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Shooting Outside HOLBloor!

TheNiteHwk

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<Quote>"Two men were gunned down outside the strip club House of Lancaster, near Bloor St. and Lansdowne Ave. Paramedics rushed the victims to St. Michael’s Hospital – one man shot twice in the chest died of his wounds moments later, while the second man sustained non-life-threatening injuries"<Quote>

http://www.pulse24.com/News/Top_Story/20050505-002/page.asp


Just caught a quick mention of this on BT this morning. Not much details yet. Was anybody there? Any more details?
 

TheNiteHwk

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harleycharley said:
very very sad.... it doesnt surprise me though. i always found the area around that club a little frightening at night....
It is and has been a well known crack and SW area for years. I was just wondering though if the shooting was a 'street' related thing that just happened outside of the club or did it start inside the club. Just curious.
 

Keebler Elf

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Aug 31, 2001
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The police questioned everyone inside the club, so I don't think it's unrealistic to assume the shooter/shootee were inside at some point prior to the altercation.
 

Body Opus

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Jun 4, 2004
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TheNiteHwk said:
It is and has been a well known crack and SW area for years. I was just wondering though if the shooting was a 'street' related thing that just happened outside of the club or did it start inside the club. Just curious.
Where do you think the Dealers hang out.. 1/2 the business inside the club the other 1/2 outside.
Get use to this people...
I wonder what was the description of the people involved.
Let me guess: Male Black (gangbanger)19-25 yrs of age bla, bla, bla, bla, bla

Note: This is my own opinion, in no way meant to insult the hard working law abiding citizens in the black community. These people are not part of that community, they are an insult, but, until somebody does somthing about it, we will see this shit happen alot more often. It might be you sitting in perv row who gets in the crossfire. THINK ABOUT IT !!
 

TheNiteHwk

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Crack addicts don't go into SCs to buy their drugs. Powder (nose candy) users do... but for the most part the crack users keep their biz outside to doorways and back ally ways. And the SWs would not be very welcome nor would they want to go into SCs either. Maybe some dealers may be hanging out in there... but I doubt very much they are doing biz inside the club.
 

Questor

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Body Opus said:
I wonder what was the description of the people involved.
Let me guess: Male Black (gangbanger)19-25 yrs of age bla, bla, bla, bla, bla

Note: This is my own opinion, in no way meant to insult the hard working law abiding citizens in the black community. These people are not part of that community, they are an insult, but, until somebody does somthing about it, we will see this shit happen alot more often. It might be you sitting in perv row who gets in the crossfire. THINK ABOUT IT !!
Well, its nice of you not to tar and feather the entire race. So what does race have to do with it anyway? Are you saying that white people, latinos or orientals do not deal in coke or get involved in shoot outs?
 

Body Opus

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Questor said:
Well, its nice of you not to tar and feather the entire race. So what does race have to do with it anyway? Are you saying that white people, latinos or orientals do not deal in coke or get involved in shoot outs?
Stop defending the un-defendible...
I gave a description of the PERP's...Check the news...am I right ?
Why would I tar and feather my own race. :eek:
Stop playing the race card "BRO" and play the reality card.
The only people who would defend this shit are the people dealing, hang arounds, gun dealers, and the end drug users.
 

impala77

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Jan 18, 2003
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Regardless of the description of the assailants, it is still pretty scary for any patron of the club. It is stories like this that make me reconsider which clubs I will go to. It is also a reminder to all of us to be aware of what is going on around us.
 

strange1

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Mar 14, 2004
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From what the news says, they were looking for this guy for weeks, this being the third attempt, with two others being shot along the way. Outside HOL is just where they caught up with him.
 

Questor

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Body Opus said:
I wonder what was the description of the people involved.
Let me guess: Male Black (gangbanger)19-25 yrs of age bla, bla, bla, bla, bla
Body Opus said:
Stop defending the un-defendible...
I gave a description of the PERP's...Check the news...am I right ?
Why would I tar and feather my own race. :eek:
Stop playing the race card "BRO" and play the reality card.
The only people who would defend this shit are the people dealing, hang arounds, gun dealers, and the end drug users.
Body Opus it seems to me it was you who used the race card. I do not defend drug dealers, gangs or murderers. I defend ethnic and racial communities from ignorant generalizations. The reality is that violent crime does happen in this city. Pointing the finger at one race or another does not help the situation. If you are indeed black as you claim, I suppose that entitles you certain liberties, but I am still going to call you on it.

You are clearly implying that I am either a gun dealer or a drug dealer. This is just plain silly and blows what little credibility you had after making such a gross generalization. Please stop sending me hostile private messages accusing me of calling you a racist. If I were to call you anything, it would stressed out and perhaps misguided. Your earlier remarks were closer to tasteless and unnecessary than they were to racist. You may very well be tired of how black people are portrayed in the media. Perhaps it is by pointing to their race and then condemning them that you can, in your own mind, distance yourself from their actions. Maybe I would do the same in your situation, I don't know. But with all due respect, I am not your bro' so please don't call me that. If you must call me something, you can address me as Mr. Q.
 

Fatume

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Mar 6, 2005
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I have to agree with Body Opus on this one. The truth hurts, but it is still the truth. Problem is too many people can't handle the truth and as a result they point to the issue of race profiling.
 

TheNiteHwk

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Well a few more facts now at least. Looks like a revenge killing. Maybe this will be the end of the chain for this one.

As far as a few comments surrounding race questions... I will only say this. I am not racist. Although some I'm sure will want to say my comment sounds racist. So be it. Facts are facts. As a former addict and street person myself I only say I defy any white, yellow, red or any other to go down to Bloor, Queen, Eglinton... where ever and try to deal crack and/or guns and see what happens to you. The blacks rule the streets. Most of us are wise enough to realize the few who are involved in this activity are not anywhere near the majority of all blacks in general. Sadly that stigma sticks at times for some. Not all nor even close to a majority of blacks are crack dealers and drug dealers. Most are good God fearing, hard working etc. Sadly though most if not almost all (at street level) crack dealers, pimps, gun dealers, shootings are. I don’t think it hurts us or them be aware of this. And it is not racist (IMO) to voice these facts out loud. In fact maybe just the opposite. It could even be helpful.
 

Body Opus

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Questor said:
I am not your bro' so please don't call me that. If you must call me something, you can address me as Mr. Q-Bert.
You got that right !!
I'll call you Mr. Fishbowl...On the OUTSIDE always lookin in...

TheNiteHwk : I could not of said it any better.
Nuff Said !!
 

Keebler Elf

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After learning more about this punk, I shed not a single tear for his death. As far as I'm concerned, it's a win-win situation in that the punk is dead and now the police can go lock up the shooter as well. Time to take out the trash... ;)
 

Questor

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Fatume said:
I have to agree with Body Opus on this one. The truth hurts, but it is still the truth. Problem is too many people can't handle the truth and as a result they point to the issue of race profiling.
Thank you for your input on this important issue. I think you make a very good point. The term racial profiling refers to the police policy of targeting certain racial groups for harassment. For example, the police look for any kind of excuse to pull over a young black person driving an expensive car so they can question them. This policy may bag them the ocassional arrest, usually for petty offenses, but it also serves to harass a large number of innocent law abiding citizens, perhaps like our acquaintance, Mr. Opus, if he happens to drive a nice car. I do not support this policy.

Night Hawk and Mr. Opus are quite right in identifying the black community as a community that has more than its fair share of law breakers. This is an undeniable reality and I expect they both have more first hand experience with that than I do. What I was reacting to was the way in which Mr. Opus came out with his accusation. If you want to have a serious discussion about problems of oppressed minorities in this city, obstacles faced by black youth in our society, and possible remedies for this problem of ours, I think that can be constructive and helpful. For example, what kind of community services are available in well known trouble areas like Jane/Keele or Malvern in Scarborough compared to Forest Hill or Rosedale? What kind of programs can be started to address the serious problems that exist in these neighbourhoods? What is the cause of violence and crime in these communities? Is it because black people live there? And how do we all benefit by addressing these problems together?

On the other hand, blaming and accusations just create an atmosphere of fear and loathing. Hey, how many times do you hear people talking about the latest $5 million fraud or embezzlement case....."I wonder what was the description of the people involved.
Let me guess: White male, middle aged (gangbanger) bla, bla, bla, bla, bla"

Well, such a comment would be more funny than offensive, and of course, it would be reality, just like the black gangs who according to Night Hawk control the drug trade in the streets. But the white community is not an oppressed minority, so the comment does not have the same potential to damage and hurt. And really race doesn't have much to do with it. Those middle aged white guys are just in the best position to pull off a heist like that.

My apologies to all for this long response. It is a complex issue that can not be addressed in a one liner. Also, apologies to Body Opus if I have antagonized him. I said that you may be misguided, but really I don't know enough about you to understand your point of view or your motives. But I do find it objectionable when people blame ethnic or racial communities for the problems that we have created and share as a society. That seems like scapgoating to me, even if it isn't racist.
 

Quest4Less

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May 25, 2002
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One thing that always bothers the heck out of me is that whenever these types of incidents happen they almost always share some common things:

No matter when or where they happen when the police interview people they get the same response - "I didn't see nothing".... or worse "fu*k you pig!".

People have got to learn that if the violence is to stop then cooperation with the authorities is the way to go. Speak the truth, bear witness against the thugs. Be part of the solution, not part of the problem.
 

phogNphriction

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May 29, 2004
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1. Sw are everywhere in that neighbourhood- the last sweep netted
over 100 charges- sws and Johns combined- LE does these sweeps 2-3
times a year.

2. Coke is everywhere in that neighbourhood. Inside, outside, in
residences, businesses, the street. Crack and powder are both
easily available.

3. There are easily as many hispanic gang members as 'black' gangs
in this area, probably more. That being said, race and ethnicity
are next to irrelevant- gangbangers are never representative of
the communities they come from.

4. Someone posted some months back, complaining that they were
asked by security to remove a hooded winter jacket and wondering
why they were singled out. I suggested that there was a concern over
concealed weapons in this area (can't remember if the post was about
HOL or Paradise). Anyway, this is what I was referring to...

5. This was absolutely not random and should not have any
consequences for your 'average patron' of a SC.

6. Statistically, groups of Black males between the ages of 15-30
are sought as suspects in the vast majority of violent crimes,
especially sexual assaults and robberies, as well as crimes involving
firearms. Now, I'm not sure what you want to make of that, but
that is the statistical reality.

Agreeing with Keebler, this one is Win-Win.
 

rama putri

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Sep 6, 2004
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Questor said:
What I was reacting to was the way in which Mr. Opus came out with his accusation.
You over reacted.

But I do find it objectionable when people blame ethnic or racial communities for the problems that we have created and share as a society. That seems like scapgoating to me, even if it isn't racist.
He didn't. Read his post again. Where did the 'we created...' come from?
 
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