TTC Issues

SkyRider

Banned
Mar 31, 2009
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http://www.torontosun.com/2015/05/06/ttc-streetcar-driver-faces-charges-after-fatal-crash

http://toronto.ctvnews.ca/man-dies-after-being-struck-by-streetcar-1.2312498

Why is the TTC afflicted with so many problems?

1) Pedestrians killed by streetcars and buses.

2) Drivers charged with careless driving.

3) Driver(s) running red lights.

4) Driver charged with sexual assault of 16 year old girl.

5) Service breakdowns after breakdowns.

6) Construction delays and cost overruns.

because it is so huge with so many employees and only the bad things are pointed out in the Sun
 
You do know that they're probably the largest union in Ontario, right? Either them or TPS anyway. TTC can do anything and we have no choice but to let them.
 
because it is so huge with so many employees and only the bad things are pointed out in the Sun

+1 There are thousands of TTC employees and you only hear about the few "bad" things that occur because it sells newspapers. Nobody ever reports about the TTC driver that stops to pick up people running for the bus in the rain when they don't have to, nobody ever reports about the subway driver that has to watch people jump in front of their train then go home and delay with what they saw, nobody reports about the driver that gets spit on or threatened by stupid drunks in the middle of the night that are trying to get on without paying etc etc etc.
 
You do know that they're probably the largest union in Ontario, right? Either them or TPS anyway. TTC can do anything and we have no choice but to let them.

UAW bigger by far

I work for the TTC and I am damn glad I have the union

Too many TTC workers do not appreciate their union or their job

I am not one of them

No, the union cannot do anything it wants as the rules, wages etc are set by an independent arbitrator, and so are any firings
 
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Of course, shit happens but does the TTC have more than its fair share of service disruptions and pedestrians injured and killed?

ttc-driver-charged-with-sexually-assaulting-teen-girl-aboard-bus-1
Then there is sexual assault by a TTC driver. There are stories of passenger-passenger sexual assaults on the system but one should not expect TTC staff to be the culprit.
 
Fuck TTC, I bought myself a bike last Thursday after waiting for street car for 30 mins yet again because one had to go out of service due to mechanical problems. Will try to bike to work as long as I can until it gets cold. I'll probably still use ttc during heavy rains and storms but on a good day it's faster to go by bike with no extra effort and I bike on lakeshore with an amazing view!
 
Of course, shit happens but does the TTC have more than its fair share of service disruptions and pedestrians injured and killed?

Maintenance has been a big issue for years.
Politicians will raise money for a little new subway but ignore major maintenance costs, so you get new stops but shoddy mainlines.
 
Decades of meddling and mismanagement by politicians. One regime promises new transit projects only to have the next one change the project significantly or cancel it outright.
 
Maybe its because I live in Toronto but it seems the TTC kill mor pedestrians, suffer more service breakdowns and assault more passengers than what is normal. How does the TTC compare to transit in other large cities?
 
Unions have made city workers, hotel employees and especially TTC workers intolerable. You look at them the wrong way and it's off to HR or file a grievance. I have no qualms about calling TTC rank and file a bunch of lazy ignorant fuckers.
 
TTC gets more negative news for a few reasons:

- More people have cellphones
- The internet age gives every person the opportunity to be amateur journalists
- Combine the above points and the TTC has a tough road ahead of them as people are sick of unions holding them hostage with strikes, disrupted service and childish antics

It's not like the old days where everyday commuters using the TTC would just have to sit back and like it. If a TTC worker is acting lazy, people are quick to jump on their smartphone and snap a pic or video to embarrass them.

It's their way of getting back at the TTC.

Unions as a whole are disruptive in nature. This isn't the old days where there were massive safety issues and employees getting taken advantage of. Now, they band together under a union leader, sit back and hope management bends. A capitalistic person will say they have every right to and if management bends it means it's a win-win.

Not really.

Management (like myself) have a repsonsibility to try keeping the dept functioning well. If all managers do their part, the company runs great, we sell product, the company profits and everyone has a paycheque as the business keeps going. If things break down, products and services suffer, we sell less and it's slippery slope to losses, in which executives will then cut costs which typically means either people first (non-profit generating depts like CSR, IT, marketing or warehousing crews), marketing/media/advertising costs, or a combo of both. Typically management will keep sales depts, finance and a reasonable amount of warehousing/logistics/order processing as they are essential for future sales.

What never made sense to me is why unionized workers prefer such standardized wages where pay seems based on years of service and job/rank. There seems to be zero effort put into rewarding good workers and getting rid of lousy ones. Two people may be similar years and job and both probably get paid the same. One guy does a great job, one guy lousy yet both paid the same. Since wages seem set, management doesn't seem to have the ability to reward the good workers, while reprimanding the lousy one.

I find it hard to understand why unionized employees prefer this "everyone in the same boat" mentality when every company out there has good, avg and lazy workers. If you are a good worker, don't you want to get paid more than the guy messing up beside you?

I'v always worked private sector and every year the crappy employees who screw up get pink slipped. Fine with me. Screw up repeatedly and nobody wants you around. If everyone was unionized, the guys would probably still have a job.

As for pay boosts, why hide behind a union leader? Fight for your own pay and if you are good enough you'll get a pay raise you deserve. Why pay union dues of $500-1,000 each(!). It shows character to negotiate yourself and speak with managers about pay, passion, and what you bring to the table. I've tried asking for pay hikes twice. Once I lost, once I won. Fair enough. Just act maturely and don't make it into a worker vs. management battle. Every employee at their root has a common goal and that is to do their part (function) well. And if everyone does it well, the organization works well.

No organization wants to lose valuable employees. The government especially should be more willing since they can go into debt no problem where they can't really claim bankruptcy like a normal company. So rewarding good employees an extra few thousand $$$ shouldn't be an issue.

With unionized wages set, all you good unionized employees out there have been getting shortchanged the whole time because the government's budget allocates so much to wages. And with set wage scales, that guy beside you doing a bad job is getting more than he deserves, which means to balance it out it comes from your pocket. As well as the thousands of union due fees paid over the years.

What I think many unionized employees have never felt is the joy of doing well at a job and being rewarded for it.

Like the government, companies allocate a % increase to wages as a pool. How it is dispersed is different. While the pool may go up 2%, some people get 0%, most somewhere between 1-3 %, and the people who exceled get much more. I've known guys get 10%+ wage increases for doing a great job. No promotion or anything. They just did great. So while everyone else averages out a 2% cost of living increase, some guys scored 10-15% salary increase. I've never had that, but have scored a 5% bump up. Not bad when everyone else got around 2%.

Then there's annual bonus, which everyone in the company gets. Even the lowest level job is part of it. It is paid on various financial metrics. The better the company does the better the pay out. Again, it hinges on how well the company does. If everyone fires on all cylinders, chances are it'll be a good bonus. If business suffers, it might be 0%.

Government jobs are different in that it's not about sales in a direct way, but more of a service.... though some are revenue generating like transportation. However, the same basic rules of reward apply. If people do a great job, more people will use the service and in turn more revenue. That can lead to a bigger pool of wage budget for the future. Or better equipment. However, what hinders this is the protectionist union mantra which is basically to hold service hostage and some reason seems to want to keep lousy workers unless really forced to be rid of them. These actions create worse image of the service, add unnecessary costs, can drive good workers to go to the private sector.

It's all a cycle.

You can already see the types of attitude many unionized workers show compared to private sector. TTC, post office, any of those driver's license/passport offices etc.... Notice how 99% of them seem grumpy? On the other hand, go to any fast food joint, store at a mall, or office environment and it seems the opposite. Most people have a much more cheery attitude. All of these jobs are people oriented (service), but the contrast in attitudes is large.
 
"What never made sense to me is why unionized workers prefer such standardized wages where pay seems based on years of service and job/rank. There seems to be zero effort put into rewarding good workers and getting rid of lousy ones. Two people may be similar years and job and both probably get paid the same. One guy does a great job, one guy lousy yet both paid the same. Since wages seem set, management doesn't seem to have the ability to reward the good workers, while reprimanding the lousy one.

I find it hard to understand why unionized employees prefer this "everyone in the same boat" mentality when every company out there has good, avg and lazy workers. If you are a good worker, don't you want to get paid more than the guy messing up beside you?"

This entire post was obviously written like an Op-Ed article you'd read in the National Post/Toronto Sun, espousing the virtuous nature of management and the inherent evils/ineptitude/out-dated philosophies of the big bad unions, and their conniving bosses. I won't respond to every point every point due to time, but will to the above highlighted quote.

When hiring practices aren't moderated based on seniority among the union employees, the 'cream always rises to the top' is a flawed and naive concept. Nepotism, favouritism, politics, keeping a good guy down (for whatever reason, eg. looking for a yes-man), and a host of other reasons all come into play when promotions are considered.

The union, in 'fairness' to it's membership prefers the seniority system to avoid the above things I mentioned. It allows them some semblance of control, in an uncontrollable situation. Is it perfect? Obviously not, but it does prevent management from allowing their ulterior motives to enter into the hiring practice.

Yes, Management too has ulterior motives and doesn't always act in the best interests of the business and its employees by hiring the best candidates.
 
Unions.. down with them already... this is the new Millenium any fool that says they need a union...are just that..fools.

Unions just breed lazy workers
 
The union, in 'fairness' to it's membership prefers the seniority system to avoid the above things I mentioned. It allows them some semblance of control, in an uncontrollable situation. Is it perfect? Obviously not, but it does prevent management from allowing their ulterior motives to enter into the hiring practice..
And that's the biggest difference between unionized and non-unionized workers.

Who says there's an uncontrollable situation? I've worked in offices my whole life, some small some large. When to comes to annual pay hike time, seems smooth to me how everyone gets their different piece of the pie which the finance department set out for wages/salaries for the upcoming year. Then next year, finance does the math again. It's not hard to divvy out the money.

What is harder to accomplish is who gets what. That's where good managers will feel out whom on their team deserves what. Then it funnels up to upper management to shake things out to ensure it satisfies finance's wage pool increase. Manager who aren't in tune with their team and/or workers who are dicking around make it tough to figure things out.

Non-unionized workers prefer wages set based on negotiating your own pay, doing well and the company having flexibility to pay more or not. No non-unionized worker wants everyone's pay in the office to be based on how long you've been there. There's always consideration for performance and nobody likes lazy guys around.

Unionized workers prefer a more backseat approach where people of similar seniority/job get paid the same regardless of performance. There is more tolerance for lazy workers, thus union workers acceptance for standard sets of wages and the difficulty in firing someone.

You are also assuming management has ulterior motives. Maybe. Maybe not. Regardless, a more flexible pay system is welcomed with open arms and gives the opportunity for some people getting better pay, instead of being stifled with wages set similar to other people.

The guy doing a great job but not getting rewarded is getting shortchanged. While the lazy guy beside him getting paid similar is counting his lucky stars the wage agreement says he gets paid as much as the guy beside him. And with employee termination tough to carry through, there's extra protection for lazy guys to hum along until it gets to that critical point a firing is actually going to happen.

No worries on our viewpoints. We just have different views on employee/management and unions/non-unions.
 
Some prefer unions because left to private interests, and individual negotiation, compensation would/will be down. Now the 'union hating' right-wingers will jump all over that statement, but numbers support otherwise.
 
If the mgmt is hired by their buddies or their fathers worked at TTC it is a flawed system. If the leaders are unable to lead then you are left with what we have in Toronto. Then you let the politicians get involved and they spend the majority of the allocated funds to do study after study to their puppet friends. It is a product of a flawed system.