Here's a question for you car experts: I'm thinking about getting a set of wintertires and I'm not sure what kind is right for me. I hear much about the Arctic Alpine and the Blizzak, but was wondering how lesser known and cheaper brands like Walmart Wintermark, Canadian Tire Icetrac, or Cooper Weathermaster compare. I don't want to put too much of a dent into my hobbying budget, but would like to stay safe. I do most of my driving on SW Ontario's backroads and have a fairly conservative driving style in my sedan.
Wintertires
- Thread starter alphaBIT
- Start date
People still buy wintertires ?
Guess it all depends how well your roads are plowed. Radial tires make excellent snow tires. The only time I bought snows was when I lived in Buffalo in the early 80`s, mainly because they don`t know how to keep the streets plowed. Usually saw a plow go down our side street 2 to 3 times a winter ! Upon leaving the city limits, there was no need for them because the suburbs know how to plow snow.
Guess it all depends how well your roads are plowed. Radial tires make excellent snow tires. The only time I bought snows was when I lived in Buffalo in the early 80`s, mainly because they don`t know how to keep the streets plowed. Usually saw a plow go down our side street 2 to 3 times a winter ! Upon leaving the city limits, there was no need for them because the suburbs know how to plow snow.
I would strongly suggest you buy snow/ice tires for the winter. Sure it hasn't necessarily snowed a lot over the past few years but, when it does snow, nothing beats having snow tires. All seasons are not made properly for snow.
Snow/ice tires have a softer rubber compound for better traction in the cold. All-seasons in the cold, are like rock. Snow/ice tires also have different grooves cut in them for better traction in the snow.
IMNSHO buy, four winter/ice tires. Go for the name brands. Michelin, Yokohama, Perelli or Bridgestone. Go to a rim shop and buy four second hand rims. Put the winter tires on those. This way you'll have a set of all-seasons and winter/ice. This helps keep the integrity of the seal of your tires as opposed to constantly changing your tires on the same rims. The reason to buy four tires is because you need to have equal traction all around. Having winter/ice at one end and all-seasons at the other may be cheaper but, it makes for a dangerous set-up for the driving of your car. FWD or RWD doesn't make any difference.
Plus, your winter tires should be a little narrower than what you normally drive with. You can still do this safely within the manufacturers specs. When doing this, let the rim shop know that this is what you want to do. If they're a good shop, they will put on a test set of tires and rims in the front to make sure that your narrower tires will fit properly within your wheel-well. You want to have narrower tires because when there is snow on the ground, you want your tires to cut throuigh the snow and get to the pavement. Wider all-seasons will act like snowshoes and keep you on top of the snow, one of the reasons for snowplaning.
Narrow down about a size of 20 eg. if you have 205 all-seasons, go to 185 for your winter/ice.
Remember, you're not doing performance driving in the winter. These tires are not made for that. They're made for you to be able to have better traction and contact on the pavement in the winter. It may cost you a bit more to buy all four, but, keep in mind that you won't be using these tires all the time. Maybe 4-5 mons/year. They will probaby last you about 4-6 years, depending on the amount of driving.
Hope that helps.
Snow/ice tires have a softer rubber compound for better traction in the cold. All-seasons in the cold, are like rock. Snow/ice tires also have different grooves cut in them for better traction in the snow.
IMNSHO buy, four winter/ice tires. Go for the name brands. Michelin, Yokohama, Perelli or Bridgestone. Go to a rim shop and buy four second hand rims. Put the winter tires on those. This way you'll have a set of all-seasons and winter/ice. This helps keep the integrity of the seal of your tires as opposed to constantly changing your tires on the same rims. The reason to buy four tires is because you need to have equal traction all around. Having winter/ice at one end and all-seasons at the other may be cheaper but, it makes for a dangerous set-up for the driving of your car. FWD or RWD doesn't make any difference.
Plus, your winter tires should be a little narrower than what you normally drive with. You can still do this safely within the manufacturers specs. When doing this, let the rim shop know that this is what you want to do. If they're a good shop, they will put on a test set of tires and rims in the front to make sure that your narrower tires will fit properly within your wheel-well. You want to have narrower tires because when there is snow on the ground, you want your tires to cut throuigh the snow and get to the pavement. Wider all-seasons will act like snowshoes and keep you on top of the snow, one of the reasons for snowplaning.
Narrow down about a size of 20 eg. if you have 205 all-seasons, go to 185 for your winter/ice.
Remember, you're not doing performance driving in the winter. These tires are not made for that. They're made for you to be able to have better traction and contact on the pavement in the winter. It may cost you a bit more to buy all four, but, keep in mind that you won't be using these tires all the time. Maybe 4-5 mons/year. They will probaby last you about 4-6 years, depending on the amount of driving.
Hope that helps.
Good advice oh Wooly one.
I've got a quattro,which are great, but with the Z-rated tires provided with the car, the system is useless. The car slides like crazy, it's was treacherous during Friday's flurry. I've got 4 snows on rims, but didn't think I'd need them this early.
When I bought them last year, I was very surprised to hear that I could (in fact no choice, I had to) buy Z-rated snow tires. I never knew such a beast existed. They performed superbly.
I've got a quattro,which are great, but with the Z-rated tires provided with the car, the system is useless. The car slides like crazy, it's was treacherous during Friday's flurry. I've got 4 snows on rims, but didn't think I'd need them this early.
When I bought them last year, I was very surprised to hear that I could (in fact no choice, I had to) buy Z-rated snow tires. I never knew such a beast existed. They performed superbly.
Winter tires.
I suggest you get 4 name-brand snow tires. Even if you have to spend a little bit of money, IMO they are worth it. You can never have enough traction on wintery roads. If you have a 4wd or a front wheel drive vehicle, its easier to get by with all season tires. For me I drive a rear wheel drive car with 400 hp and equipped with massive 18 inch tires. I have no choice but to get snow tires. I don’t want to take a chance so I usually just follow whatever the dealer recommends.
I suggest you get 4 name-brand snow tires. Even if you have to spend a little bit of money, IMO they are worth it. You can never have enough traction on wintery roads. If you have a 4wd or a front wheel drive vehicle, its easier to get by with all season tires. For me I drive a rear wheel drive car with 400 hp and equipped with massive 18 inch tires. I have no choice but to get snow tires. I don’t want to take a chance so I usually just follow whatever the dealer recommends.
I have had both the Bridgestone Blizzak and the Michelin Arctic Alpin snow tires. The 4 Blizzaks I had worked excellent, I would say you can't go wrong with these tires. They give the best damn grip in deep deep snow, and they do perform good in icy conditions. Worth the money, however I now have a set of 4 Michelin Arctic Alpins because I have a different car now. The Alpins are good too, perhaps slightly lower grip than Blizzacks in deep snow or on ice but they won't wear out as fast as Blizzacks. Alpins also give a smoother and quieter ride that Blizzacks, and perhaps better gas mileage. I have used my Alpins for two yr and I can't see any wear on them. Blizzacks will wear 30% faster in, due to the outer 40% of tread being made from a softer compound so it will grip better. But when it is worn down you will have less traction than an Alpin.
Get 4 rims also, cause when you switch tires from rims every yr the tire gets dammaged (around bead). It happened to me(had low profile tires). Overall, Michelin and Bridgestone make a good tire, main difference being smoother, quiet ride from michelin, and rougher, noiser, faster wear, but slightly better grip with Bridgestone(truck like ride). If you plan on keeping your car for along time buy these brands, with rims, if not, it may be cheeper to pay and have your tires switched, but tire dammage is possible if they are low profile. Hope this helps.
Get 4 rims also, cause when you switch tires from rims every yr the tire gets dammaged (around bead). It happened to me(had low profile tires). Overall, Michelin and Bridgestone make a good tire, main difference being smoother, quiet ride from michelin, and rougher, noiser, faster wear, but slightly better grip with Bridgestone(truck like ride). If you plan on keeping your car for along time buy these brands, with rims, if not, it may be cheeper to pay and have your tires switched, but tire dammage is possible if they are low profile. Hope this helps.
Good advice
Although Atlanta doesnt have this problem, I grew up in upstate NY and went to graduate school in Rochester. At the time I had a 1988 Acura Integra hatchback. I did exactly as Woolly suggested, bought 4 second hand rims and 4 good snow tires (some European brand recommended by Acura via mail order). That little FWD beast would go anywhere, no matter how deep or how slippery.
Different cars, different horsepower/torque, different curb weight, different tire profiles... all affect snow performance. Best to ask a dealer or look up some information on a chat board devoted to your make and model.
Although Atlanta doesnt have this problem, I grew up in upstate NY and went to graduate school in Rochester. At the time I had a 1988 Acura Integra hatchback. I did exactly as Woolly suggested, bought 4 second hand rims and 4 good snow tires (some European brand recommended by Acura via mail order). That little FWD beast would go anywhere, no matter how deep or how slippery.
Different cars, different horsepower/torque, different curb weight, different tire profiles... all affect snow performance. Best to ask a dealer or look up some information on a chat board devoted to your make and model.
It's amazing that we spend so little time and money on the only part of the vehicle that actually touches the road . People spend more on atheletic shoes than they do on their tires ...lol. Don't know about you but my top running speed does not really require
radial technology . Don't think I'd die if I "blew " a shoe .When you consider the costs of running a car for a year , the additional cost of a premium brand of tire vs. a cheapo is pretty small ( like $200 for a set of 4 or 1 bodyslide for 60 min ). Get the best/highest speed rated snow that you can . A lot of the difference is actually in the sidewall which affects handling , particularly at speed . At the risk of sounding like my mom....check tire pressure at least once every 3 months .
radial technology . Don't think I'd die if I "blew " a shoe .When you consider the costs of running a car for a year , the additional cost of a premium brand of tire vs. a cheapo is pretty small ( like $200 for a set of 4 or 1 bodyslide for 60 min ). Get the best/highest speed rated snow that you can . A lot of the difference is actually in the sidewall which affects handling , particularly at speed . At the risk of sounding like my mom....check tire pressure at least once every 3 months .
QUOTE]Originally posted by Crazy Canuck
4) Sizing
The advice these days from the manufacturers is often to buy the same size as the summer tire. [/QUOTE]
I disagree with this. I know it's not you saying it. As I said in my earlier post. You want to be able to have your tire cut through the snow to get the traction. Using the same size tire as your summers doesn't work the same. Minor point though. But, it does make a difference.
The point of easier getting around in FWD & 4WD with all seasons is valid only to the point of comparing it to RWD cars only using the same tires. Snow tires are far more superior in snow. Hands down. They should be put on any car or truck. FWD, RWD, 4WD or AWD. Doesn't matter.
CC you are correct about the observation about 4WD trucks ending up in the ditch. This also applies to AWD cars. As you stated, the advantage of these "drives" is from a standing start. When it comes to steering and traction they don't mean much. It all depends at that point on the tires you've chosen and your driving skill in the winter - which apparently there are many who can't. Although, I've learned through working on a video for them, that BMW is incorporating DSC? (Dynamic Steering Control) or somehting like that to help assist with steering and keeping out of spins. BUT, it all boils down to the skill of the driver in wet and winter conditions.
BTW my advice to all of those who are planning on buying new BMW's in the future, go for the full driving course. It'll teach you a lot more than you knew about driving.
4) Sizing
The advice these days from the manufacturers is often to buy the same size as the summer tire. [/QUOTE]
I disagree with this. I know it's not you saying it. As I said in my earlier post. You want to be able to have your tire cut through the snow to get the traction. Using the same size tire as your summers doesn't work the same. Minor point though. But, it does make a difference.
The point of easier getting around in FWD & 4WD with all seasons is valid only to the point of comparing it to RWD cars only using the same tires. Snow tires are far more superior in snow. Hands down. They should be put on any car or truck. FWD, RWD, 4WD or AWD. Doesn't matter.
CC you are correct about the observation about 4WD trucks ending up in the ditch. This also applies to AWD cars. As you stated, the advantage of these "drives" is from a standing start. When it comes to steering and traction they don't mean much. It all depends at that point on the tires you've chosen and your driving skill in the winter - which apparently there are many who can't. Although, I've learned through working on a video for them, that BMW is incorporating DSC? (Dynamic Steering Control) or somehting like that to help assist with steering and keeping out of spins. BUT, it all boils down to the skill of the driver in wet and winter conditions.
BTW my advice to all of those who are planning on buying new BMW's in the future, go for the full driving course. It'll teach you a lot more than you knew about driving.
Well the BMW course that they offer is geared more towards the proper driving techniques for the BMW. Because it does have some options that most cars don't have for now.Crazy Canuck said:
As for Gary Magwood, I did the video that he has with him. He's a good guy. Just did the revised version of that about 4 mons ago. Highly recommend getting the video or taking the course. (Have a copy for my kids to watch when it comes time to drive) There is major difference with what they teach you and with what driver's ed teaches you.
BTW, Gary helped with the development of the MTO test. He's trying to get them to update the test because it deals on the premise of older cars. Newer cars are far more advanced and the tests they do are not relevant to todays vehicle.
I agree with pretty much everything that's been said! Particularly the bit about buying 4 snows instead of just 2. It makes a big difference!
I took level 1 of the BMW course. It was pretty good, but it doesn't reflect how I drive on a day to day basis. In the course, you'll drive the car very hard - no one does that normally. The benefit to the course was it taught me how to better handle extreme situations. For instance, I know now what it feels like to be right on the edge of a tailspin but remain in control fo the vehicle. And I have now experienced the benefits of stability and traction control systems.
The BMW course is open to anyone who can pay for it. Just go to bmw.ca and look for their driving experience or something like that. There's usually a special BMW winter driving school that's held on a frozen lake at a Quebec resort. I've heard that Ford also offers winter driving courses in Colorado. And Mercedes offers a variety of courses but you have to go to Germany for those.
I took level 1 of the BMW course. It was pretty good, but it doesn't reflect how I drive on a day to day basis. In the course, you'll drive the car very hard - no one does that normally. The benefit to the course was it taught me how to better handle extreme situations. For instance, I know now what it feels like to be right on the edge of a tailspin but remain in control fo the vehicle. And I have now experienced the benefits of stability and traction control systems.
The BMW course is open to anyone who can pay for it. Just go to bmw.ca and look for their driving experience or something like that. There's usually a special BMW winter driving school that's held on a frozen lake at a Quebec resort. I've heard that Ford also offers winter driving courses in Colorado. And Mercedes offers a variety of courses but you have to go to Germany for those.
source of info
You may want to consider a subscription to consumer reports on line service. I think its about $25 a year. They have recently done reviews of all season tires and snow tires.
I have found some of their other product reviews very helpful and its usually the first place I check when buying something like snow tires.
Flooey!
You may want to consider a subscription to consumer reports on line service. I think its about $25 a year. They have recently done reviews of all season tires and snow tires.
I have found some of their other product reviews very helpful and its usually the first place I check when buying something like snow tires.
Flooey!
Thank you for all the comments and suggestions, now I'm really convinced to switch soon.ut I'd like to repeat my initial question:
Has anyone used those cheaper tires?alphaBIT said:
A four wheel drive without snow tires can be worse than a rear wheel drive without snow tires...
In a rear wheel drive you might not be able to leave your parking spot.
In a 4 wheel drive you don't get stuck, so you proceed down the road until you get to the corner. Then because of how stable the car feels, you step on the brakes, only to find that you can't stop any better than the car that is stuck in the driveway, at the last second you try to turn the car and go sailing into the field. You are going faster and go deeper into tyhe snow. It now takes 2 towtrucks to pull you out.
Buy 4 snow tires for your car or truck and go have fun in the snow.
Buy name brand tires that are the same height as stock so that your speedo isn't affected. Narrower works better in the snow and on ice, but then is worse on the nice days when the roads are just dusty and cold.
In a rear wheel drive you might not be able to leave your parking spot.
In a 4 wheel drive you don't get stuck, so you proceed down the road until you get to the corner. Then because of how stable the car feels, you step on the brakes, only to find that you can't stop any better than the car that is stuck in the driveway, at the last second you try to turn the car and go sailing into the field. You are going faster and go deeper into tyhe snow. It now takes 2 towtrucks to pull you out.
Buy 4 snow tires for your car or truck and go have fun in the snow.
Buy name brand tires that are the same height as stock so that your speedo isn't affected. Narrower works better in the snow and on ice, but then is worse on the nice days when the roads are just dusty and cold.
Thanks Terbites!!!
I just had 4 Blizzaks installed on the truck today & it is great!
While waiting at a light tonight I noticed some bonehead in an SUV sliding towards me in the rear vierw mirror (obviously out of control - I could tell because they were sideways), a quick look each way told me that the path was clear & I sped out of his/her way. Fortunately he/she just glanced my back bumper, no damage done. Had I not had the Blizzaks I would have been crunched big time!
Thanks!
-TOL
I just had 4 Blizzaks installed on the truck today & it is great!
While waiting at a light tonight I noticed some bonehead in an SUV sliding towards me in the rear vierw mirror (obviously out of control - I could tell because they were sideways), a quick look each way told me that the path was clear & I sped out of his/her way. Fortunately he/she just glanced my back bumper, no damage done. Had I not had the Blizzaks I would have been crunched big time!
Thanks!
-TOL
Ahhh! The smell of burning rubber
It never ceases to amaze me the level of intelligence on a board dedicated to the pursuit of pootang!
I would only add the following point. You spend half a grand on good winter radials then have them mounted on used rims. Not a good move. Used rims will cost you thirty bucks each and they could have come off a vehickle from an accident, jumping curbs or any other road hazard. In my opinion, spend an extra thirty dollars a wheel and have the tires installed on new rims - better seal, less chance of being out of balance or worse yet, bent. They will last the life of the tires and then some.
I'm going to get my new Goodyear Ultras on new rims installed on the Grand Caravan Monday. Happy motoring!
It never ceases to amaze me the level of intelligence on a board dedicated to the pursuit of pootang!
I would only add the following point. You spend half a grand on good winter radials then have them mounted on used rims. Not a good move. Used rims will cost you thirty bucks each and they could have come off a vehickle from an accident, jumping curbs or any other road hazard. In my opinion, spend an extra thirty dollars a wheel and have the tires installed on new rims - better seal, less chance of being out of balance or worse yet, bent. They will last the life of the tires and then some.
I'm going to get my new Goodyear Ultras on new rims installed on the Grand Caravan Monday. Happy motoring!
I saw Canadian tire advertising some cheap, black-painted, winter rims, starting from $30. I've never had winter tires, but am thinking of doing it this year.
I have alloy wheels, and the cheap rims r goanna look nasty compared to them. What do u guys do, buy a spare of set of alloy rims for winter? That'll cost a small fortune.
I have alloy wheels, and the cheap rims r goanna look nasty compared to them. What do u guys do, buy a spare of set of alloy rims for winter? That'll cost a small fortune.
