginal leaders met in Kelowna, B.C., for the First Ministers Conference on Aboriginal Affairs. The meeting resulted in a five-year, $5-billion plan to improve the lives of First Nations, Metis and Inuit peoples.

But within days, Martin's minority Liberal government was defeated, triggering an election won by Stephen Harper's Conservatives.
 

blackrock13

Banned
Jun 6, 2009
40,085
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The Kelowna Accord was apparently signed in November 2005 as the Liberals were about to lose power. How long had they been in power previous to that without making any concrete advances on this situation? Election promises don`t mean much these days.

The present Conservative government have their share of blame, but don;t make it seem like it is all their fault. This problem has been around for decades, as indicated by the houses having been built inadequately, and there is no way of knowing whether the Liberals would have lived up to their election promises either.



....edit In November 2005, Martin, the premiers and aboriginal leaders met in Kelowna, B.C., for the First Ministers Conference on Aboriginal Affairs. The meeting resulted in a five-year, $5-billion plan to improve the lives of First Nations, Metis and Inuit peoples.

But within days, Martin's minority Liberal government was defeated, triggering an election won by Stephen Harper's Conservatives.
Yet they did deliver the accord, which is more than the present government has done. Much along the lines of what has gone on in the past is all fine but what have you done lately, besides talk.
 

larry

Active member
Oct 19, 2002
2,070
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"...five-year, $5-billion plan..."
that's the disgrace. how about they just get a job? when do they plan to get off what is effectively welfare? if, as mentioned, some tribes are doing well, i would hope so. if someone gave me billions, i'd be doing well too.
 

blackrock13

Banned
Jun 6, 2009
40,085
1
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"...five-year, $5-billion plan..."
that's the disgrace. how about they just get a job? when do they plan to get off what is effectively welfare? if, as mentioned, some tribes are doing well, i would hope so. if someone gave me billions, i'd be doing well too.
Many do work and very hard. Calling it welfare just shows how ignorant you are about the welfare program and the Indian act.
 

fuji

Banned
Jan 31, 2005
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we have given enough to these deadbeats. they squander it. they don't want to be told what to do.
I agree! Let's rip up those treaties, give them their damn land back, and go back to Europe. See how they like that!
 

ctv250

New member
Jan 1, 2011
434
0
0
"...five-year, $5-billion plan..."
that's the disgrace. how about they just get a job? when do they plan to get off what is effectively welfare? if, as mentioned, some tribes are doing well, i would hope so. if someone gave me billions, i'd be doing well too.
Perhaps we should just stop providing the people of Attawapiskat government money and instead sign over the rights of the DeBeers diamond mine, which is on their land? It's supposed to generate about 6-7 billion over the next 12 years.
 

fuji

Banned
Jan 31, 2005
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how about they just get a job?
This is what I used to think too. Then I found out just how fucked up the Indian Act is. I don't think you fully understand the extent to which the Canadian Federal government has its bureaucratic tentacles into their lives, controlling pretty much every aspect of their existence, and managing it poorly.

You do know that we have literally made it illegal for them to do almost anything that would be remotely profitable in that territory. Worse, we've made it illegal for them to own their homes (which is why they have to ask the government for homes), and we've made it illegal for them to run their traditional businesses, they can't even legally go back to the way of life they had before we got here--we've made that criminal. Then we turn around and tell them to get a job? Check it out. Google "fee simple" and "reserve". You will be shocked--it is law in Canada that they are only allowed to live in government owned homes, and not allowed to buy their own homes. We made that the law. Not the natives. The Parliament of Canada enacted that one.

It is a really fucked up situation. The Indian Act needs to be repealed and replaced with some sort of system that actually gives them a fighting chance of becoming self sufficient.

You strike me as a Conservative sort of person and so you have a mindset that should be able to grasp this: It is just unbelievable the sort of mess that a Federal government can create when it's left to screw with people for 100 years straight without any real outside media supervision or meaningful interest. There is much legislation that needs to be repealed before those people will ever be able to achieve a reasonable standard of living.
 

fuji

Banned
Jan 31, 2005
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Why did they wait until the temps dropped to minus 30 for this zit to fester before they popped it?
It's not clear why this issue has hit the media now, but native communities have been living in those conditions for decades. Google "Davis Inlet".

The only time anything is ever done is when it hits the media. Attawapiskat somehow managed to make themselves newsworthy, but I am guessing the conditions have been this bad for 40+ years, and there are many other communities where conditions are as bad or worse, that are simply not making it into the papers.

That kind of squalor doesn't happen over night.
Does it change your opinion any to learn that they aren't legally allowed to do anything other than ask Ottawa for funding? They are required by law to live in government owned homes...
 

james t kirk

Well-known member
Aug 17, 2001
24,026
3,867
113
The current system clearly does not function.

It is time to completely scrap the Indian Act, including all the tax concessions and other goodies that go with it. The natives should be treated just as any other citizen. The only exception should be education (IMHO). I feel that natives should have their University or College or Apprentiship programs paid for. It's only through giving them the skills to survive will they ever break the cycle that currently imprisons them. The status quo (and that includes throwing more money at it) simply will not make things any better.

One country, one set of laws for everyone.
 

fuji

Banned
Jan 31, 2005
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So James, who gets the mineral rights? It's not like there's a shortage of cash going out of their territory, it's just not going to them.
 

RickC

Member
Feb 10, 2008
62
1
8
Attawapiskat chief urges all first nations to dig in against Ottawa , do we need to send shovels , or people to shovel for them , and who pays for these toys that they all seem to have like A.T.V. and new snow machines ,
 

james t kirk

Well-known member
Aug 17, 2001
24,026
3,867
113
So James, who gets the mineral rights? It's not like there's a shortage of cash going out of their territory, it's just not going to them.
If it's on their land - the natives can have the mineral rights.

Knock yourself out.
 
Ashley Madison
Toronto Escorts