What Happened tp the Ottawa Scene?

[asuran]

One simple thing one can do to protect oneself is to screen better. That way you don't depend on anyone's blacklist or whatnot.
I don't think anyone need the list if providers screen better themselves.

All this talk shows that there are dangers out there and screening is one important way for providers to protect themselves without the need to depend on others. After all, these are Indy providers. Independent being the key word.

 

[Nesbot]

One simple thing one can do to protect oneself is to screen better. That way you don't depend on anyone's blacklist or whatnot.
I don't think anyone need the list if providers screen better themselves.

All this talk shows that there are dangers out there and screening is one important way for providers to protect themselves without the need to depend on others. After all, these are Indy providers. Independent being the key word.

So you think it’s a simple problem that’s easily solved by better screening eh? How long have you been an sp again?

 

[asuran]

So you think it’s a simple problem that’s easily solved by better screening eh? How long have you been an sp again?

If you read carefully you'd notice I said "ONE important way is to screen better" that doesn't depend on others.
There are other ways of course. What are you suggesting since you seem to know better.

What are the things an indie provider can to protect themselves if they are not to depend on others?

 

[Joeybats12345]

One simple thing one can do to protect oneself is to screen better. That way you don't depend on anyone's blacklist or whatnot.
I don't think anyone need the list if providers screen better themselves.

All this talk shows that there are dangers out there and screening is one important way for providers to protect themselves without the need to depend on others. After all, these are Indy providers. Independent being the key word.

This is an ignorant post on so many levels. Stop victim blaming. You also don’t have the slightest clue.

 

[blacklabdog]

OIC is useful for newbie clients who are scared of Leolist. I don't care whether an MA or SP is a member; total non-factor to me. Not seeing someone because they are a member is a bit extreme, if not crazy.

 

[Capital Amatuer]

This healthy debate is beginning to spiral out of control. Although Flora has offered to attempt to reply to concerns, the fact is the collective OIC remains silent. OIC's silence does not allow the accused to face the accuser. But more importantly what standards does OIC use to levy their accusations ?
I've been blacklisted by OIC. I have no idea what I did to offend the OIC judge. Yet I have seen OIC ladies and I have more than a hand full of non-OIC references. Doesn't make sense.

 

[asuran]

This is an ignorant post on so many levels. Stop victim blaming. You also don’t have the slightest clue.

Victim blaming? You know the meaning of that?
You want something from someone, but they don't want to share with you. Are you saying you are the victim in this case?
All I said was if you want something done, you do it yourself if no one gonna lend you a hand.

 

[CleoPearl]

6. I'll respectfully disagree with that

4.our rates take into account so much more than just time spent face to face with clients. It adds up if you actually factor everything into the equation. (Including completely subjective things like what we personally are comfortable with charging/accepting for the services we provide.)

6.I’ll rephrase. It is a non-essential service that no one is entitled to. It is an important service. It is a valuable service. It is not an absolute necessity that everyone is entitled to under any conditions.

Investing in producing a calendar comes to mind. I cannot see the calendar being a success. How many would buy this? Put in where? Lol

The calendar is also available in PDF form and was not a project undertaken thoughtlessly. It is just one of the ways we try to fill our emergency fund so that we have the means to help our members when they need it.

Another thing I find strange is that there are some very vocal Ladies on this board, some of which are part of OIC I believe, yet they don't talk in this thread, are they being muzzled? Because we know they are talking in their PRIVATE chat platform.

So as I client, I will do what I've always done, stay away from OIC ladies. But as an escort, I wouldn't be paying the dragon's head(s) $100 PER MONTH for what ever OIC is about.

If OIC would be community of escorts that would be welcoming of others (like Amber/Kay), wouldn't be charging per month, would actually be transparent and provide constructive feedback, wouldn't be promoting screening/safe-services-only/rates-increase, then yes OIC would likely help improve the current escort scene in this city.

Shockingly not everyone wants to engage on here. I promise, members not participating in this board aren’t being muzzled. And yes we do talk in our private channels.... that’s what’s they’re there for. It’s a space for us to have conversations amongst ourselves away from prying eyes so people feel comfortable speaking openly. (And we have ways that we try to accommodate people sharing their thoughts privately if they feel unsafe speaking openly within those channels for any reason.)

No one is forced to (or even remotely pressured to) contribute $100/month for membership dues. This has been mentioned but it’s a sliding scale (with the suggested amount being under $50.) Anytime someone can’t afford their dues all they have to do is let the finance officer know and that’s the end of it. No consequences for not being able to pay. This has been said already but apparently it needed repeating.

We welcome people who share our values, but we’re also careful to try to cultivate a safe space. (Imperfect though it may be.) We are a not for profit group- without membership fees we would not be able to do ANY of what we do. No website, no emergency fund, no workshops, no members-only socials to help fight feeling isolated. Tell me, how do you suggest we accomplish those things without the small monthly contributions?

We are transparent- within our own spaces. We aren’t accountable to anyone else for every thing we do. We “promote” letting our members decide for themselves whether or not to screen, how to screen, what to charge, and what services to provide or not provide.... that’s kind of the whole point of it being a collective and not an agency. Each individual make those decisions for themselves.

Some of you seem content to skip over anything an OIC member says to address some of the concerns brought up in this thread. It would be nice if you.. you know... didn’t do that. It’s tiresome.

:bathbaby:

 

[Nesbot]

If you read carefully you'd notice I said "ONE important way is to screen better" that doesn't depend on others.
There are other ways of course. What are you suggesting since you seem to know better.

What are the things an indie provider can to protect themselves if they are not to depend on others?

Nah I dont know better. Just thought it was against what I think to assume its a simple fix.

 

[Antonanon]

Is Frankie Boudreaux a member of the OIC? I remember her creating a blacklist, was advocating for all SWs in Ottawa and was selling swag that proclaims the wearer to be a “slobbyist slayer”. Kinda freaked me out how someone can be so militant on behalf of all SWs and yet still advertised on LL.

 

[RockNRollMachin]

Ottawa cannot be compared to other cities (not Toronto, Montreal etc). Just pay the rate or go for a drive.

Its very disappointing here. Bu its a market and this is a small town...

Just 1 millions people living here, a small town some might say !

 

[Amancalledorst]

[QUOTEAnalogy #4: Lawyers

I don’t know how old school this rule of thumb is, but I know it is extremely inappropriate. One of the worst analogies I’ve heard in terms of comparing SWs to one the top professions.][/QUOTE]

There's nothing more disappointing than hearing something so important to the community and society being compared to such a sleazy and disgusting profession..................





























don't ever make try to bring down SWs by comparing them to scumbag lawyers!

 

[Ladarrl]

Ottawa scene is really pure. Recently, I generally find myself girls through online dating. For these purposes, https://hookupmasters.com/adult-dating-sites/localtemptation-review/ is suitable for me. I was advised by a friend as a very "interesting" site.

 

[randall_stevens]

My 2 cents on this topic is this.....

Rates have gone up to high for this city (again this is just my 2 cents worth)

I totally get it that everything goes up eventually, not looking for MA's or SP's freaking out over this post.

1 thing that is really annoying is not only the rates have gone up and the ladies make more, if something happens to them like pet is sick, or phone breaks, or they need dental surgery, etc etc. i feel that they beg for extra donations on twitter.

Not all of us loyal clients can afford to help you out on this, I honestly think you probably make way more money than us, and SOME of you do this kind of stuff? come on ladies really?

Some of us can barely afford to see you as clients.

Just my 2 cents worth, not looking for an argument.

 

[Net.Socket]

My 2 cents on this topic is this.....

Rates have gone up to high for this city (again this is just my 2 cents worth)

I totally get it that everything goes up eventually, not looking for MA's or SP's freaking out over this post.

1 thing that is really annoying is not only the rates have gone up and the ladies make more, if something happens to them like pet is sick, or phone breaks, or they need dental surgery, etc etc. i feel that they beg for extra donations on twitter.

Not all of us loyal clients can afford to help you out on this, I honestly think you probably make way more money than us, and SOME of you do this kind of stuff? come on ladies really?

Some of us can barely afford to see you as clients.

Just my 2 cents worth, not looking for an argument.

Well done, you stated that your comment about the rate was a personal opinion :thumb:

When they beg on twitter, do you feel guilty to not contribute financially? Do they pressure you directly into contributing financially?

Just curious as some providers are very "forward"/"pushy" about wanting treats and helps which can be an issue when people get pressured/coerced. I personally don't see anything wrong with a provider letting their wants/needs known without expecting anyone to meet them though.

 

[Nesbot]

Who is saying you don't need a blacklist? I missed it.

 

[gibarian]

Blacklists are helpful. I don't understand why anyone in this thread is saying that you don't need them. This week a guy who gave his ID beat the shit out of 2 providers and didn't care, he'd done this before. He has a whole team of people who help him cover it up and works with the law. Last week a guy booked from his company email address and website and drugged and raped a provider and flew back to his European country. While screening with identity does not prevent all harm, it deters some of it, and blacklisting helps future providers avoid these people. When you go in blind and have no idea someone is a serial offender and has no problem giving their ID, or they are a serial offender and they use all fake info you can be in trouble either way. It's been a sad time hearing behind the scenes all the awful stuff going on to independent providers. Stuff you guys will never ever hear about in the public areas.

This business is quite dangerous for indies working alone, everyone has to decide for themselves how they want to work and try and use whatever screening/gut instincts they have to be safe. So far I do not know that anyone will be charged, let alone reported to police. Several girls are in the hospital just trying to survive and are terrified and trying to charge someone you put a target on your back and out yourself. There's also ongoing stalking for several ladies I know too that's been happening for years with these dudes trying to ruin their life anonymously. The police do not care and won't do anything. It's very scary at times and I don't wish these ills on anyone.

For anyone who thinks blacklists aren't necessary just google Joey The Rapist/Joey the Player. He's the notorious NYC guy who has robbed and raped dozens and dozens of providers over the years and is still doing it and he gives his ID and many who don't check the blacklist (though he constantly changes his phone number and email) get attacked by him. He even had a Canadian provider fly to him in NYC and conned her, she had no idea and didn't look on the blacklist. LE know about Joey and nothing happens to him either because again girls have to out themselves to charge him and are too scared. At least we can warn the next provider with a blacklist when there's tangible info. Another guy raped an indy last week anonymously and all we have is a text app and a description to go off of. I don't think there's anything the provider could do even if she wanted to.

Many increase screening because something bad happened to them. Many providers have been assaulted or raped and some still try to keep working. It's not to hurt clients or be difficult. The only one who can try and keep us safe is ourselves.

That's a fantastic (yet intensely sad) post.

You may decline to answer this, which is ok, but I've wondered in the past if a situation can ever get to a point where it seems worthwhile to just take the most direct, vengeful reaction available.

Like, I read about the German exec rapist on Twitter. In a situation like that does it become a temptation to just organize a mass email to everyone in his company with public contact information available? It may be impossible to make him pay a legal price for his offenses, but it would be fairly simple to make him at least pay a social one. Or is it almost never worth the potential blowback to the person who was victimized in the first place?

 

[randall_stevens]

Well done, you stated that your comment about the rate was a personal opinion :thumb:

When they beg on twitter, do you feel guilty to not contribute financially? Do they pressure you directly into contributing financially?

Just curious as some providers are very "forward"/"pushy" about wanting treats and helps which can be an issue when people get pressured/coerced. I personally don't see anything wrong with a provider letting their wants/needs known without expecting anyone to meet them though.

A couple have asked me directly, and I kindly and respectfully declined. Even if I could afford to help them out, I wouldnt do it.

It just makes me wonder if the roles were reversed.... lets say your car breaks down, and you need $300 in repairs.... would you post on twitter asking for the money? Probably not, you would save up for money, then get it done.

With all the money they are making ( I do get that some are low volume providers who dont see a lot of people on a daily basis) what are they spending their money on aside from regular things like, rent, food, make up etc.

 

[randall_stevens]

Ottawa cannot be compared to other cities (not Toronto, Montreal etc). Just pay the rate or go for a drive.

Its very disappointing here. Bu its a market and this is a small town...

I totally agree with you!!!!

 

[Net.Socket]

A couple have asked me directly, and I kindly and respectfully declined. Even if I could afford to help them out, I wouldnt do it.

It just makes me wonder if the roles were reversed.... lets say your car breaks down, and you need $300 in repairs.... would you post on twitter asking for the money? Probably not, you would save up for money, then get it done.

With all the money they are making ( I do get that some are low volume providers who dont see a lot of people on a daily basis) what are they spending their money on aside from regular things like, rent, food, make up etc.

That you can afford or not, my opinion is also that you shouldn't feel any pressure in refusing to help.

With the rest we are entering new waters though.

Regardless of the employment, certain people are independent (a lot of sex workers are) and will do everything themselves without asking help. This is more of a conditioning, for most people it is just about having control, others take it to unhealthy boundaries and won't ask for help even if it kills them. The opposite is also true, certain people will ask coworker, family friends for help as soon as they are uncomfortable, most people will "get by" without the help, others are truly dependent on the help.

If you follow models on Instagram you will see the similar behaviors, plus sex worker are very often very close to the sugaring phenomenon which might play a role in it as well.

If we remove the financial aspects and keep it a "requesting help", anyone is entitled to asking for help on any aspects of their lives. The issue is when this help is implicitly expected or explicitly pressured.