http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q2wlP_Vj3W0&feature=player_embedded
Dana's reaction on youtube.
He's not happy too say the least. Wow.
Dana's reaction on youtube.
He's not happy too say the least. Wow.
UFC 112: Invincible
- Thread starter The Oracle
- Start date
LOL so who says the 10 pm viewing is the all clear. People have PVRs. Look maybe I shouldn't have brought it up because you didn't make that big a deal about it. But just because you and a couple of others have an understanding that you will write spoiler alert in a thread, doesn't mean everyone is hip to your little understanding. You were nice enough to say not a big deal, or some such thing, and I could have left it at that. But come on, going into a thread and being pissed because you find out stuff about the fight...try being pissed at yourself. So no hard feelings, but next time, don't look in the thread.
Now, let me go back to the Leafs Canadiens game. I'm just starting the second period on my PVR, so nobody is allowed to comment on the game until I'm done. </sarcasm>
You are an idiot if you came into this thread, knowing the fights had taken place, and you wanted to watch them later.
Don't need a spoiler alert. Maybe an Idiot Alert.
Don't need a spoiler alert. Maybe an Idiot Alert.
Okay...Just gonna throw my 2 cents in.....Please excuse any grammatical and spelling errors cause I've been drinking but I still felt like posting....
One thing for sure 112 was definitely not the greatest UFC event ever:
Penn didn't look like the BJ Penn that fought Sanchez, Florian, Stevenson and Sherk....Something was missing...
In my opinion it could be one of three things....[1] he took the fight lightly and didn't train hard enough [1] he was injured and couldn't fight effectively or at least play his game comfortably (or even train properly to prepare for the fight [3] he didn't take jetlag into account and gassed out.....
I didn't think Penn lost that fight...Edgar was giving Penn trouble but he didn't decisively beat the champ (after watching the Penn/Edgar fight Shogun must really feel he got screwed in his fight)......Edgar really showed some toughness and aggression (smart aggression) in that fight....
Anderson technically and physically is one of the best fighters in the UFC....Mentally he seems to be losing it....Maybe he 's not being challenged or he's just bored with the fight game or he's just losing his mental focus and/or passion...
Spider may have been tired but he still had more than enough energy to finish Maia (all he had to do was press - fuck some leg kicks would have finished Maia off)....GSP must be thrilled with Silva's performance because it takes the heat off him and off his last fight...
Really was it any surprise that Renzo was so ineffective against Hughes.....As much as I dislike Hughes he was UFC Welterweight Champion for a reason and his experience and strength was demonstrated once again in that fight....
One thing for sure 112 was definitely not the greatest UFC event ever:
Penn didn't look like the BJ Penn that fought Sanchez, Florian, Stevenson and Sherk....Something was missing...
In my opinion it could be one of three things....[1] he took the fight lightly and didn't train hard enough [1] he was injured and couldn't fight effectively or at least play his game comfortably (or even train properly to prepare for the fight [3] he didn't take jetlag into account and gassed out.....
I didn't think Penn lost that fight...Edgar was giving Penn trouble but he didn't decisively beat the champ (after watching the Penn/Edgar fight Shogun must really feel he got screwed in his fight)......Edgar really showed some toughness and aggression (smart aggression) in that fight....
Anderson technically and physically is one of the best fighters in the UFC....Mentally he seems to be losing it....Maybe he 's not being challenged or he's just bored with the fight game or he's just losing his mental focus and/or passion...
Spider may have been tired but he still had more than enough energy to finish Maia (all he had to do was press - fuck some leg kicks would have finished Maia off)....GSP must be thrilled with Silva's performance because it takes the heat off him and off his last fight...
Really was it any surprise that Renzo was so ineffective against Hughes.....As much as I dislike Hughes he was UFC Welterweight Champion for a reason and his experience and strength was demonstrated once again in that fight....
One more thing....
Maybe the UFC and its referees should be more strict on fighter's who waste time and don't engage.....
Margiliotti was right in threatening to deduct a point.....Maybe UFC refs should be more liberal in deducting points when fighters don't seem to want to fight and are too passive...
I really liked the Pride system where the fighter was handed a Yellow Card and 10 percent of his purse was automatically deducted....
Maybe the UFC and its referees should be more strict on fighter's who waste time and don't engage.....
Margiliotti was right in threatening to deduct a point.....Maybe UFC refs should be more liberal in deducting points when fighters don't seem to want to fight and are too passive...
I really liked the Pride system where the fighter was handed a Yellow Card and 10 percent of his purse was automatically deducted....
Dude he's not talking about you he's talking about DJ1470.
It would help if you would read the entire thread before jumping to conclusions.
It's all good my man.
BTW although I thought Edgar fought the perfect fight, I still think BJ won that fight.
Maybe?
I think warnings, a penalty and eventual DQ's for not fighting are the most important correction issues for all combat sports. Whoever implements this first will score a major advantage for their product.
If there was any doubt that UFC needs such a rule as badly as boxing does, surely UFC112 proves otherwise.
Despite the surreal refusal of MMA commentators to EVER admit when a fight just plain sucks, the fans weren't fooled and rightfully boo'ed through most of both co-featueres. It was so bad it actually made one long for one of those 5-minue man-on-man mating balls on the ground.
All things in good time. What goes around comes around. One day Silva will find himself busted up, baited, taunted with no hope of doing anything about it (see Roy Jones ) and hopefully the guy who does him will show no pitty or respect.
There were a couple of other examples of bad officiating.
First, Silva threw several underhand jabs with a partially open fist early in the fight. This could only have been a deliberate attempt get a finger in Maia's eye.
More disturbing was the referee's bizzare refusal to stop the Hughes-Gracie fight when Gracie needed nearly 20 seconds to get back on his feet (reluctantly) the last three times he went down and had not credibly defended himself for quite some time.
It seemed the ref was given several not too subtle invitations to stop the fight but wouldn't do so. What was he expecting? The guy is a Gracie, he can't just curl up on the ground in a fetal position and whimper. But I thought he was giving the ref obvious ques that he needed to be rescued.
First, Silva threw several underhand jabs with a partially open fist early in the fight. This could only have been a deliberate attempt get a finger in Maia's eye.
More disturbing was the referee's bizzare refusal to stop the Hughes-Gracie fight when Gracie needed nearly 20 seconds to get back on his feet (reluctantly) the last three times he went down and had not credibly defended himself for quite some time.
It seemed the ref was given several not too subtle invitations to stop the fight but wouldn't do so. What was he expecting? The guy is a Gracie, he can't just curl up on the ground in a fetal position and whimper. But I thought he was giving the ref obvious ques that he needed to be rescued.
Last edited:
I did not get home until 100am, so I did not even go on Terb, in case there was a thread titled Penn Loses! or something like that. If you go into the sports area of any website after the fights, you have only yourself to blame. So I watched the 100am version, but I fell asleep during Penn Edgar and missed the rest. It sounds like I did not miss much. GSP may be having trouble finishing, but it seems like Silva is having trouble even fighting. At 170, GSP destroys Silva, in my opinion, Silva would have no muscle left.
Silva's nickname should be changed from The Spider to The Clown after that embarrassing performance.
I don't blame Dana White for being irate after the shit Silva pulled. If it was me, I would strip Silva of his belt and kick him out of the UFC.
Is Silva a great fighter? There is no doubt he has devastating power and striking ability combined with unmatched timing.
Is Silva a great champion? NO. As a champion you should want to elevate the sport and carry yourself with some pride.
After watching him pull that showboating shit for more than a round, I have lost all respect for Silva. To me he is a 2face. He'll bow in the ring, pray to his saviour, and touch gloves in the middle. Then when he knows his opponent is not to his calibre and does not pose a threat, instead of finishing him quickly he will clown around like a dick. And he'll backpeddle for the final rounds so he can maintain his 'legacy'. Or maybe he does it to piss the crowd off more once they start booing him.
And of course he always says the same thing at the end "Sorry guys, I didn't mean to disrespect my opponent, I will make it more exciting next time, I promise." and then he pulls the exact same shit.
He could take some lessons from GSP on how to conduct yourself not only as a champion but as a martial artist. I think people calling him the world's greatest fighter has made Silva's ego blow up so much he thinks he can get away with anything now. But as fast as he became champ, it can disappearjust as quickly. You could sense the unanimous disgust for Silva from Joe&Goldie, the fans, the ref (he actually shoved Silva in a 'quit clownin' kind of way after Silva pretended to hide behind him), other MMA fighters, and of course Dana White. I believe Silva believes he is MMA's version of Muhammad Ali, but he is far from it, and he will learn the hard way.
I don't blame Dana White for being irate after the shit Silva pulled. If it was me, I would strip Silva of his belt and kick him out of the UFC.
Is Silva a great fighter? There is no doubt he has devastating power and striking ability combined with unmatched timing.
Is Silva a great champion? NO. As a champion you should want to elevate the sport and carry yourself with some pride.
After watching him pull that showboating shit for more than a round, I have lost all respect for Silva. To me he is a 2face. He'll bow in the ring, pray to his saviour, and touch gloves in the middle. Then when he knows his opponent is not to his calibre and does not pose a threat, instead of finishing him quickly he will clown around like a dick. And he'll backpeddle for the final rounds so he can maintain his 'legacy'. Or maybe he does it to piss the crowd off more once they start booing him.
And of course he always says the same thing at the end "Sorry guys, I didn't mean to disrespect my opponent, I will make it more exciting next time, I promise." and then he pulls the exact same shit.
He could take some lessons from GSP on how to conduct yourself not only as a champion but as a martial artist. I think people calling him the world's greatest fighter has made Silva's ego blow up so much he thinks he can get away with anything now. But as fast as he became champ, it can disappearjust as quickly. You could sense the unanimous disgust for Silva from Joe&Goldie, the fans, the ref (he actually shoved Silva in a 'quit clownin' kind of way after Silva pretended to hide behind him), other MMA fighters, and of course Dana White. I believe Silva believes he is MMA's version of Muhammad Ali, but he is far from it, and he will learn the hard way.
I am a little bit surprised at the degree to which Silva is being condemned for the fight. I am a Silva fan. Most will agree that he is a highly skilled fighter. I have an appreciation for that skill and enjoy watching it. I was amused by the clowning and the taunting, but I admit it was unsportsmanlike. More so in retrospect.
The last half of the fight was a disappoiintment. I agree that a great champion would have put Maia away instead of back up and running. This is Silva's flaw as well as a flaw of the scoring used by UFC. Good for Dana White in condemning the tactics used by Silva. So I guess things will change now in UFC? Refs will penalize a fighter who backpedals for half the fight? Or is he just talking out his ass?
One of the Japanese organizations (Dream?) has the ref issue yellow and red cards for not being active. Yellow come with a 10% purse deduction, red even more.
I think they could address it with purses and rules. Pay double for KO or submission win versus a decision. And if a guy runs or refuses to engage, or hides behind the ref, then the ref deducts a point, like with an illegal strike. I would like to see Silva take on Kalib Starnes, they would never actually make physical contact.
I don't think the fines are needed. In the first place it would be open to allegations of abuse (to pay the fighter less...).
A warning, a point penalty and impending DQ which puts a very real threat of a loss on the record should be discouragement enough. The financial consequences will take care of themselves, as the fighter's marketability will suffer from the poor effort, even more so if he loses because of it.
Warnings & penalties for passivity are used in amateur wrestling which many of these guys have dabbled in, so it's not a totally foreign concept. Boxing theoretically has consequences for not fighting but it's only enforced once every 20 years or so (Derrick Gainer was DQ'd for not fighting vs. JM Marquez about 6 years ago) otherwise forgotten ever since Ali stamped the cancers of clowning & passivity on the sport in the 70's. I can't remember off hand if competitive Taek WonDo & Wushu have any such rule.
But it wasn't just the passivity he passivity that was objectionable (Penn & Edgar weren't much better in that regard - less action than the Hopkins-Jones farce) it was also Silva's poor sportsmanship that goes against all the repsect and integrity talk which MMA preaches so of course White had no choice but to speak out. However the real measure of leadership will be the actions which strenghten the deterrent to this type of thing.
A warning, a point penalty and impending DQ which puts a very real threat of a loss on the record should be discouragement enough. The financial consequences will take care of themselves, as the fighter's marketability will suffer from the poor effort, even more so if he loses because of it.
Warnings & penalties for passivity are used in amateur wrestling which many of these guys have dabbled in, so it's not a totally foreign concept. Boxing theoretically has consequences for not fighting but it's only enforced once every 20 years or so (Derrick Gainer was DQ'd for not fighting vs. JM Marquez about 6 years ago) otherwise forgotten ever since Ali stamped the cancers of clowning & passivity on the sport in the 70's. I can't remember off hand if competitive Taek WonDo & Wushu have any such rule.
But it wasn't just the passivity he passivity that was objectionable (Penn & Edgar weren't much better in that regard - less action than the Hopkins-Jones farce) it was also Silva's poor sportsmanship that goes against all the repsect and integrity talk which MMA preaches so of course White had no choice but to speak out. However the real measure of leadership will be the actions which strenghten the deterrent to this type of thing.
