Time for a raise

[sarasota]

Sometime over the next few weeks I will meet with my supervisor, the owner of the business, and talk about my progress and request a raise. I only plan on being at this business for a short time, but the owner does not know this. The owner is eratic and can be abusive vebally. I took this job for the title and the experience, and I have been paid a wage lower than the person I replaced who could not do the job; but was kept on at the higher wage. When I arrived the owner was one to two years behind schedule, according to their words, and now we are on schedule and the owner stated that this has been a very good year. The reason I am going to request a raise now is the owner kept stating that no raises would be allowed until after a certain period of time.

The owner views me as an push over and believes everything is negotiable (referring to wage increases). When I leave, my guess is deadlines will once again not be met and finding qualified employees, which I have done, will once again become difficult. My boss will be living a nightmare trying to run their business as they were before I arrived.

My interest is getting the largest increase in pay as possible. With the information just provided, what information will I need to politely combat any mind games the boss will send my way in order to get this increase.

One other note. When I originally took the job I requested a low wage just to get in the door. After a short while I requested an increase. The increase was not excessive and still below what industry standards dictated. Upon receiving the increase, the owner said, " Wow you did a great negotiating. I was only going to go to "x" amount." I sat there for a moment amazed at how they beleived I believed them, and then just said thanks. My point, my boss is cheap, slightly insane, and will bite off thier nose to spite their face.

Thanks for your help.

 

[Mikehorn]

I realize this isn't what you want to hear, but get out now. Life is short, it's not worth it. I had a boss like this once. He hired me right at the start of their busy season, forced a bunch of overtime (including Saturdays) down my throat (unpaid of course), and let me go right before I qualified for benefits (or even EI). Apparently they picked that exact time to decide I was "incompetent".

If you truly have those skills, you can use them to go elsewhere, or start your own business. Trust me, it'll be the best move you ever made.

 

[willie]

its a lot easier to mug him,first ,if the disparity between concerns needs to be bridged further,then apply for the raise.....

=+willie

 

[sarasota]

I realize this isn't what you want to hear, but get out now. ....

It's fine what you say. It's the same thing I say to myself.

Part of the reason I want to get the largest increase as possible, is for the resume. I have an advanced degree and the jobs I am currently applying for also request the experience I have gained by working at this place. My meeting w/ the boss can provide an opportunity to develop, hone, or whatever my negotiation and business skills. In some ways it's a game. A game I want to do the best at that I can possibly do.

The reason I say the boss is partly insane is because it's true and it does factor in. If I were to get the right wage, the owner might take offense. So, the best possible increase would not only provide me w/ something distinguishable for the resume, but would not result in alot of added grief.

My concern is knowing what tactics I might encounter in this meeting and how to address them in a positive way.

 

[TOBOUND]

difficult

Ive always found that once a company has you they think you need them more than they need you. My advise is to start looking and ask for what you want at the new place. Go ahead and negotiate at the current place but if your not ready to walk out or have something else in hand dont push to much.

 

[sarasota]

1)Ive always found that once a company has you they think you need them more than they need you. 2) My advise is to start looking and ask for what you want at the new place. Go ahead and negotiate at the current place but if your not ready to walk out or have something else in hand dont push to much.

1) Yes, this is the feeling I get.

2) This is my thinking too. I put this post out there because I am a bit unsure if taking this route is simply taking the easy way out, or if it is the most logical and safe move.

 

[Shallow Throat]

It's always better to have this conversation with another opportunity in your back pocket. Not knowing your situation, I don't know how many opportunities there are in your field. Also note, your search for other opportunities might find better situations (and pay) anyways then you can leave this cheapskate without even asking for a raise.

 

[TOBOUND]

. . .

Also I would not tell the current employer you have something else. If you have anothe offer and want to stay then tell the current boss you want more, I wouldnt tell them you have somethign else b/c even if they give you a raise the odds are that he will not forget it and when layoffs come hell look for you. If you get an offer, and its what you want, and you dont want to stay where your at, then take it.

There was an articlle out a few weeks ago about gorilla bosses, you know the type. They say there are more psychotics in mngt then in prison, and there in mngt b/c they are psychotic.

 

[Jade4u]

I do not think it is pushing too much just to REQUEST a wage. As long as it is approached in the right manner.

You can always use words like Christmas is likely to set me back and I have a very huge family etc... etc.. and then clearly say I am only requesting and hoping that you believe I am an asset to this corporation. Also state that you have really benifited in your time working there and that you feel it is like a big happy family (obviously not) but a little kissing up to the boss never hurts.

Also remember that in any company they ask about long term goals and climbing the ladder of success and most bosses will want to hear you are interested in climbing the ladder of success within thier company so state that you wish to work right under him on that ladder and that is your long term goal. (again we know this will be a lie) But if your boss really believes you want to stay and become more and more knowledgable within his corporation and that you are eager to stay on and learn more, he may give you the raise and never doubt for a second that you wish to stay on.

I doubt very much an employer can fire one just for requesting a raise. But maybe the better way is to ask for a promotion with a raise in a higher area. If you are only planning on staying a little longer and get that raise then I would recommend looking hard and deep in the mean time for that new career if your boss is that poor in character.

 

[Svend]

It sounds like he respects a tough negotiator, don't let it become personal and become offended - it's just business.
If you move on, have another job first. But don't expect it to be any better, I don't know too many people who actually enjoy their job.
When you ask for a raise, don't talk about how you need more money - make it about how you earn one and back up this with details showing how valuable you are to the company.
However, no one is indispensible - everyone can be replaced.

 

[Keebler Elf]

I would strongly advise that you don't try to play the "Christmas is coming, woe is me" line. A good negotiator will eat you up if you try that.

First off, you need to go in knowing exactly what your strengths and weaknesses are. You need to be able to tell your boss how great you are and why you deserve a raise. If you can't show your worth, why would he ever recognize it? You also need to know your weaknesses so you can be prepared with an answer when your boss brings up your shortcomings (and yes, you have some. Everybody does).

Next, you need to know what the industry standard is. And you need to be able to prove it. Your boss can easily say "you're wrong", but it won't be as easy for him when you tell him Workopolis says you should make X and Monster says you should make Y, yet you're only making Z.

Finally, you need to be willing to walk away. If you're not, you're negotiating from a position of weakness. The same holds true for your boss. You say he's "insane"... well then, he might just tell you to take a walk cuz you're not getting any raise (or he might give you a pittance of a raise). Then what are you going to do? If you stay, you're his bitch. If you leave, do you have another job to go to?

The best answer is the one that's already been given: Move on. It sounds like you've been there long enough to accomplish what you wanted, so it's time to move onto bigger and better things.

 

[xix]

Same Titanic ship

I am in the same boat but with lower title than Sarasota.

This is from : I wish I knew then from what I have experience, learned over the years.

If were under 30 and after 2 years with the company I would move on, no matter what the achievements or underachievements I have made there.

I learned that "Performance Review" instigation reports are just a way of: not getting any or some raises becaue your co-workers will nail you, to see what you think of yourself and how much you should get. And to really see what you think of others or who is not working and to see if you are working and not watching everyone else. Also to see if you are screwing HR's buddies. ( I have seen this.)

No matter where you work or who you are or how much "education" you have you are just a number. Unless you are the only on in the Region; Province, or Country that can do that JOB, ( otherwise known as experience or astronaut ) then you can demand a high raise.

Use the company printer/photocopier to print out your resume, reference letters and what ever else needed to find another job.

Once a better offer from future company arrives then, go back to the boss and ask for a raise. ( this would be burning your bridges I believe) If boss doesn't give in to what you want then take holidays, right away then start at next job like you promised them.
If you know for sure you won't be back fax/email them a resignation letter after your vacation.

I met people that were fired while on vacation.

SO now I am wiser I will try to find a new job by the end of JAnuary, use up all the benefits that I can from current boss. Since the profit sharing is paid out on a calendar year, it won't be smart hang aorund more than 2 - 3 months where I am currently because I won't see any of 2006 profits. So by the time Victoria long weekend comes around I get paid for it. Sure I will miss Good Friday but it's only holiday and not 3 -4 holidays.

 

[Keebler Elf]

Someone's bitter.

 

[fuji]

You don't need a raise "for your resume", that is silly.

You say you are below industry standard? Well then when your next employer gets around to, "So how much do you expect?" just tell them the industry standard rate and they will not be surprised. If they ask you, "What are you earning now?" just answer "I would expect to get $X".

It's better not to lie, but honestly, your future employer has virtually no way to tell whether you lied about your salary or not. It's not public information and they aren't going to demand you produce your T4.

 

[jeanius]

sara from platinum?

I understand how you may feel but I think you should come to a conclusion this on your own without asking for advices.. take as much time as you can without stressing yourself. be confident with whatever decision you make and make sure you have a backup plan.

good luck~