The Canadian Navy?
- Thread starter SkyRider
- Start date
Yes, and with or without a navy, we will protect it ineffectively with a lot of posturing.
It's now the Royal Canadian Navy having reverted back,to,it's former name prior to PET combining the RCN Army and RCAF into,the Canadian Armed Forces back,in 68 and the infamous green "busmans" uniform
As spanky said, we have the good old RCN back again. Trouble is, as at least one thread in the past year noted, the new ships Harper promised haven't actually been bought, and the old ones are in drydock. Even sadder is that the promised new vessels OHG has welched on were to be Arctic patrol ships with ice-breaking capacity to do just the sort of job you have in mind.
On the other hand, our forces' role in transporting VIPs has been maintained, and so has has the fleet of Challengers they do it with even though The Dear Leader once promised to sell off these Liberal 'gravy boats/trains/planes'. And the Arctic Rangers still don't have their promised new rifles, though TDL inspects them on his junket every year.
Not easy doing the job and keeping your promises while cutting taxes so you'll stay in office.
On the other hand, our forces' role in transporting VIPs has been maintained, and so has has the fleet of Challengers they do it with even though The Dear Leader once promised to sell off these Liberal 'gravy boats/trains/planes'. And the Arctic Rangers still don't have their promised new rifles, though TDL inspects them on his junket every year.
Not easy doing the job and keeping your promises while cutting taxes so you'll stay in office.
Rumour has it that Danish sailors have to protect their own passage. From Danish sailors.
Only with US assistance
I'm afraid the only way this is going to work is with US military assistance. IIRC, years ago when a Trudeau government was faced with the arctic sovereignty issue before the United Nations, Canada's claim to the area was never upheld. Most nations agreed to allow us a kind of environmental caretaker role at the time ( and this support came mostly from 3rd world nations far removed from the arctic). Trudeau managed to dodge the bullet for a time, but he knew it was only a temporary sort of victory.
And, Celticman, that was funny. Good one.
I'm afraid the only way this is going to work is with US military assistance. IIRC, years ago when a Trudeau government was faced with the arctic sovereignty issue before the United Nations, Canada's claim to the area was never upheld. Most nations agreed to allow us a kind of environmental caretaker role at the time ( and this support came mostly from 3rd world nations far removed from the arctic). Trudeau managed to dodge the bullet for a time, but he knew it was only a temporary sort of victory.
And, Celticman, that was funny. Good one.
The United States does not recognize Canada's claim that the Northwest Passage is Canadian territorial waters. They claim that the Passage is international waters and they don't have to ask permission to cross it. So good luck with asking the Americans to help protect our sovereignty, without giving them a chunk of it ourselves. Plus, the US doesn't do anything for nothing, only when it suits their national interests.
Keeping our borders and claims intact costs money. When your armed forces are a joke, you eventually pay the consequences. This is especially true when the time comes when the Arctic Ocean will be ice free, and the search for undersea oil and gas takes place there.
Ditto!
There have recently been several intrusions or fly by's close to Canadian and American air space up north (as reported by the news recently), with Canada scrambling their CF 18s, and the U.S. scrambling their Raptors.
Putin is a cocksucker and has raised the ire of the old Soviet Union.
I can't believe what just happened with our Navy. It will take years for the retro-fitted or new ships to come on stream. Canada, coming out of WWII, had the 3rd largest Navy in the West, IIRC.
Everyone recognizes the land of the Arctic Archipelago as Canadian Territory the question is whether straits which are greater than 24 nautical miles wide are Canadian internal waters (using a baseline theory) or whether those portions over 12 nautical miles from land are international waters, also further are there therefore transit passage rights. This typically boils down to whether one has a "blue water" or "brown water" navy. The U.S., U.K., Russia, France, etc. . . support international waters and transit passage. Canada on the other hand does not.
Well put! A large measure of the problem is that when you have a small force to start with, when ships develop problems or age unexpectedly rapidly, there is nothing to take up the slack.
(by the way you are correct in your statement).
Interesting but I'd like to see an example of what happens elsewhere in the world with straits of similar size.
Your best comparison would be the Strait of Malacca (the Straits of Singapore at its east end being less than 24 nautical miles wide are clearly territorial) Also Indonesia.
Do you know specifically what happens there with respect to jurisdictional disputes? Wouldn't archipelagos accord different rules?
Most states assert a right of transit passage through the Straits of Singapore.
Of course this can also be done by treaty such as in the case of the Bosphorus and Darda.
Maybe I'm mistaken but was there not a major contract awarded approx a year ago to build several Ice breakers for just this purpose ? Can't remember how many or when there supposed to come on line though.
In this case, I think it's important to understand HOW Canada actually uses it's navy these days. Canada's Navy will survive relatively easily AND fulfill their mission simply because the role they play in modern conflicts and national defense is generally a supply chain and communications/surveillance role, not a direct intervention role. The ships they have now can easily be adapted to continue to live up their obligations. How quickly they can be adapted will depend on available $ from your fed. Waiting 5-7 years for replacement destroyers and a polar-class icebreaker for the Coast Guard won't likely cause the fall of democracy unless you really believe Putin is planning a serious attack sometime soon on Canada's artic sovereignty?
CCGS John G. Diefenbaker currently scheduled to join the canadian fleet in 2021.
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